73 LS-4

Well me and my Uncle went to look at a 70 LT-1 this weekend. The frame looks very good and the body is pretty straight, all numbers do match. It does however have some issues, doesn't run, needs paint, and has sat for quite a long time so obviously the braking system will all need to be gone through. There is a little rust on the drivers side pillar by the vin, but given the cars history this would have occured a long long time ago since it probably hasn't seen rain in 14 years since it has been garaged since then. there is a little play on the left rear wheel bearing but not much and the right is great. Obviously there is going to have to be some money sunk into this to make a really nice vette out of it. So I'm trying to get a perspective of value vs expense on this thing. I was searching the autotrader etc. on line and they seem to run mid 20's in good shape for most, does this sound about right? He doesn't mind spending the money to fix it up just doesn't want to get into a giant money pit spending 25k on a car worth 18k when complete, but doesn't have any problem spending 25k on it if it's worth 23-27k when done, a little loss is fine but not a big one. This would be my Uncles first vette and one he would want to keep for a long time, so he wants something special and 70 LT-1 is awfully cool in my book. Thanks for any help :D

:cheers:
Pat Kunz

Alwyn678

I would love to have one they are sweetcars. I think that most Restored ones sell in the upper 20's from what I have seen

Gordonm

The 70 LT1 cars are usually the highest value ones exept for 72 LT1 with Air cond. The really good ones are in hte upper 20s with a pristine ones in the low 30s. So a good 70 LT1 should get in the upper 20s.

Tom73

You did not say if it was a coupe or convertible. The drop top should bring about $5,000 more then the coupe.

tom...

73 LS-4

Sorry about that, it's a coupe, M-21 with the optional 4.11's. :D , not exactly a great highway car but should make an excellent sprinter.

:cheers:
Pat Kunz

PRNDL

Reaching down.... and behind... for these numbers :lol: I would give myself at least $10k for restoration (this does not include new paint) which leaves mid to low teens for the car as is. The car is not running, so there could be lots more wrong with the car than you realize. MJ

Just reread your post and I see you concede it needs paint. Sounds like a negative value project to me, but most of them work out that way. :(

Also, aside from the matching numbers, is there documentation for the car? One of the reasons 1970 LT1s are valuable is their rarity, but as the market value goes up, somehow supply is created to meet the demand! I'm not saying the car you are looking at is fake, I am saying documented rare cars will be worth more than undocumented cars.


[Modified by MNJack, 12:52 PM 2/10/2003]

Robert N

Pricing above is correct for a solid running car. I paid $12k for mine (NOM) and it hadn't run in 24 years. It will take quite a bit to get it running properly without worry about the next repair. I paid what I did since she was fully documented. I would have a little hesitation on the mid 20s unless I knew the engine was solid, all original, and well documented. That said. I put $5k more into mine and still will rebuild the suspension, engine, tranny, diff. It will need pait and minor interior work. It will not be factory correct though.

That said, I would not spend much more than $15k based on the described condition. I don't think the NOM is worth the value. There is the inherent risk of the egine have serious issues (why was it parked) before the long sit.

My .02.


[Modified by Robert N, 10:52 AM 2/10/2003]

73 LS-4

Thanks everyone for your replies. The car does have good documentation (protectoplate and tank sticker and it's registered in the LT-1 registry) so I'm pretty confident I'm looking at the real thing, either that or they went through a ton of trouble which I doubt. The block numbers, casting numbers and head and intake numbers do match the black book and vin for this car and it does have the right tach. The engine does turn over well, Probably both the gas and the carb are all gummed up, didn't really go much into this since the engine would need overhauled anyway from sitting so long so a rebuild was planned from the start. I'll talk to the owner again about why it was parked but I got the impression it simply wasn't used for a long long time while there were other vettes and muscle cars that he was using at the time, but I'll try to get more info on this. The price given seems very fair given the condition and what has been said here, especially since it does have documentation to go along with it.

:cheers:
Pat Kunz

Alwyn678

Good luck with the car..Sounds like a lotta fun bringing an LT-1 Back to life :cheers:

Rowdy Rat

For an NCRS Top Flight or Bloomington Gold certifed 1970 LT-1 with correct numbers (on all components), real paper documentation, and verifiable ownership history (and a decent color :) )... Figure on $35,000-$40,000 for a convertible or $30,000-$35,000 for a coupe (unrestored cars that meet the above criteria should bring a bit more). Take that number and work backwards to your offer...

To be honest, it is difficult to accomplish the above and still be under the value of the car when all is said and done. A more reasonable aproach might be to get the car in drivable/presentable condition where the value might be in the $20,000-$25,000 range and you don't have to go chasing after big dollar components if they aren't there. I've seen a couple of 1970 LT-1 coupes that did sell/would have sold in the mid $20,000s recently that fit this description. Both cars had matching numbers drivelines, but little else... Still, they were pretty to look at for the average buyer and pretty sells (neither car ran all that well in my opinion).

I can appreciate what your uncle wants to do... It is going to be tough if he's played with Corvettes before and nearly impossible if he hasn't. There are areas of a restoration/refurbishment where you can shop price over quality and it won't affect the value of the finished product much. In other areas, you can really shoot yourself in the foot if you don't do the job right and bite the bullet on cost. If he wants to own a nice car with some historical significance, then it sounds like he might have found an interesting project, but if he's looking to fix it up and turn it right away, it is a bad move... He'd be better off trying to buy it an sell it as is.

It has been my experience as a buyer that the cars someone has decided to "fix up and sell" are THE WORST projects to take on.

I agree... I had a 1970 LT-1 Corvette as my very first car when I was 17... It definitely qualified as cool! :)

If your uncle wants to keep the car, the 1970 LT-1 is a good choice for the long haul. They've maintained their value pretty well over the years and should continue to appreciate in value in the coming years. The stock restorations will bring the most money (at least in the near future), but near stock "drivers" will do just fine.

I wish your uncle the best of luck in his decision... Let us know what he finally decides.

Regards,

PRNDL

I was going to ask if the carb appeared to be original and if it had the smog pump (Did 70s come with a smog pump?), both high$$ items if missing. Also trying to remember the 72 LT1 coupe auctioned at Carlisle. Looked very original and complete to my inexperienced eye, and went for high teens? (Do you remember the selling price, Stan?) MJ

Rowdy Rat

MJ,

You said it! For restored components, ready to bolt on...

Holley 4555 carburetor with correct circa 1970 date... $500
1100884 alternator... $750
Complete A.I.R. system... $1,250
Complete transistor ignition system with 1111491 distributor... $1,500

And the list goes on and on...

The alternator is about the toughest item on a 1970 LT-1 to find... Darn near impossible to be honest.

$17,700... That had to be one of the best buys that I have seen in a long, long time. The car was beautiful to look at, mechanically complete, and ready to enjoy. Not many around like that, let alone that sell for a reasonable price like that one did.

There was a 1970 LT-1 coupe that went through auction in Orlando, FL last month... No sale on a $24,000 bid. Nice paint (base/clear) and interior, but wouldn't idle and was missing the above mentioned items under the hood. If I were the owner, I would have taken the money and run...

Regards,

73 LS-4

Thanks guys,

The plan at least is to keep the car for the long haul. It does have the smog equipment (in a box but appears complete) and it does have the right numbers carb (also in a box), and currently has a replacement holley on it now. The current owner says that the carb on the car was on it when it was bought so he doesn't know the reason for the carb swap. Given what everyone has said about value when completed, there should be about a 10-15k window of expenditures before he gets hurt too bad. The bad part is he's not a car guy so most work will have to be farmed out, (I don't have my garage built yet at my new house).

:cheers:
Pat Kunz

Robert N

1970 LT-1 did have the smog pump.

Oops, slow on the post.


[Modified by Robert N, 12:09 PM 2/10/2003]

73 LS-4

Well found out last night. Evidently a new toy took it's place in 96 and evidently the LT-1 got neglected and basically sat for that long, so I'm sure everything is gummed up pretty good by now and every fluid will need changed, well at least it sat in a garage all that time, evidently lost interest in it would be my guess.

:cheers:
Pat Kunz

jr9170

If he does a body off on the car and "farms" everything out it will be a expensive task.The car IMHO is no more than a 10,000 car considering what has to be done,but the documentation will make it worth more to someone who understands it.I bought my 70 454 from the original owner last year and was able to save the TANK STICKER.So documentation in todays vette market goes a long way when it comes time to sell.My 67 marina blue conv. body off cost 31,000 and my friends labor was free....JUST MY OPINION...JERRY :seeya

73 LS-4

Thanks Jerry,

A body off isn't really in the plans at this moment. The cars main purpose will be a weekend toy, probably 3-4k miles a year and possibly some track duty if he starts hanging around me enough :D . Given the cars documentation and most of the rare parts seem to be there the price seems very reasonable (can't really discuss them here since the owner is a member) but is in the ballpark of what most said it would be worth given its present condition. I don't consider this car a steal by any means, I payed less for my 73 and it ran great and needed less, but then again it's restored worth isn't near the same either, So to me the price seems fair. Fair as long as we don't run into any major concerns while it's apart, but I checked most of the major issues while looking it over, frame looked great, body was pretty straight, all the numbers matched and I checked over the rear suspension pretty well and it will probably need a little work here but no major issues back there (little play in the left rear wheel bearing but just barely). Hard to say what I would do given this situation with this car, it could be a diamond in the rough and need very little, then again you could run into all sorts of unexpected issues. Not really up to me at this point I'm just counsel on this. He wanted a vette that even vette guys and gals would appreciate and in completed form this would deffinitly fit the bill.

:cheers:
Pat Kunz

ccryder

Pat,

Given the details you have mentioned about the car and most likely the price you can aquire it at in the "mid teens" I'm guessing, I would have to agree with Rowdy Rat, if your uncle is keeping the car for the long haul, the LT-1 cars are a very good investment from my perspective and this sounds like a very nice straight & correct car, with all of the right documentation which will help increase the value for the right person. But if you need any major LT-1 correct parts to make it totally correct, they will be very expensive to come by based on my own experience.
Since we are pretty close and if you do aquire it, I would like to see it. I have learned more about LT-1 cars and have seen more than my share of LT-1 cars in my last 3 years of body on restoring mine than I ever thought I would.
By the way, what is the correct color for the car you are looking at, if its Bridgehampton Blue or Muslanne Blue, I'm sold. I always wanted a blue one, but found the "right" one for me in white.

73 LS-4

ccryder

Actually it's almost a clone to your it looks like (hopefully it will look as good as your someday if he gets it), it's white with a brown interior, your interior looks black from the picks, but it's a 4.11 without power brakes like yours (it's actually in the very low teens), that's why it's so tempting.

:cheers:
Pat Kunz

Split Sixty Three

Pat,..If you're not comfortable in taking on this particular LT1 restoration effort then my advice is take your time and look, look and look some more as there are some nice vettes out there and if you look long enough and hard enough, there are nice cars to be found and motivated sellers. In March '02 I bought a nice '72 Targa blue LT1 coupe(originally a Southern California car) for under $12K complete with tank sticker, original window sticker and protecto plate background and a history of $18,000 of receipts. The car needed some minor cosmetics but it looked good enough to take an Honorable Mention plague at a wash and shine show less than a month after my purchase. That '70 LT1 you've got your eyes on is only going to grow as an investment as it was the first and meanest of this band of small block '70-'72 solid lifter beasts. Sounds like if you can get into the car at a decent price and u don't have too much rust/frame damage etc. to deal with then you can take your time and make it shorterm into a driveable car that you can begin to enjoy and gradually then put it back into pristine condition. FWIW,..Tom Save The Wave!!! :cheers: