GTR1999

I was getting ready to install my rear bearings and started by getting the parking parts together. I have everything out of the car,cleaned and POR15'd on my work bench. I have all new parts- dust shields, SS Brake Corp SS kit, SS Brake Corp SS shoes.

Well I open the dust shield bag and it has a tag on it saying NOT to use SS shoes?? Anyone know why? there must be thousands of these shoes sold and I figured they would be better then the oem shoes for corrosion protection, but maybe I'm better off buying OEM shoes and POR15 them? I stopped until I get some anwsers so now I'll go back to the bearings :smash: :smash: :smash: :smash:
Gary


[Modified by gtr1999, 10:15 AM 1/26/2002]

78Vette-SA

Hmmm, the Dust Shields (we talking the gold cad backing plates?) said not to use SS Parking Brake shoes? Never heard of that.

When I put mine together, I used all SS on the parking brakes, SS insert calipers, and organic brake pads. Works for me.

GTR1999

Hi Joe,
Yes I'm talking about the plate, only mine is silver for the older cars. It has the sticker in plain site so there must be a good reason for it? You haven't had any problems with the shoes on your car?
Gary

NJ74STINGRAY

HI Gary.It was nice to see you and Kevin and spend some time with you guy's.Thank's again for the tour of the shop it was pretty cool to see,Well at least it was to me :) .I jsut got back from the engine rebuilder and the knock turned out to be the pulley for the ac.We just put a little wd 40 on the pulley's and it went away.I am going to change all the belts.Talk to you soon Frank.

78Vette-SA

No problems here. That was 2 years and about 5k miles. Granted I almost never use the parking brake (Automatic) but I'm still having trouble trying to think why the dust shield would have a problem with the SS parking brake which is inside the rotor.

GTR1999

Joe I agree but there must be a reason for it? Hopefully someone will know the answer?
Gary

GTR1999

Frank it was my pleasure, I just emailed you
Gary

jpread

If the dust sheild is not plated it might cause a Galvanic Reaction.
I think thats the correct phrase.
Its when two dissimilar metals react to each other.
It is most common in plumbing when iron pipe and ss fittings are used. The two pcs actualy self destruct over a period of time, and not all that long.

This is "a" possible answer, I wouldn't bet a nickle its "the" answer.

GTR1999

Thanks for the thought, but the plate is cad plated I believe? I bought these from Bairs so I'll give Brian a call this week to see what he says.
Gary

mrvette

Well about 5 years ago when rebuilding the rear brakes/spindle/t-arms on my '72, the SS shoes were tried and found to hang up upon release, very unreliable, shoes dragged and burnt up...could smell them....
replaced with iron OEM type shoes, and problem went away.....retained the SS hardware/springs though....
as difficult as those brakes are to work on, just use the iron shoes, SS kit and have done with it.....

GENE

GTR1999

Thanks for the feedback Gene, any ideas why they hung up? I usually use white lithium grease or "never seize" to prevent galling and sticking.
Gary

GTR1999

Well here's a follow up for those that may be interested.
I called Muskegon Brakes and spoke to Shawn Fox. I purchased the parking brake shoes from Shawn last year.
I explained my concern and Shawn said that some of the SS parking brake shoes were made a little longer then the OEM shoes and this was the cause for the warning sticker on the dust sheilds. The shoes could be filed or ground down to the same size as the OEM and work without binding up. These was/is the case for some but not all SS parkign brake shoes. I compared the OEM shoes to the shoes from Muskegon and see no difference at all, so I'll use them. Now I just need to find the time to get back to them
:confused:
Lastly, for anyone who has not used Muskegon Brakes, It's well worth a phone call. Shawn is by far the most pleasant and helpful person I've dealt with in this hobby and,unlike some, they don't hassle you if you want to ask a question :cheers:
Gary


[Modified by gtr1999, 1:57 PM 1/28/2002]


[Modified by gtr1999, 2:10 PM 1/28/2002]

GTR1999

To continue the follow up. I was able to get the right T arm together today:3 coats of POR 15 paint, new bushing, new bearings set at .0015"-.002", refinished rotor with 3/8-24 flat heads bolting the rotor to the spindle-.001" runout, put it all together and noticed the new SS parking brakes dragging a little bit.
Played with it until I ran out of time and had to leave the shop. The drum portion wasn't turned and the original shoes still had a lot of material so the rotor drum shouldn't be out of round.
I compared the SS hardware to the GM and the GM star wheel was longer? I would have thought the opposite. The shoes matched up the same too- I was thinking a different radius between them? When assembled the rotor spins free then it feels like the shoes shift and start to drag?The star wheel fully closed. I disassembled the shoes and assembled again without the star wheel and it was ok, so the shoes have to be sticking out a few thousands or just not staying centered within the drum.
Like I said, I ran out of time,but have been thinking about it- I could face the star wheel down to compress the shoes more and drill new spring retainer holes to keep more tension on the shoes.
The unit is on a bench so there's no tension on the cable lever, maybe a slight tension is required on the lever to center the shoes?
Anyone have a similiar problem or have recommendations?
Gary


[Modified by gtr1999, 10:26 PM 2/10/2002]

78Vette-SA

Greetings again Gary.

By dragging, do you mean you can't turn the rotor at all, or that it turns but you can here/feel just a little bit of the drag? Did you do this without the caliper/pads installed so you are sure it's the PB?

If it's just a minor scuffing, I wouldn't worry about it so much. After the burn in for the PB it might go away. When I put mine together, I remember being able to turn the rotor but it was a little but snug but not bad.

GTR1999

Hi Joe,
No the T-arm is on th ebench without a caliper mounted. I spin it by hand and feel/hear rubbing from the shoes. When I removed the star wheel and compress the shoes a little bit it spins free. Without the rotor, the bearing feel fine. It has to be the shoes hanging up or not compressing.
Joe do you have any pictures showing the close up of the shoes installed? I would be interested to see if your shoes were outsude the diameter of the spindle flange- what I'm saying is the shoes are not concentric with the spindle flange when looking at it directly.
Thanks,
Gary

78Vette-SA

Gary,

This is about the best I can do. If you want a larger picture send me your email (I looked for it but couldn't find it) and I'll email you a much larger version.




[Modified by 78Vette-SA, 8:09 PM 2/10/2002]

GTR1999

Thanks Joe, I just sent you an email.
gary

GTR1999

update, I have finished the right T arm rebuild and have the PB shoes fit good enough to adjust on the car. I had to mill a step in the new ss shoes because they weren't deep enough where the star wheel connects. I also faced one end of the star wheel to collapse the shoes more. This seems to workbut I shouldn't have to do this with new parts. I also had to fit the new dust plate because the mounting holes didn't line up.I guess vette part mfg never heard of ISO 9001 :mad I had the rotor runout down to .001" but lost some of it when I unbolted them to assemble the bearings. I'll dial both the PB and runout in on the car. Now to start the Left T arm :smash: :smash: :smash:
and the differential :smash: :smash: :smash:
Hope this helps someone whendoing theirs-hopefully the PB shoes will fit better :rolleyes:
Gary

Tom454

A little more information...

I have found that the OEM shoes are a little bit stickier (softer) than the SS. They seem to grab better. I currently have one side OEM and the other SS because the SS failed (defective rivet came out). I noticed, with just one side OEM, that the brake held better. Things that make ya go Hmmmmm...

Adjusting these things to work is a PITA... the cable adjustment cannot be made without putting a "pre-load" on the system... so no matter what you do on the bench (or with the caliper off and the half shaft disconnected etc.), the cable adjustment is going to screw it up. First, I disconnect the half shaft & loosen the cable adjustment completely, and remove the brake pads. I put standard lug nuts on (backwards) to hold the rotor in place. Then, tighten the star until I cannot turn the rotor with a screw driver stuck in the rotor. Then I back the star off until the rotor spins "relatively" free.... there will still be some drag at this point. If you back the star off until there is no noise or drag, then it will be too loose, and the cable adjustment will not work. I fine tune it by going back & forth between the cable adjustment and the star until the drag is not severe, and the brake locks up with about 2 or 3 clicks on the handle. After the new shoes wear in a little, I re-adjust the whole thing again. Major PITA. FYI- I have found that the SS system is more difficult to keep adjusted than the OEM parts... the small variance in dimensions (which there are) seem to be the culprit.

GTR1999

Hi Tom,
Thanks for the input. I agree, that's why I left them the way thye are now. The cable tension should be the difference. Interesting about the shoe material. Do you burnish the shoes duringthe first drive?
Thanks,
Gary