BeaterShark

I've been having oil consumption problems with my motor since day 1. In my last experiment, I ran it to 5K+ RPM at least 2 or 3 times every time I drove it and I put in a 10w30 oil instead of the other 10w40 or 20w50. Well, my consumption went up from 1 qt per 600 - 800 miles to over 1 1/2 qt at 600 miles. I pulled the intake and verified that there are NO sealing problems between the intake and head. I think I've come to the conclusion that it's the rings.
Here is a thread I had about my leakdown test and everything I've already done: http://forums.corvetteforum.com/zerothread?id=484783

The one thing I had not previously mentioned is that when I first started the motor, my carb (Q-Jet) had been sitting for a while and the power piston was stuck up. It ran real rich until I figured out the problem. It was blowing black smoke out at a steady 2000 RPM and wouldn't run < 1500 RPM. I didn't think much of it at the time, but I read somewhere that running a new engine rich will not allow for the rings to seat.

So, now I've got the intake off and it is plain nasty:

The heads are about to come off and I'm seriously thinking about re-ringing the motor. It shouldn't have too much wear as it's only got about 15k miles on the block.


What are the odds that a re-ring will fix (or greatly reduce) my oil consumption problem?

Anybody have in advice, especially with respect to honing and the pattern needed.


[Modified by BeaterShark, 8:39 AM 2/17/2003]

The Money Pit

I find it hard to believe the rings would not seal after 15,000 miles.Are they moly?They tend to take longer to seat than cast.Oil in the intake would indicate port mismatch or the PCV sucking oil.I had that problem with the short valve covers I was running.They had a baffle,but still the oil snuck by.
Were you seeing smoke puffing out of the PCV gromet in the valve cover when the engine was running?That would indicate blow by,and rings.

bence13_33

The Money Pit:
Actually it's the other way around. Cast rings take longer to seat in than Moly rings. In fact in most instances Moly rings seat in upon cam break-in. Cast rings usually take the full 1,000-1,500 miles to seat in.

Fevre

Might also check your valve steam seals. Lighter weight oil will get by any leaks into the cyl so I would expect your oil consumption to increase with light wt oil.

V8yunkie

Did you notice that there is oil in the intake runners of your cylinder heads?

It is not supposed to be there and there are just two possibilities where it can come from: Either the intake valve stem (worn valve guides, worn seals if equipped) or the manifold gasket. There is no other way.

So I would check that first before dealing with the piston rings. BTW... the oil control-rings that actually remove (most) the oil do not seat a lot - so they normally work from day one (if they are OK). The two compression rings do.

BeaterShark

Yes, I do see some smoke in oil fill hole, but I don't know what is excessive. It's not the PCV as I ran with a breather in each vc with no change.

I changed the stem seals twice: once when I put it all together (teflon) and again when trying to fix the consumption (rubber).

They are moly rings and should have seated on first run. They may have seated improperly due to fuel washing the cylinders???

There is NO visible smoke. At night when I get on it, I can see some smoke in the headlights of the cars behind me, but I believe it to be more caused by fuel as I'm still running a little rich (from plug reading).

Tominator

Well I'm pretty sure it's not your rings, if it was your rings causing the oil consumtion then there would be white smoke and lots of it. I know this from experience, I had to have my truck engine rebuilt because the rings were bad.

Just idling white smoke would pour out of it, it looks like a car that was warming up on a cold day only it would be smoke. Plus your spark plugs would be getting fouled a lot.

Not sure if this has been asked, but is there oil puddles under your car? Or if you drive it and park it some where does it leak then?

Also a few other tricks to help cut down on leaking is straight weight oil, like 30W.

Twin_Turbo

How did you verify this? I see oil in the intake ports in your pic. So, either you have bad stemseals, pcv sucking in oil or there is a leak between the head and the manifold.
What's the red stuff? glyptal?

Marck


[Modified by Twin_Turbo, 3:49 PM 2/17/2003]

BeaterShark

I verified it by putting in an oil dye before I pulled it. There is NO oil getting past that gasket. The stem seals are good and it makes no difference whether I run PCV or breathers.

I think the oil is getting in from the combustion chambers due to intake reversion.

The red stuff is some type of paint in the lifter valley. I don't know what glyptal is??

Twin_Turbo

You would have some serious reversion if that much oil came into the runners. I still think you have a problem somewhere in the intake part, not the rings.

As for glyptal, it's electric armature enamel (general electrics) and is used on coils. It's also used to paint cast engine surfaces to seal the porous cast iron (since dirt embeds in pores) and because it's smooth it gives faster oil drainback. The stuff is chemically resistant to oil & fuel.






[Modified by Twin_Turbo, 4:36 PM 2/17/2003]

BeaterShark

I think I have oil from the fuel pump like described here: http://www.hastingsmfg.com/Service%2...il_use_350.htm

I know it was an Olds motor, but what really has me convinced that this is my problem is that when I put the black light over my carb (remember, I put fluorescent dye in my oil), it is fluorescent yellow everywhere that there is fuel. Here is a pic that I took with only the black light for light. The camera doesn't do it much justice, but you can see the whitish areas where they dye is "glowing"


Now, I'm aborting the re-ring and will probably swap out my fuel pump for an electric one.

Twin_Turbo

I think you just found the source... EXCELLENT :)

Marck