TTop Tony

Anybody know of any good websites or info on actually swapping a roller cam into a pre 87 small block? I was kicking the idea around of using a ZZ4 hot cam when I go to alum heads. I saw some threads in search on big blocks but not on small blocks. Any info is appreciated.

zwede

Smallblock is the same as big-block. You need a cam with pressed on cast iron distributor gear, retro lifters, cam button, shorter pushrods, special fuel pump rod if you're using mech pump and valve springs rated for the lift of the roller and about 120lbs closed, 320-350 lbs open pressure. It will go into float a little over 6000 rpm, 6500 if you're lucky. Spec the cam accordingly.

TTop Tony

Well that doesn't sound too bad. I'm already using a distributor from a zz4 motor. I didn't know about the fuel pump rod though. I guess i can buy the springs along with the cam. I don't think I need to rev past 6,000 anyway but I didn't know float was a problem.

LiveandLetDrive

Why is float a problem?

zwede

Valve float is particularly bad on hydraulic rollers. Reason is the lifters weigh significantly more than regular hydraulic lifters. You can only increase spring pressure so much before you have problems with bleed-down. The limit for hydraulic lifters is about 350lbs max. You can get a few hundred more rpms out of them with bee-hive springs, titanium retainers etc that reduce weight at the valve but I doubt you'll make 7000 rpm no matter what you do on a hydroller.

Fevre

:iagree: If you want to rev above 6000 rpm's get a solid roller. There is a rev kit you can buy to allow rpm's up above 6000 but to me it makes better sense to go with a solid roller, they are a little cheaper for the solid retro lifters too.

TTop Tony

I don't usually rev past 5800 anyway I thought about a solid roller but I'm not sure a (which) solid roller would pass emissions.

TTop Tony

Zwede
How many miles do you have on your big block roller cam engine? Do you still use it daily? I see by your website that you used all comp cam components. Did you have any problems with the retro lifters?

PatsLs1vette

tony i have comp cams retro rollers in my 73 small block with a zz4 cam and so far knock on wood they are ok.A few people on here have had trouble with there comp cams lifters.

TTop Tony

patsnitrovette
Your setup is almost exactly what i was looking for (except the tuned port injection part). I did read those posts but I thought they were for big blocks (not sure if there is a difference). Do you have a write up or link that you used to go by for your install? What springs did you use? Did you have any issues? What HP do you think your pulling?

PatsLs1vette

There were a few smallblock guys that had trouble with there rollers.I had no issues setting mine up, im using the zz4 valve springs,comp cams hardened shorter pushrods,crane needle bearing cam button,and the zz4 roller cam and the comp cams retro roller lifters..I dont turn it up alot of rpm because its tuned port injection but its been to 5300 or so.Horsepower i dont know really.


[Modified by patsnitrovette, 4:02 PM 4/5/2004]

TTop Tony

Thanks patsnitrovette

Fevre

I have run crane retro rollers with a crane roller cam that has a pressed on iron dist gear so you can use a stock dist without having to change the gear.

PatsLs1vette

Like fevre said i forgot i did have one issue with my dist. gear.I had to swap to a 89 trans am dist. gear,i wore the 87 trans am dist. gear i had on mine right out.

TTop Tony

By the responses it sounds like the swap while a bit expense is doable then.

zwede

I have over 30k miles on the setup. I had one problem but it was my fault. The BB lifters have a right and a wrong way on the install. The link bar has a step in it as intake and exhaust lifters point in different directions. It is possible to install the lifters with the bar upside down. This will cause the rollers to be ~30 degrees crooked to the cam lobe. I drove like that for maybe 10k miles before I noticed it. I only installed one lifter pair wrong. The cam lobes were damaged and the lifters, but no catastrophic failure. I had to get a new cam and one lifter pair. Installed it correctly this time and have put another 20k miles on it with no problems.

If you have an engine that you keep under 6k rpm I feel a hydroller is by far the best setup.

BTW, yes, it is still a daily driver.

Fevre

Hardest part is getting the cam in without nicking up the bearings and then setting the end play. Think the range is .002 to .006.

TTop Tony

Zwede
Thats good to here I wondered if the retro lifters could go in wrong. I do keep it under 6,000 so I might give it a shot
Fevre
I figured endplay would be an issue for an ametuer like me. I'm sure if and when I get closer to the install I'll post on how that is done.
Thanks for all the great info.

dman535

I had bad luck with a comp cams roller setup. Granted the car ran like a raped ape, but one of the tie bars let loose and caused the cams to fail.

TTop Tony

Yuck I can imagine you were pretty pissed. I have seen a few threads on comp rollers. I might try crane's version and I think edelbrock makes them too.