ImBatman

Got the pistons and installed correctly this time and checked all the rod and piston clearences. Everything was well within spec and the assembly rotated smooth without any binding. Today I installed the cam shaft and chain. This I figured would be an easy job with no hassles, Not!!!! :mad I fully lubbed the cam with the provided molly lube and started sliding it into the block. Cleared the first bearing good second ok as well, third still going fine. 4th dead stop!!!! :mad I had to put pressure on the end to push it through to the rear bearing it was very tight. Anyway I got it in and went to turn it. How tight should this thing be w\out lifters and everything. From what I remember about small blocks I should be able to just spin it with my fingers correct.. Any way I went ahead and bolted up the timing chain and spub the crank\cam via the balancer bolt. Everything spins smoothly but the tightness of the cam worries me.. Ideas????? :confused:

turtlevette

i thought you were supposed to be able to spin the crank with one finger but not the cam.

When i installed a new cam in my small block i had to attach the gear and use a rag to turn it...

very tight.

neverendingproject

that would worry me too. i think i would have to pull it back out and check the clearances.. easy to do w/ a simple set of calipers from the bottom.. if the pistons and rods weren't already in there. :(

ImBatman

When I installed the crank with out the rods you could spin it with your finger. For the cam I had to do the same thing and use a rag over the timing gear to spin it. God I my machine shop didn't screw this up. :banghead: I still have every desire to buid my motors myself and definately am not the type to throw in the towel and pay someone for something that I can do and have done in the past. But with this particular project it seems like I have had a never ending list of issues. Sorry didn't mean to start :cry , :cuss and :nopity

Wade

ML67

The cam should spin smoothly. I had a similar issue recently building my 548" -- got it back from the machine shop for an .030" bore increase & new cam bearings. The cam did not go in easily, and would not turn without excessive force. Thinking the cam may not be straight, I removed it and installed it backwards (thanks to Jim Moore aka 427Hotrod) but it hung up on the same cam bearing. Called the machine shop and the owner came to my house w/ dial bore gages and it seemed to check out OK, but he agreed it wasn't right. He took the engine back, replaced the cam bearings, returned the engine to my house w/ apologies. The cam spun easily, as it should.

This is the type of machine shop you want to do business with. Unfortunately mistakes happen, but the real measure is how mistakes are handled.

I suspect you have a nicked or incorrectly installed cam bearing. You may want tp install the cam backwards to see if it is the cam, but I suspect its the bearings.

Good luck w/ your project.

Take care,

Mark

Gordonm

Wow. That is good service. I agree, all the motors I have put together the cam has spun freely. There is no reason the cam should be tight.

ImBatman

I removed the cam this morning and inspected the journals and lobes. Everything was fine. I recleaned the bearing and went over the suspect bearing LIGHTLY with some emery cloth on one shiny spot I found. Recleaned with trannie fluid re lubed with assembly lube and stuck the cam back in. Spins freely now without excessive force :hurray: I know some of you are now going to refer to me as Bubba instead of Blackrat but hey it worked and I don't see where I would have done any damage by doing this. here are some new pics of the motor.

PatsLs1vette

This is why i install all my own cam bearings myself,i had few come back in the early years from the machine shop that werent right.So i do it myself .

70BBvert

Glad you got it worked out. As others have said - both should spin freely. Just so you know for next time - its much easier to install the cam first with the engine upside down. That way you can use two hands on the cam. :thumbs:
Then install the crank, timing chain, pistons.

Jim

ImBatman

Thanks Jim, I definately agree the cam should have gone in first.

Wade

Double Aught

Hmm, BubbaRat; no. BlackBubba, errr, no. BubbaBlackRat, ahhh, not quite. Think we'll stick with BlackRat. :thumbs:
However, you do live in North Carolina!!! :eek: :eek:
:jester

ImBatman

:lolg: I knew it was coming. :D

W

Twin_Turbo

Isn't this whole cam bearing problem deal related to the new cam bearings being from an aluminum based alloy instead of the previous babbitt (tin and lead alloy). the drawback is that the aluminium alloy is less forgiving towards machining tolerances where the more ductile babbitt will be more forgiving

ImBatman

Sorry that question is way over my head. I inspected the bearing for straightness in the cam bore and it was file. I did mic it compared to the others and it matched all the rest. I was almost wandering if maybe I put to much lube on the cam and that was what was causing it to stick. The reason for thinking this is because once I got it spinning it was free and spun with minimal effort however if I stopped and then tried to start again it was like it was sticking. :confused: I got the idea for sanding the bearing a little from a guy on Club Hot Rod Forums. I figured worse case scenatio would be I had to replace the bearing. It seems to be fine now. I am still about 3 months from bolting the heads up and at least 6 from starting the engine.

Has anyone else experienced something like this?


Wade

norvalwilhelm

It wouldn't suprise me if it had just been assembly lube on the bearing causing the drag. When I put rear wheel bearing together and do the end play check the bearings turn over easy. Once grease is used along with the oil seal the bearing almost seems seized for the first few miles then loosens up nicely. It was probably just the lube.
Are you going to degree the cam?? Not because I would suspect it is out of specs but just for your piece of mind? I have never found one out but I have installed it wrong and the degree check found that out.
I always degree every cam I install just to make sure the chain and sprockets are right. I have more faith in the cam grinder then I do in anyone else.
If you decide to give degreeing a try you just need a degree wheel and a dial indicator and magnetic base.
I could do a post on how to degree a cam if you were interested?

ImBatman

Norval, Ohhhh just you wait. :D I do plan on degreeing the cam which will be a first for me. If you think I scared you with rod\piston assembly just imagine the kinda questions I am going to come up with then. :smash: :lolg:
I installed the cam straight up but I have been very thorough at checking everything else so I figure I will give degreeing a a try.

Thanks

Wade

norvalwilhelm

BlackRat you did scare me with the rod installation but you are really trying. YOu did pull it apart a redo/check. As for the cam degreeing is good practice. So you are going to degree but do you know how?????

verskel

Nice pics.......is that block painted purple ? ...or is it just the lighting. :skep:

There's a cam upgrade in my near future so I'll just watch you struggle and learn a thing or two ! :lolg: :lurk:

ImBatman

Norval,
Yes and no. Yes I am going to a no I have no idea but am the type person that will keep on till I get it right. Be prepared for the questions. :D

verskel,
Nope it is not the lighting. The block and oil pan are purple. The heads, intake, TC cover, VC's and pulleys will all be aluminum. I wanted something that would jump out when I opened the hood and wouldn't get swallowed up in a black car with a black engine bay. If you keep following my update parts you should learn everything that you will need to know because I am constantly asking questions. :smash: :yesnod:

Thanks
Wade