Surfer69

Well I usually have loved these units in the past but this morning engine shut down on hiway and tow cost $85. :mad Wasnt smart enough to carry set of points with me so another 25 bucks. Back on the road.:D

I have to be fair an say it was my fault. I heard of a warning that says dont leave ignition on more than a minute or it could fry unit. Well last night working on stereo I forgot and had key forward instead of backward for 5 minutes. Realized it and thought maybe warning wasnt true.... but it is.

Maybe points arent that bad after all. Lesson learned. :thumbs:

Matt Gruber

points will burn up too.
only if they are between open and closed.
I carry spare points but have not needed to use them. pertronix works great :yesnod:

Mike Ward

I've never understood the fascination with the pertronix unit- doesn't work any better than a well set up set of points, but offers MUCH worse reliability.

The only supposed advantage is that you don't need to set the dwell angle. Big farquing deal. I'd rather adjust my points once a year in my nice warm dry garage (with a beer nearby) at MY convenience, than be stuck trying to re-install a set of points on the side of the road .


:rant:

Easy Rider

Was that a Lobe Sensor or the newer Ignitor II type Pertronix unit that failed?

Surfer69

It was the regular lobe sensor version not the red ignitor 2. Label says Ignitor LS, black unit. It may just have gone out after 1 year of use too, not positive.

Matt Gruber

my #1181 had a 30 month warranty.
maybe you can get a free replacement :cheers:

Alwyn678

Pertronix sux....I had not one but two bad units..........My Mallory Dual point distributor with tacdh drive was a great alternative for me

PRNDL

That is the key phrase, (emphasis added above). I think very often people are comparing pertronix to poorly adjusted points, so they see a big improvement. I installed pertronix and the only noticeable difference was that I could idle at much lower rpm (down to about 500) which I didnt want to do, just noticed that I could. After a year of trouble free operation the pertronix failed suddenly and with no warning. Lars recommended points (with part number) which I carefully installed, and set, and set timing, and I was surprised how well the engine ran after that. Certainly started much faster - almost "instant on" :) MJ

Matt Gruber

Points are great for anyone having trouble.
i've 3 cars, a total of 29 years without any problems with electronic conversions.
i keep points in a plastic bag so they won't rust, someday i may need them. :cheers:

yellow 72

Best setup I've run is the one I have now, Accel dual point tach drive, a 6AL triggering a n Accel super coil...electronic conversion? I keep it in a plastic bag in case I may ever need it :rolleyes:

Mike :cheers:

'69CoupeDude

One thing about points, they'll work no matter how low the voltage is since they're just a mechanical switch. The PerTronix stuff requires a minimum amount of voltage for the electronics to work properly.

Here's some info from Pertronix tech people:

With a standard Ignitor and lobe sensor Ignitor, if you leave the key in the "on" position without the engine running and the engine happened to stop in the position corresponding to points closed, the Ignitor will continue to try to charge the coil. Since the coil isn't discharging heat will build up and you can damage both the Ignitor and the coil. The newer Ignitor II has a built-in shut off feature which will automatically shut down the system if the key is left on without the engine running.

The most common reason for the Ignitors to fail is if they are used with the wrong coil. The standard Ignitors for 8 cylinder engines require a 1.5 ohm coil circuit, the Ignitor II can go with as low as a 0.6 ohm coil. Some people try to run a low resistance MSD Blaster 2 coil with a standard Ignitor and they burn out the Ignitor.

The Ignitor electonics circuit is grounded through its mount plate which screws to the distributor breaker plate. If you have a bad ground between the breaker plate and battery -, this will result in less voltage to the Ignitor. So, the ground strap in the distributor, the electrical path between the distributor housing and the intake (through hold-down clamp) and the ground cable from the block to battery - terminal must not have any appreciable electrical resistance (corrosion, paint, loose screws, etc.) or you'll lose voltage to the Ignitor.

If you buy an old car, it's a good idea to check over the wiring harness. Many Bubbas get creative with car wiring.

77-C3 & 89-C4

If you don't mine not having the Tach. drive Then the GM HEI is the only way to go. I have never had one fail in 20 years od driving various GM cars/trucks

AlwaysWave

Hmmmm.....I'll have to investigate that. I've been running that way since March 98. :confused:

Tomi72

Me too, since -99...

'69CoupeDude

Let me clarify the point about the MSD Blaster 2 coils with an Ignitor. The Ignitor requires a 1.5 ohm coil circuit. Now some of the aftermaket coils come with ballast resistors to get the total of the coil and resistor up to 1.5 ohms. This would be okay for the Ignitor. In fact, even if you run points you want this much resistance or you'll burn up points rather quickly. GM wire harnesses typically have two wires which bring power to the + side of the coil. One brings a full 12 volts when the key is turned to the start position to get a little extra spark to the plugs during cranking. As soon as the key is released back to the "on" position the 12 V wire is cut off (electrically speaking) and the power comes through a resistor wire. This drops the voltage to the coil by about 3-4 volts. The purpose was to increase points life. A lot of backyard mechanics eliminated this resistor wire thinking they'd get more spark to the plugs, which they did till the points got fried in short order.

If you are running with the resistor wire, that's what is saving your Ignitor with the low resistance aftermarket coil. However, if your engine doesn't get a lot of running and you have to crank it for several seconds each time to get it started, during that time you are running a full 12 V to the coil and therefore running more current through the Ignitor than it's designed for. This could reduce it's life.

You can eliminate the resistor wire with an Ignitor as long as you run a 1.5 ohm coil circuit in an 8 cylinder engine. The combination of a low resistance coil (with no ballast resistor) with the full 12 volts at cranking, or, even worse, a low resistance coil with the resistor wire removed is what can cause an Ignitor to fail prematurely.

Surfer69

That's interesting because I had full 12 volts to coil (ignitor high op flamethrower), and removed resistor wire. Someone had ballast resistor hooked up with points before but I removed it after talking with Lars who said dont need ballast and resistor together.

But Im wondering even though they say to hook up 12v continuous did that prematurely fry this thing or was it leaving the key on for 5 minutes?


[Modified by Surfer69, 8:18 AM 9/15/2003]

Matt Gruber

i just double checked my #1181 installation.
3 years ago i checked the resistance with my RS VOM Accel 140001 coil was .5 ohm
ballast was .8 ohm, total 1.3 or slightly below the minimum.
Now with my new HF VOM, 1.1 coil, 1.2 ballast! WTF? now it's 2.3 total.
So i check the ohm meter with the leads crossed, and it reads .4 ohm :eek:
So it really is 1.5 or perfect.(or is it?)
See my point? even if you know what you are doing, it's hard to measure low ohms.
That's why my current advice is if YOU have trouble with a conversion, you are not alone, and points may be best for YOU.
Electronics is not that easy to get right for a novice, and even my meters disagree :D

Flareside

Add me to the list of Pertronix victims. In retrospect, the lobe sensor system is just a bad idea that I didn't think through before installing. Most of the other electronic conversions/distributors (HEI, MSD, Unilite, etc.) out there have a magnetic or optical element that generates a very strong signal for the device to read. The lobe sensor has to accurately detect the slight variations in a magnetic field caused by the tiny little bumps meant to open a set of points. It's a wonder that it ever works at all!

Matt Gruber

:iagree: The LS is made for those scared to death of pulling out the dist. and doing a proper installation. The whole idea comes straight from Mickey Mouse :rolleyes:
That's why i always state i use #1181.