norvalwilhelm

This is my 8th spring change over the years. I finally broke down and went for the 460 springs. I have played alot with factory springs for the 454 air conditioned cars, Monty Carlo springs and they fit with shortening but the diameter is right. The last set were 280 pound Morosso springs.
I was getting too much lift at high speed and by 130-140 I felt the car was taking off.
Last night I ran a rough road with dips and grooves at 100 mph. I installed the springs tonight and will retest the same road tomorrow. It also has a real humped bridge so the car gets pretty light then comes down hard in the dip on the far side. This really shows up bump steer. I can take it at 100 now ok. Wait until tomorrow with the new springs to test it.
Since I have done it so much I know the tricks. Taking my time, cleaning all parts as they come off and reinstalling takes about 45 minutes per side but it is easy work.
You do not need a spring compressor. I do have 2 3 ton jacks making life easier.
I use one jack in the center to raise both wheels about 6 inches in the air. I did loosen both wheels before jacking.
I remove both shocks right away, remove the sway bar end linkage and only the one wheel on the side I am doing.
I loosen the upper ball joint nut and back it off until there is a good gap then give it a good wack with a hammer on the nut protected top. With the spring pressure pulling down it pops easily.
I remove the caliper and hang it from a piece of wire. I leave the rotor on with 2 nuts since I have shims under the rotor for turing it up ealier..
I also take the castle nut off the outer tie rod joint and replace the nut with a 3/8th fine nut to protect the threads and give it a good wack with a steel hammer and it pops out, remove the nut and let the outer tie rod hang down.
Now place the jack under the spring, jack it up to take a little wieght and remove the nut off the upper ball joint.
Stand at the front on the handle of the jack and slowly lower the jack, the spindle falls outwards and the A arm comes down releasing the spring slowly. There is no sudden jumping of the spring , just a gentle falling out. You do not need to chain anything.
With the 460 springs they are so short they fit right in the A arm pocket, push the top hard towards the center of the car and it pops in it's pocket. Rejack the A arm up, connect the upper ball joint and replace the parts,
I forgot I also remove the rubber pumper to make removeing the old spring easier.
Hope I didn't forget anything.
It is not a hard job, and other then having a good jack or in my case 2 good jacks, no special tools , it is not hard.
About jacks. A 2.5 ton jack is not in the same class as a 3 ton. The 3 ton jacks are bout $100CDN or $60 american. Every shop should have 2. I have 4 altogether plus about 6 more various jacks so it make life easy working underneath.
At leasty buy 2 of the large 3 ton jacks. One for jacking and the other for safety and steadying the lift.
I will do the testing tomorrow.

ZD75blue

Had me going till the section in bold...

Good luck Norval! :cheers:

Jughead

Aren't you running a blown BB?? I'm curious to see how the 460 springs work out. If good then I might not switch mine. :cheers:

69 N.O.X. RATT

Norval: I think you could go to the 550's and be happy. I have them on mine and I like the way the front end feels. I am going to cut mine a little so they sit a little lower.

PatsLs1vette

i never use spring compressors either just a jack and a 3 foot pry bar.Let us know how the 460 's are.

norvalwilhelm

I am really worried about ride quality. I don't want to feel the dime on the road. I am also worried about ground clearnance and with the 460's I lost another inch over the morosso 280's. The car is done, on the ground and waiting for a test drive. I am dreading it. I now measure 26.5 inches to the fender lip and I haven't moved the car so it will settle more. The 550's are lower still.
If I have to get something taller I will use Monty Carlo springs. They are the same as our's only longer so they can be cut to any length. They also have a good joice of spring rates.
I think George run into a problem with 550's being too low and required a spacer under the spring.
Anyway I am posting another story about car thieves in a new topic.

Matt Gruber

i got those rubber spacers, i think they were $5.95 for 2.
But, i did NOT use them.
Good Luck!

norvalwilhelm

I am heading down to the shop now to remove the 460 springs. The car sits 1.5 inches lower then the 280 pound morosso's and the oil pan is almost dragging on the ground.
I also did a no no. I installed a new set of pads on one side only. The car pulls like crazy the first few stops.
Anyone want a cheap pair of 460 springs hardly used. :) :)

Matt Gruber

you motivated me norval,
i'm going to add the RUB-A-RiDE spacer this week.
my problem is the chin spoiler could hit those parking lot stops. sometimes i park, and look, and i'm only 1/8" from it. :eek:
spacer is good for 1" to 1 3/8" depending how it is installed. I'm not sure if the ride height is in direct proportion or not. :cheers: thanks for the instructions.

norvalwilhelm

Putting the long travel soft morosso springs back in is alot harder then removing them or installing the shorter 460 springs. I needed to use the spring compressor to reinstall the morosso's. I am just taking a break now to have something to eat then go back out and finish the job.
I am not a fan of spacer. I would rather get the right spring. I have changed my springs 9 times now including reinstalling the Morosso's. I should be getting good at it. I have to remove them again this winter for the bump steer modifications.

The Money Pit

When I get my Vette back Monday I'll measure the fender lip and let you know what it is with the 550's. Granted it's stiff,but never bottoms out,and I'm not the type that uses my brakes for much of anything.
My front end is still stock,except the poly bushings and VB 550 springs,and I've only hit the oilpan once due to an over enthusiastic rail road crossing.Took to being airborn on that one!

norvalwilhelm

I completed the swap back to the Morosso 280 pound spring, did the test drive again and like them alot more then the #460 pound springs. My lip to ground measurement is 27 3/8th. I like the little extra ground clearance plus after carefully setting my alignment it was totally off with the #460 springs and 26 1/4 lip to ground stance.
I will try to return the springs and stick with my Morosso's. It was about a 6 hour round trip today. Old springs out, new ones in, new ones out , old ones in.

69 N.O.X. RATT

That shows the difference in our cars, with the 550's mine is still a little to high.

1969Vette383

I believe I have the stock springs for a 1969 car. I just ordered the 550# front coils from Eckler's. Maybe I should take a measurement with these springs before I install the new ones to see if I + or - ride height? Anyone know what the stock rating for front and rear (9 leaf) springs are?

norvalwilhelm

I beleive 280 pounds is stock for the front springs and 140 is production stock for the rear.

Frank75

Norval, I don't know about big-blocks, but I thought stock spring rate was 300 #/in. for small-blocks. I thought it would have been higher. Have you considered a VB&P alternative front-end? More money but more adjustability I believe.

Matt Gruber

Norval
here is a quote from 1-94 circle track mag
"it is important that front and rear frequencies are not the same. equal front and rear frequencies can create a pitching ocillation over bumps"
Do i understand this NO! but this is why i suggest you go for a ride in a car with the F41 suspension.
Good luck.
Changing the front only may create a mis-match that is worse than changing all.

zwede

Depends on what kind of spacer... The disk-like rubber spacers that go between the spring and lower control arm are fine. They are actually used on virtually all production cars nowadays to decrease noise and vibration. The cheapo spacers that go in-between individual coil windings are junk. I have a 1/2" rubber insulator under my springs and like them.

BTW, stock big-block front springs are 282 lbs/inch.


[Modified by zwede, 11:43 AM 7/6/2003]

Ganey

Some complain about pitching or bouncing w/ VB ft. & rear.

No problems w/ VB rear only.

A/C spacers were used by the factory on C3s. You should try spacers before going back to the softer springs.

norvalwilhelm

One of my first jobs monday morning will be to check the spring rate on the 460 pound springs. I don't trust them. The 280 pound morosso's which I of coarse have checked have the same wire diameter, the same outside dimensions and about 3 inches longer then the 460 springs. It looks like the 460 springs I got are just cut down stock springs and that would not change the ratio that much.
When I took the car off the stands it was about 1 1/2 inches lower then with the long travel morosso springs. That turned me off immediately.
Also the alignment of the car was way out so it would involve another alignment session.
I put the morosso's back in and now I am satisfied that I tried another set.
I have had 8 springs changes in the car over the years.