C7 certainly won't be faster than the C6Z. C6z was a massive upgrade over a C6 compared to the C5z over the C5....what I'm saying is Making a car as "fast" as a C5z is easier than making a base car as fast as a C6Z, your talking about a car that went 10's bone stock and 9s with bolt ons.

The C5z is my fav car of all time, so don't take that as a diss or anything. I think the C7 will be 85% of the C6Z.

If you want to judge the Corvette on its routine then the C7 is a gem, since it has a nicer interior and get better MPG. Track performance matters for routine work only for race cars. 0-60 and quarter miles don't even belong in the same sentence as routine.

Some of us do. Autobann at night :rock::rock::rock::rock: !

]No the c7 z51 will not be faster than the c6 z06....

It's been said earlier the leap from c5 to c5 z06 was relatively minor...(like 5 grand)

The leap from c6 to c6 z06 was quite a bit larger....

It would be unwise to expect the c7 z51 to bridge that performance gap at 54 grand...base price

The c7 will be an amazing vehicle for sure. ....just not that far a leap at almost half the recent full tilt z06 msrp...or at least 30 grand differential msrp to msrp....

(for my friend Joe and true...

[QUOTE=JerriVette;1583756590]I agree... it will close the gap but not entirely.

If you knew anything about anything you would know I have wanted a wider tire like I now have. Not a big fan of 285s on the rear!

I will be very interested in how wide someone can go on the C7 platform with after market wheels/tires.

I too want to go a little wider and will buy a set of HRE's that are as wide as the C7 can accomodate. IMO, there are both performance and aesthetic benefits. Time will tell when the wheel companies can get actual cars to begin to design their wheels.

Thank you Justin! I cant believe how long I have argued this around here.

The Z06 is an amazing car and I expect the C7 version to be even better.

I asked RC to ask them this at the bash, not sure if he did.

RC spoke about it in his other thread

Thanks

Yackity Yack
 

I didn't buy this rag for the stories> 21 pages and no C7 pictures.
Where are the pictures??? It's always nice to see Corvettes with no orange peel. The paint on the black C7 in the video looked magnificent!
For the record more weight means the car works 'harder'. Tires engine transmission, everything works harder.
Should have made the thing the size of a C4 instead of catering to ever bigger owners.

1996 Corvette curb weight:

Curb weight (coupe) 3298 (convertible) 3360

progress?
 

Exactly and with old engineering you got those weight numbers. Apply modern C7 engineering to a car with the same footprint as a C4 and you would see further weight losses.

C4 dimensions
L: 176.2
W: 70.7
H: 46.3
WB: 96.2

C7 dimensions
L: 176.9
W: 73.9
H: 48.8
WB: 106.7

Not much of difference except for width and wheelbase.

Maybe not.

If it is important that it is faster than a '06 Z06, you probably don't care anyway. If it is faster than a '13 Z06, you will be in a big hurry to order one.:D

3" narrower, 2.5 inches shorter, and ten inches shorter on wheelbase.

That's pretty significant as far as interior dimensions go. :thumbs:

If you overlook that the C4 also was 178.5" in length and 73.1 inches in width for it's performance model.

RC, question about AFM: does the heavier torque tube only dampen vibrations or does it dampen harmonics that would otherwise be dangerous aka like the V6 driveshaft in the Mustang exploding at 130mph. Is the heavier tube for safety or luxury?

While we are at it, was there any talk about active engine mounts?

What about the crate engine, will it have AFM? Is the block longer from flywheel to crank snout than the LS series due to VVT or oil pump configuration?

Is the DI pump louder than standard injection through the additional intake manifold sound dampening?

Frankly, it's the push button ebrake and ELSD that bugs me the most. Does it bug me enough to buy an outdated model? Not sure. Performance wise, the Z51 C7 is close enough to C6 Z06 that I don't really care. It's really only important for forum talk. The C7 has much better potential for weight loss than the C6 GS.

What items would you remove or replace on the C7 to lose weight, and how much weight would that remove and at what cost?

I'd go after the usual suspects. Heater, Airconditioning, stereo/sat nav, interior door panels, carpet and sound insulation, if I'm feelin really crazy that day the passenger seat too :rock:
Car is likely going to perpetually exist at 1/2 a tank of fuel anyway so there's some weight off the ole curb weight too.

http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s...ps1d7af877.jpg
Steel tube - aluminum tube 15.4lbs
AFM exhaust valves delete 5.5lbs
Seat with power recliner - manual adjusted Recaro 17.2lbs
Older powerterrain:
TR 7speed - TR 6speed 11lbs
LT1 gen 5 - LS7 35.2lbs
Dual mass clutch replaced with Z06 13.2lbs

That's 100lbs right there. It should bring the C7 to 2013 C6 Z06 weight. There are engine swap guys out there who would pay big $$ to have the first LT1 Gen 5 swap. They would pay enough to finance buying all the Z06 parts new and you'd have warranty on them.

In the end you'll have a C7 with the best OEM NA performance, lighter and more powerful.

I am wanting the 1/4 mile performance numbers.

Some folks routinely track their cars. I don't know anyone in the US that routinely does 180 MPH on city streets & is still alive or not in jail. :rofl:

GM is the one that said revolutionary. :hide:

If it can't compete w/the C6Z, my next Vette will, most likely, be a C6Z. if it can, I'll consider the C7 if I can get over the rear after seeing it in person. By the time I am back in the market for anothe Vette the C7Z should be out so who knows.

As a percentage of time spent in car that 1/4 mile pass is infinitely small. However, this talk is out of my league. I never really understood 1/4 mile racing. To be good at it you have to sacrifice streetability and track ability. I look at a professional drag car and it has nothing on there that I like, not the transmission, not the small front tires, not the engine that lives 10 seconds a few times. And if you are to race for the quarter in a stock car...why? You know what it can do from a magazine, you can even shift through 4th on a desert road somewhere.

Someone is going to come up and say that drag racing is competitive. Ok, pissing games can get competitive too. I understand the charm of building a car for the 1/4 event but not driving it, and that's all people tend to do.

I live for the 1/4 in my cars, used then sport bike for the road course. I just started doing HPDE's last year. I like it but will never get the 1/4 out of my blood :D

Did this to my little Fox body Mustang Coupe....stupid light weight!

I told you guys recently that the current weight of the car is 3318. See post # 22.

http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c7-g...t-of-a-c7.html

They are giving the 3298 number because that is what they are trying for. So far it does not look like it will happen. :ack:

I did that to my very first car, my 85 camaro (so I had 2 seats in the back that just HAD to go too). By the time I was done removing components, I couldn't pick up the heavy duty polymer vinyl boxes I stored the parts in. :D

Needless to say, it was a significant jump in performance.

Well, yes and no.
I've drag raced my C6 LS2 (bolt ons only, no internal engine work or power adders) in both side by side competitive index/bracket racing (where the faster car does not necessarily always win); as well as just going out there and shooting for the absolute lowest ETs and highest trap speeds that the car could generate on that day/night.
Yes I did put drag radial tires on the back and skinnies on the front but I still ALWAYS drove it to and from the track (up to 170+ miles round trip, still totally 'streetable' even on highway entrance/exit ramps) and my engine DID in fact live long after I'd made my multiple high 10 second passes as well. ;)
My car's 10.7@127.5mph ET puts it at #2 on the Corvette Forum's (non Z06/non ZR1) C6 bolt ons only 1/4 mile performance list (for both LS2s and LS3s) which is of course nationwide (maybe even worldwide?)...so there is some fun and notoriety to be had drag racing one's street Corvette. :steering:





Well, again that's not entirely true.
There are stock 1/4 mile lists on most of the various car message forums so people do care about that stuff and when I got my new C6 back in the day it was a goal of mine to climb to the top of the ones here on CF.
And I did.
After 6 1/2 years my C6's 1/4 mile ET (12.21@115.45mph) is still THE quickest bone stock LS2 ever recorded.
And you cannot go by the magazines to get an accurate idea of what the car is capable of, they give an average at best.
The magazines and (and even Chevrolet themselves) claimed that my car is capable of only a 12.6 or 12.7 1/4 mile ET, so many of us see that as a challenge to beat and it prompts/motivates us to hit the track in search of better times. :)

But I also understand that drag racing isn't for everyone, especially in such an all around capable and awesome road car such as a late model Corvette. :yesnod:

I get your point and don't totally disagree. But the answer to the question, "why?" Because it's cheap and fun. It is the one time where you can spend an evening experiencing the raw acceleration of the car without worrying about traffic, rocks, or cops. The skill learned is how to launch and acclerate the car as efficiently and quickly as possible. There far more dragways than roadcourses across this country. The roadcourse events can range in the hundreds of dollars to participate and are somewhat formal, compared to the local test and tune night at the dragstrip. For about $20 bucks, you get to hang out w/ fellow car folks, see some really nice rides, and even see a pro dragster or two.

The sport of drag racing is fascinating to me. It's more of a builder's sport than a driver's sport IMO, but there is a definite skill level involved to drive. Just once I'd like to experience a top fuel run, 0-300+ MPH in under 4 seconds, that's gotta be a kick in the pants. Not to mention those pro's can tear down and rebuild the entire motor in about 45 minutes. Wow!

If you were to seek the quickest stock 1/4 wouldn't it be wise to pick the track more than anything? I would go for something with low altitude, cold climate, perhaps where they apply some sticky coating on the track. Second would be car prepping, shaving tires, ice on the intake. The human element is like 1% of the equation.

So, what you're saying is that I have a C7 that has been modified into a Z06 in my garage. And has been for the past 5 years and 25,000 miles. And my modified C7(which in reality is a 2009 C6 Z06) is still 23 pounds lighter at 3175 lbs than your modified new C7 at 3198 lbs vs 3298 lbs stock(more like 75-100 lbs lighter if your new C7 is a Z51 doing the mods you listed.

I can replace my hood with CF one and save a few pounds and then replace my huge wheels tires with C7 narrower/lighter wheels/tires and save a few pounds more, and add a lighter seat(as you did) and save a few pounds more. I bet that adds up to some 50 pounds I can knock off my car in one afternoon, in the driveway.

Steel tube was talked about a lot between me and this one engineer who worked a lot on it.

Steel was necessary for two reasons. It was necessary to dampen the vibration that occurs when afm is activated and deactivated. It was also necessary, in order to achieve the driveline stiffness/strength they needed.


DI pump is louder, of course, but no comparisons were made.

They wouldnt answer crate questions...they said, "ask us about the 2014 corvette"

The e brake button is debatable, but the ELSD is all good things...why would you not want a diff that reacts to the driving condition...nothing but good comes from it.

All the items you listed wont happen man...cmon now.

Torque tube I explained. Only way would be some other material...aluminum is out.

7 spd and AFM...there are standards man....the car has to meet fuel mileage requirements...avoid gas guzzler tax, etc!

Seats...sure


My list of weight shedding is:

Thinner glass like c5z
Return of ti exhaust from c5 z
Lighter seats/interior components (a lot of weight savings here)
All carbon body
Alternative materials for some small components
Smaller gas tank
No removable top
Carbon for things like cooling shrouds, valve covers, various plastic parts,etc

I could shave tons of weight...its all a matter of cost, bottom line, etc. balance weight reduction with hp/tq/power delivery and you will have a fast ass car...

I find this humorous. On the Sport Bike forums they complain about the stupid crazy corvette drivers.

I'm in both camps so I'm neutral...:lol:

Well, take your Z06 out and ask people if they believe it to be a C7. There is that whole bit about interior and exterior changes, steering feel, aero etc.

I was comparing base to base... Z51 C7 vs. GS C6.

Losing weight by removing amenities turns street car into race car = no good. Might as well buy a steel tube race car. Losing weight through dry carbon panels is a minimal weight loss and easily doubles the price of the car.

Losing weight by using the lighter more capable Z06 powerterrain is cost effective, effective and dropping pounds, and increases power.

Sbc...buddy...help ME help YOU....put on your thinkin cap bro...your KILLIN ME SMALLS!

#1 the zr1 ran 7:19 at nurburgring...does that mean we shouldnt make the frame stiffer? Does that mean we shouldnt make the control arms stiffer? I mean, its already so capable, why bother? Cmon now. The tq tube silidified the driveline, cancelled out harmonics, etc and likely will be enduring a lot more tq in the near future

#2. Please explain your doubts from a "fun" perspective? We can put 185mm snow tires on a zr1 and do burnouts from 160mph for great fun...doesnt really make sense from a function perspective.

#3. Your "formula" takes the backwards. Carbs are pretty light...hey lets do that!

#4. Its been well documented that corvette developed a new process making carbon panels from waste materials. This is. How the new carbon hoods are standard on c7, etc.

Additionally, as has been the case for decades, the door skin on corvettes dont provide the active side impact protection, the frame rails and door beams do. Corvette is a space frame design...

My weight loss criteria didnt lose amenities. The SRT method of gutting out their car then convincing buyers "our cars are just mean and raw" like its a good thing is just pulling the wool over the eyes. Thats the cheap easy way to speed...gut all the **** out. I'm sorry, I'm not paying for a new Corvette without a/c...kiss my ass.

#1 So we should go back to a steel frame then. And if the car somehow turns out to be faster at the Ring, so what? Can't I enjoy a more fun car on the road that is less fast on the ring? I think we all do.

#2 Yes! You get it.

#3 ?

I'm with you that exotic materials can shade weight. No one will disagree with you there. But I don't believe these savings are much at all on a C7.

Ditching the fuel saving features for a lighter Corvette and a motor tuned for NA performance would be my strategy for how a base C7 can be improved. I'm sticking to it.

Remember, cars CAN be fun:

The thing that people never think about is how well super stripped down vettes would they sell at a dealership? The number would be something like .5% of all vettes sold (that may be too high). I just dont see the point in doing it since the aftermarket already does a really good job of taking care of this.

That is one of the most fun ideas anyone has ever had, and a great video.
Thank you for posting. :thumbs:

As much as I LOVE AWD for my daily driver and hope for an AWD option for future daily driven Corvettes, inducing oversteer is the best thing about owning a weekend driver Corvette. :thumbs: