What do I need for ~400 rear wheel HP?
01-21-2002, 05:51 AM
#1
2nd Gear
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What do I need for ~400 rear wheel HP?
Its a completely stock, completely original freshly rebuilt 350CID/300HP engine in a 69 vette. Its currently out of the car and ready for some goodies. :) Any of you know of any magical combination to get about 400RWHP? what cam, carb, head package, specs, whatever, would i need to get to this mark? what kind of #'s could I produce with a carb, intake manifold and cam? (no head work) any ideas?
i just inherited this car from my pops, and dont have much experience with carb'd SBC's, any advice would be great!
thanks http://www.geocities.com/justinbailey/
i just inherited this car from my pops, and dont have much experience with carb'd SBC's, any advice would be great!
thanks http://www.geocities.com/justinbailey/
01-21-2002, 09:34 AM
#2
Melting Slicks
Re: What do I need for ~400 rear wheel HP? (69vette350)
You're sure asking a lot from a carb, intake manifold and cam, without asking any help from the heads and/or piston style. What heads and pistons are you running. I would think 400 rwhp is about 425+ flywheel....could be more, don't have a program to compute.
[Modified by KenSny, 8:35 AM 1/21/2002]
[Modified by KenSny, 8:35 AM 1/21/2002]
01-21-2002, 10:41 AM
#3
Le Mans Master
Re: What do I need for ~400 rear wheel HP? (69vette350)
If that is 300 flywhee horsepower, you are looking at 250net hp to start from. Depending on what you have in the engine now to produce that 300hp, I'd add the following:
Either World Products S/R Torquer or Dart Iron Eagle Heads (I side with the 72cc Iron Eagles) - 180-200 cc intake runner volume
Hotter, higher lift cam - Comp Cams Extreme Energy to start
headers and true duals with cross-over pipe
RPM Air Gap or equivalent intake manifold
9+ CR Pistons (hypereutectic)
Improved ignition...
OR, just drop a healthy 454 or 502 into that 69!
Either World Products S/R Torquer or Dart Iron Eagle Heads (I side with the 72cc Iron Eagles) - 180-200 cc intake runner volume
Hotter, higher lift cam - Comp Cams Extreme Energy to start
headers and true duals with cross-over pipe
RPM Air Gap or equivalent intake manifold
9+ CR Pistons (hypereutectic)
Improved ignition...
OR, just drop a healthy 454 or 502 into that 69!
01-21-2002, 10:49 AM
#4
Melting Slicks
Re: What do I need for ~400 rear wheel HP? (69vette350)
Check out some of the engine combinations from this web site to see if any of them match your needs.
Ryan's Ultimate Car Site. 105 Small-Block Chevy Dynoed Engine Combinations
http://ryanscarpage.50megs.com/
Ryan's Ultimate Car Site. 105 Small-Block Chevy Dynoed Engine Combinations
http://ryanscarpage.50megs.com/
01-21-2002, 10:51 AM
#5
Burning Brakes
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Re: What do I need for ~400 rear wheel HP? (TedH)
400RWHP would be about 500 at the flywheel (net) or not far short of 600 gross. I suspect you need a nicely built big block to deliver those results! Your stock small block is probably somewhere around 200RWHP (best guess) so you have a long, long way to go!! :cheers:
01-21-2002, 11:23 AM
#6
Drifting
Re: What do I need for ~400 rear wheel HP? (69vette350)
First thing you need to do: Get the car added to the '69 Registry!
Then, look at a good head, like the AFR 190s, and look into some full-length HTC coated headers and 2.5" or larger exhaust pipes, and go with an Edelbrock Performer RPM Air-Gap with at least a 650 Demon carburetor.
I'd suggest at that point, calling CompCams and having them recommend a cam for the engine and parts.
I'd start with that, and a dyno program to simulate the engine before buying the parts.
Then, look at a good head, like the AFR 190s, and look into some full-length HTC coated headers and 2.5" or larger exhaust pipes, and go with an Edelbrock Performer RPM Air-Gap with at least a 650 Demon carburetor.
I'd suggest at that point, calling CompCams and having them recommend a cam for the engine and parts.
I'd start with that, and a dyno program to simulate the engine before buying the parts.
01-21-2002, 11:29 AM
#7
Drifting
Re: What do I need for ~400 rear wheel HP? (rainman69)
Assuming worst case drivetrain loss, 400 RWHP is 20% loss.
Therefore, flywheel net would be about 480 HP. It's quite possible with the right parts...although you're going to be shelling out the dough, whether you stay N/A or go blown. You could also add some juice...but that has the tendency to break things if not done just right.
From BA Engines:
So, it's quite possible for the right amount of money to do it in a small block... :smash:
Therefore, flywheel net would be about 480 HP. It's quite possible with the right parts...although you're going to be shelling out the dough, whether you stay N/A or go blown. You could also add some juice...but that has the tendency to break things if not done just right.
From BA Engines:
425HP - 450HP 350: Runs on 92 octane fuel and is suitable for daily driving and weekend racing. Completely machined 4 bolt main 350 block, (bored, honed, align honed, square decked) fitted with ARP main bolts, Reground and polished crank with chamfered oil holes, Clevite 77 rod and main bearings, new cam bearings, forged TRW pistons, iron ductile rings, reconditioned rods fitted with ARP bolts, new Crower cam, new lifters, new double roller timing assembly, chrome moly push rods, ported Edelbrock aluminum Performer RPM heads, aluminum roller rockers, ported Edelbrock Victor Jr. intake manifold, new high volume oil pump and HD drive, new harmonic balancer. Comes complete with new Holley 750 carb, chrome oil pan, chrome timing cover, assembled with stainless steel bolts and Fel-Pro gaskets. Engine is fully balanced and ready to eat crate motors for lunch! $4,699 outright.
"Bullet proof" 450HP - 510HP 350: Our "street" version of this engine runs on 92 octane. Same standard parts as our 450 HP 350 but with forged 4340 steel crank, forged 4340 steel H-beam connecting rods, special hardened Federal Mogul bearings, JE light weight forged pistons with floating pins and ported Edelbrock Victor Jr. heads and a larger, better breathing cam. $6,699 outright.
500HP - 625HP 434 "small block from Hell": This engine is a real "GM 502" eater in a small block package. It makes over 600+ horsepower and even though I am labeling this as a "street" engine (because it runs on 92 octane pump gas and can be driven daily) it could just as easily become a racing engine with a simple piston swap and just like all of the other engines I build, this one can be changed to suit your particular needs. Fully prepped 400 block fitted with a billet aluminum main support. ARP main and head studs, 4" stroke 4340 crank. 6 inch 4340 forged H-beam rods with ARP bolts. Forged, fully machined JE light weight pistons with floating pins and iron ductile rings. Custom ground .670" lift Crower cam and lifters. True double roller timing assembly. Chrome moly push rods. Aluminum roller rockers. Fully CNC'd Edelbrock Victor Jr. heads and matching ported Victor Jr. intake manifold. (optional CNC'd Brodix and PRO heads available), Customized Holley "Race Shop" 750 carb and Billet HEI distributor. Pro-Race harmonic balancer and SFI approved flex plate. Engine comes fully balanced and assembled with stainless steel bolts. $9,995
"Bullet proof" 450HP - 510HP 350: Our "street" version of this engine runs on 92 octane. Same standard parts as our 450 HP 350 but with forged 4340 steel crank, forged 4340 steel H-beam connecting rods, special hardened Federal Mogul bearings, JE light weight forged pistons with floating pins and ported Edelbrock Victor Jr. heads and a larger, better breathing cam. $6,699 outright.
500HP - 625HP 434 "small block from Hell": This engine is a real "GM 502" eater in a small block package. It makes over 600+ horsepower and even though I am labeling this as a "street" engine (because it runs on 92 octane pump gas and can be driven daily) it could just as easily become a racing engine with a simple piston swap and just like all of the other engines I build, this one can be changed to suit your particular needs. Fully prepped 400 block fitted with a billet aluminum main support. ARP main and head studs, 4" stroke 4340 crank. 6 inch 4340 forged H-beam rods with ARP bolts. Forged, fully machined JE light weight pistons with floating pins and iron ductile rings. Custom ground .670" lift Crower cam and lifters. True double roller timing assembly. Chrome moly push rods. Aluminum roller rockers. Fully CNC'd Edelbrock Victor Jr. heads and matching ported Victor Jr. intake manifold. (optional CNC'd Brodix and PRO heads available), Customized Holley "Race Shop" 750 carb and Billet HEI distributor. Pro-Race harmonic balancer and SFI approved flex plate. Engine comes fully balanced and assembled with stainless steel bolts. $9,995
01-21-2002, 12:27 PM
#8
Safety Car
Re: What do I need for ~400 rear wheel HP? (69vette350)
You'de have to completly redo that moter to handle that kind a power. With the smallblock 350 would need to be screamin pretty good to get there. I doubt the stock rebuilt bottom end could support it for very long at all. I wouldnt buy a cam thats worth anymore than 6000rpm. Higher than that on a stock bottom end is pushin it. A sensible, streetable, enjoyable to drive 350 could easily be based on a stock bottom end and develope 350 to 375hp at the crank. Not exactly sure what that would be at the rear wheels.
Slap some goodies on and have some fun. If you want the kina power yur askin for from a smallblock, I suggest 406 build up on the side while you run your 350. It will be easier to make bigger power with the higher cubes. Wont have to be done so friggin radical.
Slap some goodies on and have some fun. If you want the kina power yur askin for from a smallblock, I suggest 406 build up on the side while you run your 350. It will be easier to make bigger power with the higher cubes. Wont have to be done so friggin radical.
01-21-2002, 01:06 PM
#10
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Re: What do I need for ~400 rear wheel HP? (Corzvette69)
Make no mistake, it can be done... but you are talking $$$ and a lot of work to get there. 20% drivetrain loss is certainly a reasonable number to use for an automatic tranny, IRS car--that puts you at needing ~480hp at the flywheel (as mentioned). Getting almost 1.4hp/cu in is not easy!
You'll need GOOD headers (think long tubes), good exhaust (2.5" dual or 3" single), a really nasty cam, heads with unreal flow... and let's not forget gettng all that power to the ground.
When all is said and done, you'll probably have a car with miserable driveability to get that 480hp. A 400 small block could do the job cheaper and easier and maintain far better street manners, and that would be my suggestion as to what you should build--assuming you don't want to go to the expense and work of swapping in a big block.
Keep in mind I've done some research into this very topic... I'm shooting for 12 flat with my 84 Camaro. With a live-axle and a manual transmission, I calculated I'd need roughly 440-ish hp at the crank, and I honestly don't think I'll get that, either. That's why I have a 400 block over in the corner of my garage. :)
You'll need GOOD headers (think long tubes), good exhaust (2.5" dual or 3" single), a really nasty cam, heads with unreal flow... and let's not forget gettng all that power to the ground.
When all is said and done, you'll probably have a car with miserable driveability to get that 480hp. A 400 small block could do the job cheaper and easier and maintain far better street manners, and that would be my suggestion as to what you should build--assuming you don't want to go to the expense and work of swapping in a big block.
Keep in mind I've done some research into this very topic... I'm shooting for 12 flat with my 84 Camaro. With a live-axle and a manual transmission, I calculated I'd need roughly 440-ish hp at the crank, and I honestly don't think I'll get that, either. That's why I have a 400 block over in the corner of my garage. :)
