Archaea

Yeah, I apparently have no backbone. I made up my mind and changed it.....This is more or less a repost - BUT WITH A DIFFERENT INTAKE SETUP I need a different set of cam recomendations....You guys remember my thread here.... ....

http://forums.corvetteforum.com/show....php?t=1537419

Well, I stumbled upon a good deal from a veteran on the board in the F/S section for a superram, runners and eddlebrok base. Accel Superram Plenum & runner kit (billet lid) and TPI Edelbrock base

http://forums.corvetteforum.com/show....php?t=1536504

Judging by months of people saying I'd be happier with a different intake for a 383 ----I purchased it --- So no longer am I retaining the stock TPI. You only live once right? I'll prolly never build up another car in my life like this so let's do it right!

Keep in mind for this cam recomendation that this car will see the track maybe once or twice a year for FUN - not competition, and it's primary role will be a daily driver in the warm season. I don't mind a bit of lope in the idle, but I want the car to handle Kansas City rush hour traffic without dying or running too rough at idle, and I don't want a constant tuner.

My car is a 1990 Corvette L98 coupe with a manual ZF six speed transmission.

Mods:
4.10 gears, (I say this because at 70mph on the HWY in sixth gear my tach reads 2100-2200RPM with stock wheel size---from what I read on another site this means 4.10 -since I bought the car used from a dealership I don't know how to confirm this outside of this tach/mph comparison)
Hedman Elite Headers,
True Dual 2.25 inch Exhaust with Borla XR-1 mufflers
Steel Single Mass Flywheel, and Spec Stage 2 clutch.

I'm having a 383 Engine built with the specs below. I sent the vendor (http://www.precisionengine.com/) my 113 heads which he is porting. Precision Engine seems to be a great shop so far, I'm dealing with Ken and he's been patient with my questions, and is after a partnership on this build process to make sure I'm happy with it.

Specs are below.


 GM 5.7 block bored, honed, decked and align honed
 Durabond cam bearings
 Matching roller lifters and springs
 New sir steel rods 5.7”
 New cast steel 3.75” stroke
 Crankshaft micro-polished less than a 12 ra finish- (Eagle or Adept)
 Speedpro pistons with Molly rings
o 10 to 1 compression ratio
 Balanced rotating assembly
 New Melling timing set
 New high volume oil pump
 New gasket set
 New push rods
 New head bolts
 Customer’s aluminum cylinder heads will include the 2.02/1.60 valves
 120 lbs. springs
 3 angle seats
 Bronze guides
 Positive seals
 1.6 roller rockers
 Ported intake and exhaust runners
 Internally Balanced


It would seem from what I've read that the superram is well mated to the LPE219 cam? Is this 383 build still best suited to an LPE 219 cam?
What about an equivalent cam if the vendor can't get the LPE219? What RPM range does the Superram like to be mated with?

The vendor has a lot of exp. with this cam and has been happy with it in the past...
 Performance roller camshaft:
o 224/232 @ .050
o .501 lift
o 112 lobe center

What do you think about this cam with the 383/superram?


I would like one final sound off of help from this board in helping make this engine as strong, fun, and reliable as it can be for my daily driver application. I should note that the car will be running on 91 or 92 octane gas because that is the highest available in my area.

One last request---If you don't know what you are talking about please don't post(just read and learn with me), because it's hard to distinguish on the internet, who is speaking from exp, and who is rattling off unknowns.

Thanks for your patience and help in ensuring I get this right and am happy with my purchase!


Please post any CorvetteFevor, CarCraft, or other tech magazine/website type articles or links you have references to for this kind of 383/superram build up. Additional information would be awesome and I would love to read the links.

One last thing....What should this combination be good for in regards to HP/TRQ?

sami85L98

Since u have a 4.10 gears, i would recommend duration of cam 22x/23x and choose lift as much as possible and lobe separation not less than 112.

Or u can go with Lpe 219 well proven and tested for both street and strip including me.

I have a 3.54 gears and pretty much DD well i do have another car too, live 5 miles from downtown atlanta, and travel 40 miles trip to work, out of 40 miles 15 miles are stop n go traffic, i drive without any problem just like other cars with little more power. With 3.54 gears this car holds 16 psi of steady vaccum and never had a problem of rear end and drive like a toyota camry until u step on it than this car asks for good rubbers. My car with 3.54 gears at 80 mph, rpm stays at 2700 so probably for u with 4.10 gears rpm will be more than 3k at 80 mph. I still gets 300 miles out of full tank gas in a street/highway driving that includes over 100 mph a few times. Hope this helps. sami

Here are couple of video clips:
at strip: http://media.putfile.com/Drag-race-Commerce-Ga-

at street/highway: http://media.putfile.com/134-mph-speed-video

At idle: http://media.putfile.com/383-219-cam...th-LT--headers

Good luck.

vader86

yes its still suited to the 219 cam, just look up the specs on the cam and if Comp doesnt have one on the shelf like it then they'll grind it for you

it tends to prefer a midrange camshaft, i think the other cam would want to go a bit higher in powerband but its not a terrible choice

450ish HP is my conservative guess, depends on how much the heads will flow for it and how much they were ported particularly.

Corvette0096

I would get a hold of Corkvette and see what he has to say. He has some fast combo's out there.

rklessdriver

I think the 224/232 cam is not a horrid choice, but IMO it is a bit big for the Super Ram and your heads. The cam will want peak Hp/Tq about 850-1000 rpm too high compared to the Super Rams Hp/Tq peak. But it won't hurt you (actually you probally won't notice the TQ loss in low end and midrange) that bad because you have such steep gears. Now if you ported the crap out of the heads, and the Super Ram it would work together very very well.
As is (I've seen the intake you bought and the base is just lightly cleaned up a bit IMO and the limited port work your heads are getting)you are much better off with something in the Accell/LPE 219 range.
Will

88BlackZ-51

ricky rich. hows the car running? have you been doing any racing this year?

Corvette0096

No racing this year. next year if i decide to fix me small leak in my head gasket. Time has been limited for me.

88BlackZ-51

head gasket eh. didnt know you had that problem? say. any of your bud's running 406 SR's?

black_89_vette

That being said, I'd suggest different heads on your new motor. Sell yours, save the money you'd spend on porting and grab a set of 195 cc heads from companies like TFS and AFR. Lots of heads on other forums as well as our own for sale.

Archaea

Different heads aren't going to happen for expense concerns...I am already spending more than I intended.

So sounds like I'll try for the LPE219 cam...if I can't get that one I'll try to go for a comp cam that is somewhere between the 219 cam and the one the vendor likes(as those characteristics may be suited for a higher RPM band than what I'll need from what I'm reading)....

If there are more recommendations or insights let me know! Thanks!

USAsOnlyWay

I would tell you another cam if I knew one. Actually, it would be in my motor. But I don't confidently know of one.

JAKE

Camshaft selection isn't necessarily set in stone. They're easier enough to swap out.

When younger I treated cams like I did women. When it/she didn't meet my expectations, I dumped it/her and got another. When I found one that did, I hung on with both hands.

Come to think of it, changing cams is easier than changing women. The women tended not to want to let go while the camshaft couldn't have cared less.

Jake

Red Tornado

Jake, spoken like a true Veteran of the Psychic Wars

Archaea

Vader posted this to me in PM...I'm putting it out here so the vendor can see the reply to this thread...thanks vader

Yes that is a great price on the SR and its good that its been taped and clearanced.

The Edelbrock base is fine, compared to a TPiS BigMouth the only difference is port matching, but its not restrictive out-of-the-box. (and BigMouth=Accel base) I would go ahead and port match it to whatever heads you use and make sure its matched to the SR Runners. This technically should be done anyway for a 383. It'll probably take 30lb injectors, but speak with a chip tuner before purchase. (do not buy accel injectors)

For Superram I'd pick the LPE 219, but the vendor suggested cam wouldn't be too bad.

I haven't dealt with the vendor before but the only thing that stands out is the HV oil pump, I dont like them too much.

If you race the car in a road race, then the RPM you pull can cause it to suck the stock pan dry.

I'd rather have a High Pressure Melling than the High Volume, M-55A, but you dont even need that. You could get away with just a regular Melling pump.

Archaea

Tim sent me this PM....again putting it here for the vendor to read.

Hi, Tim Gould here

I don't know if I can be much help for you darn it, my motor is a 421 CID from a 400 block so it'll be apples and oranges on a lot of stuff. I've never built a 383, but I read your post..........Good you are going to a superram! The TPI systems we have on our cars are just woefully inadequate from a performance standpoint whether they're ported/big mouth tubes or whatever. As far as your cam is concerned, I'd need to take a look at the flowsheet on your heads and have an idea what the intake is going to flow before I could suggest anything. I asolutely do not like 110 LSA though it makes your idle way too erratic for a driver and you may end up having to jack it off idling thru parking lots or in stop and go traffic.

If I was building a daily driver (and I did, but I mean a 383 L98 like yours) there would be no question what I'd do:
I'd shoot for 10.6ish static compression with some real good heads, use an LPE219, and a Superram. As an example, my car will idle thru a parking lot all day with no lope, it gets over 30 mpg at 70mph, and it pulled over 500RWTQ on the dyno. Torque monsters are an absolute blast to drive on the street! Keep me posted on what you're gonna do, building new motors is a real exciting thing

Archaea

Oh guys - this is great news...

I just found this link

http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/7610/dyno.htm

There is an engine dynoed in the above link that will nearly be identical to my build, which uses the LPE219 cam and the numbers are better than I thought!

I copied the piece here

383 Cubic Inches: L98 motor

Lingenfelter 383, from his book- Modifying Small Block Chevy Engines.

350 block .030 over

Cast 400 crank

Production 5.565" 400 rods

Sealed power forged pistons

Lingenfelter hydraulic roller cam: 219/219 @ .050, .525/.525 lift. 112deg lobe sep, Comp Cams 1.6 ratio stainless steel rocker arms.

Ported aluminum 'Vette heads with 2.00/1.56" valves.

SuperRam intake, base, and 58mm throttle body.

1-3/4" headers were used for the test.

RPM TQ HP
1600 363 110
2000 375 143
2500 411 196
3000 424 242
3500 466 310
4000 476 362
4500 481 412
5000 458 436
5250 446 442
5500 416 435
6000 372 425

tequilaboy

I'm happy with my Comp 503, 224/230 duration 112 lsa. This is on a 350 with have stock 113 heads, 1.5 roller rockers and LT4 valvesprings.

I have a 4+3 with 3.73 gears. My first gear overal ratio is slighly lower numerically than a 6 speed with 4.10s.

2.88 * 3.73 = 10.74 vs. 2.68 * 4.10 = 10.99.

With this combination, low speed torque is not a problem. It will launch cleanly with no bog above 1600 rpm, and will spin my old nitto drag radials or current 555 RIIs a little as it comes on the cam around 2500 rpm until I shift into 2nd. I sometimes get a big chirp in 2nd when I get back on the gas, even with a slow clutch engagement.

Last dyno was around 335 rw torque @ 3500 rpm and 272 rwhp @ 5200 rpm.

It works well now, and should work even better with better heads some day. I'm glad I didn't choose anything smaller. Idles good with a little lope at 800 rpm, and it will idle down to 700 rpm if necessary.

On a 383, I would consider something a little bigger duration wise, since the torque/hp vs. rpm characteristics will shift down about 400 rpm, due to the increased piston speed with the 383. The 383 should also make even more torque. Check out the cam used in the 10 times the torque super tpi shootout, if you haven't see this already.

http://compcams.com/Community/Articl...?ID=1737510521

I think the stock heads will limit your power somewhere in the 275-300 rwhp range.

A bigger cam should make for more overrev power after the hp peak that you're gonna need with the 4.10s at speeds over 100 mph in 4th gear.

It seems like the guys with smaller cams like what they have, and the guys with bigger cams like what they have too.

Realistically, anything between 218 and a solid roller 242 something should be ok.

Here's a dyno pull from last summer with a rich conservative tune.

JAKE

ROFL

JAKE

Archaea

Ken, the engine designer called me back and said he was talking with his engine production manager and they both just felt I should stay with a tried and true cam they have and often use on their 383s.

He said I would be really happy with it and they felt more comortable with it.

He restated the cam specs he strongly advised using, which were the cam specs of the original build, -----

The specs are 222/232 @50, 114 lobe center and about 479 and 501 lift.


Does everyone think this is okay? I told him I wanted to go with the LPE 219 because that was the cookie cutter cam that everyone suggested. He stated that he thought I would be better off with this cam for my purposes, and that the higher 232 exhaust number would give me a bit more torque and better match his engine.

This is taking so long because I changed the plans on him mid game and sent him the superram intake from forum member nucking futs....I also asked him not ship it to me till early december because I will be out of state for the next 2.5 weeks.

Comments on this cam? Will this make more HP/less HP, more torque/less torque? What is the difference between this cam and the LPE219? Will it be noticible/beneficial/detremential/neutral?

Pete K

I like those specs. 219 is a good cam. I run it in my 383. I regret not putting a dual pattern cam in it.
I assume the lift figures are with 1.5 rockers? If so, I would use 1.6
In my opinion, 114 lobe is good, but you would like 112 better.
The 222 at .050 will change the rpm band ever so slightly, but not enough to matter or be concerned. The difference between 219 and 222 is almost non existant. I like 232 exhaust duration @ .050. Most street cars are limited on the exhaust. This will be a plus.