Wendell Allen

I'd noticed a slight squeek and sometimes a rubbing noise over the past few months out of the rear of the car. Then, after using the car as my daily driver for the past ten days, yesterday the noises went away. And after pulling in the driveway after work yesterday, I noticed the right rear tire is leaning in. I called a friend about it, and he said it's probably the bearings.

I'll probably get a rebuilt trailing arm and bearing assembly, but I don't know that I can do it by this weekend. So I have another question regarding longevity.

I've been instrumental in putting together a group of Vettes to run in a benefit poker run this weekend along with a bunch of Harleys. Because I've really worked hard on this, I do NOT want to be Vetteless, but I don't think I can get my car fixed by this weekend. So I'm wondering - if the tire just started leaning yesterday, do you think it'll make the fifty to on hundred miles this run will probably require? If it completely fails on the road, what can I expect?

I don't wanna tear my car up, but I don't wanna back out of this now if I can possibly help it. Any advice at all would be helpful.

Cheers!
W

Willis

First you need to figure out for sure if it's the wheel bearing or not. Jack up that wheel and try to wiggle the tire up/down left/right. If there is excessive slop then it probably is the wheel bearing.

If you end up not getting to it, I would say that 150 miles wouldn't kill it, but the longer you wait the worse it will get and you could damage other parts.

I did the wheel bearings in my 81 and it wasn't too difficult of a job, of course that was after I had done two other sets of them in my father-in-law's 68 and 72, and I had his lift to help out.

He purchased some rear wheel bearing tools from eckler's and they really helped. (Spindle Knocker, wheel bearing installation tool, rear wheel bearing greaser, and a bearing setup tool) If nothing else, get the setup tool, it helps determine what size shim to install before assembling the spindle. (which presses together with the installation tool and doesn't like to come apart again without ruining the bearing).

Good luck.


[Modified by Willis, 12:51 PM 3/31/2004]

GTR1999

It is possible to get it on the road by the weekend,but you need to know where the problem is. I would not drive the car 150 after a rear wheel kicked in. Jack it up,check the play in the wheel while someone looks under the car.
The wheel alignment is held ,(in a stock setup), by the T arm and strut rod. The 1/2 shaft drives the spindle. Look closely at these areas then let us know what you find.
Gary

Wendell Allen

OK guys, here's what I found.

Right side, with tire on and car jacked up, rocks ever so slightly. Just enough to "click", but almost not visible to the eye. Remember, this is the side that the tire is leaning on. The left side has an even more noticable clicking, and is a little easier to see the wheel's motion. But it's not leaning at all.

Strut rod bushings seem to be pooching around the edges of the strut rod, but I don't see any deflection in them as I lower the car to the ground.

Trailing arm busings are another matter. On the right side (again, the side that leans), I can take a pry bar and slide the trailing arm back and forth on the busing a solid half to three quarters of an inch with almost no effort. I can't see any bushing rubber on the sides of the trailing arm either.

On the left side of the car, I can't hardly move the trailing arm back and forth but maybe an eighth of an inch, and there's bushing rubber showing around the trailing arm.

So could it be the trailing arm bushing that's letting the tire lean in? It's not leaning in enough to cause the tire to rub against the body work at all. Just maybe five to seven degrees or so. And if this is the cause of the lean, what all is involved in replacing them? Are they pressed in? Geez, I sure hate to remove the whole thing from the car just to press one bushing in if I can avoid it.

kenko74

"I can take a pry bar and slide the trailing arm back and forth on the bushing a solid half to three quarters of an inch with almost no effort" :shocked:

This is a good time to assess a best case - worst case scenario. The T-arm needs to be solid, you may develop an uncontrollable rear wheel wobble at any speed, which could result in the T-arm breaking free and spinning--I've seen pictures of Vette's where this happened. The entire rear quarter panel quickly gets shredded into thousands of pieces, gas tank ruptures, uncontrollable car--is this risk worth it?

I just finished a complete rear end rebuild this winter with Vansteel. The disassembly of the drive shaft, differential, and trailing arm assemblies is a one day job, and Vansteel will mail you custom cartons to ship everything to them. All corvettes need this service every 25-30 years--sounds like now is the time?


[Modified by kenko74, 10:58 AM 3/31/2004]

norvalwilhelm

There should be shims wedged in on both sides of the trailing arm bushing to prevent it from moving back and forth. These shims are used for alignment and you can not see the bushing past these shims.
The chance of them falling out is slim because unless you replaced them recently with stainless they normally form a solid rust pack.
A new bushing without the shims would move sideways until the shims are packed in.
The shims are jammed into place then the through bolt is tightened to keep them in place.
A long cotter pin also goes through the end of the shims to lock them in place.

turtlevette

you've got to be kidding. some people really like scaring the crap out of people here.

Wendell, Go ahead and take your car to the cruise and have fun. People here are too conservative and think your car has to be perfect to leave the driveway.

That much bearing play is acceptable especially for a 50 - 100 mile drive. And I have been driving mine with that much trailing arm bushing side play for about a year now. Waiting for a warm day to add some shims.

Take it for a short drive get it on the highway for a few miles then immediately stop somewhere without using the brakes very hard (stopping hard will put heat in the spindle) and pull the center cap and put your finger on the spindle. If its uncomfortably hot to touch you have a bearing problem that needs to be dealt with now. It its cool or just luke warm, go on your cruise.

If its marginal, get AAA gold and go. They will tow you up to 100 miles as part of the normal service.




[Modified by turtlevette, 7:30 PM 3/31/2004]

Brown78

Just went through the same thing last week on the forum. It's a :nono: :nono: :nono: to even think about driven out of the drive way. Let alone 50 miles. I was lucky, Thought it was the T- arm but it was only the outboard side U-joint on the right half shaft. Fixed it in 2.5 hrs. Put the rear up on 2 jack stands. With a bottle or floor jack under the shock mount. lift up the tire enough to take weight off the bearings and u-joints. Then move the tire in, out, up, down. If you find a lot of movement. Go under the car and see where the movement is coming from. Your friends will understand, once you explain what happen. And if they don't they are not real friends. Go on this Pocker Run in a truck, bike, your wife's car. JUST DO IT!!!!! :seeya Steve

Brown78

Gary it that you???? Helping another rear wheel rubbing guy this week. Hope he is as lucky as I was. :seeya Steve

Wrecked82

I can tell you it will fail suddenly. Had both sides fail suddenly at different times. The left side failed the worst and it was hard to control the car at a 35 mph speed. I would hate for it to have failed at speed. Right one failed about 3 months later but not as dramatically. I would NOT drive the car fast or that far. Let us know if you do, AND, if you made the trip. I vote no in advance.

NHvette

It's still not clear what the problem is. It does not sound like bearings.
As Norval noted, it seems there are no trailing arm shims. If this is the only
issue, just take it to a front end shop and have some shims installed.
While he's under there, have the other components looked at.
:seeya

turtlevette

bump,

don't leave us hanging. inquring minds want to know.

Wendell Allen

Here's what I found out so far. First, not everyone who aligns cars knows how to do sharks. Firestone proved this to me.

I put new tires on the car about four or five months ago, and took the car in to this same store to get it aligned. When I got it back, it was still making a strange noise out of the rear, as if something was intermittently rubbing against the tire. But I couldn't see any marks on them. It was also making a faint clunking sound when I went over sharp bumps, like in and out of the driveway.

Fast forward to my tire lean last week, and some local people said it sounded like a bearing. Upon closer examination, it doesn't seem like bearings, so last Thursday I take it back into that same Firestone to put another alignment on it. I offered the service writer the factory instructions on how to align it, and he declines, saying the tech has all that information. I do, however, force an exploded view of the rear suspension, and ask him to pay very close attention to the shims, based on my correspondence with you guys.

The service writer calls me later and tells me that they can't break the bolt loose that holds the trailing arm and shims on, and also says that the nut appears to be welded to the bolt. So I decide I'm just gonna take it home, eye ball the camber to get through the run, and take it to someone this week who knows what the heck they're doing.

So I get home, put the car in the air, grab a flashlight and some wrenches, and start examining things. To my surprise, the factory shims are in fact on both sides. However, there's still all that play in the passengers side. The cotter pin appears to have been played with on that side, cuz there's no road grime on it. However, the bolt/nut don't appear to have EVER been touched. The road grime between the nut, bolt, and frame is thick and I have to scrape it off with a screwdriver. And as I expected, the nut was NOT welded to the bolt, and came right off with minimal effort. So I put it back on and steam over being lied to for a little while.

I then go to loosen the strut bolt so I can at least put the camber on the same side of the planet a where it should be. And the nut on the camber adjustment deal comes loose with only about half a pound of pressure on the wrench.

So not only did these monkeys not even try to align my car this time, but they didn't do it properly last time either. I know this cuz the toe's all out of whack.

One of my buddies here brought up a good point. With the toe not right, combined with a loose strud adjustment bolt, the bad toe angle could have pulled the camber out of alignment.

What to do? Two things. First, contact Firestone directly about this since it's a company store. I e-mailed them with a very lengthy explanation Friday. They called, but I missed it so I'll be returning their call today. Secondly, I'll take the car to someone who I know has experience with aligning these cars.

The bearings aren't making any noise, so I'm going to let that rest for now while I finish getting the A/C ready. It's starting to heat up here in Houston, and cold air is a priority.

Thanks everyone for your input. I wouldn't have known what to look for without your advice.

turtlevette

were you able to take it to the poker run?

Wendell Allen

You bet we went on the run in it! And what beautiful weather for it. We only got rained on for about five minutes. And we took it out yesterday to a Vette show sponsored by the Sam Houston Corvette Club as well. With t-tops off, I've got a pretty good sunburn on my forehead now!

Also, as a side note, the intermittent tire rubbing noise is still coming from the rear. I have a strong belief that it's the tires working against each other as the toe changes under the various driving conditions. I'll let you know if it goes away after I have the car proplerly aligned later this week.

NHvette

Cool.
Good assesment on your part.
"If you want something done right ..."

So, since all your shims seem to be there, it sounds like a bushing.
OK - the most miserable bushing to get out, but relatively cheap to fix
compared to rear bearings.

Good luck gettin' her out.
My 75 TA pivot bolts were like "NO WAY". They are still in the frame.
The 70 chassis that I bought slid right out.

:seeya