scregan

If I use the Manheim Gold Book as a basis for a corvette value, what do I deduct for a NOM motor?
Looking at a 62 with a 350.

Thanks,


Scott

63C2splitter

Good question - There is a significant hit for non numbers mathing, but I would be interested in what the penalty is for a "non correct" motor. (350 vs. 327). I would guess several $K.

My 63 has been repainted to Riverside Red (should be Daytona Blue), Electric windows were added, has a non-original engine (350 from a 72 Corvette that was requilt), composite rear spring, AC added, no ignition shielding, after market knock-offs, etc. etc. etc. With all of those deductions, my car would probably be worth about $5K using the value guide. I am slowly getting things back to original - I should be done by the time I hit 80 years old. (54 now)

Dave

Ironcross

If you farmed the job out probably 10K for a correct restamped engine. At least 3/4`s of that amount would be for the parts. The more thats missing, the higher the costs if it`s a performance Vette.

dcress1127

My guess would be as much as you can get the seller to go along with. Correctness is way overdone and way costly. How many correct blocks have been restamped. Do you then mic the thickness of the deck as I have heard suggested. I just sold a really nice 62 and got ragged pretty hard over price and the correct block, but NOM. Sold it to a dealer for my asking price. Think he'll turn it for a profit? I think it is a safe bet. Maybe he'll restamp the motor and ad 10K. Nothing against the NCRS folks, but it boils down to what you want to do with your money.

Jack60

The price is the price. Do not deduct If you have original add.
If some numbers guy looks at it, tell him to take a walk.
If you have a nice driver, you can get your price.
Better that then have a 100k car you do not drive and enjoy.

wmf62

if you're looking to 'haggle' over the price just because it's not an original motor, then i wish you luck. there aren't many 'original' cars left and those that are real you can't afford. look at the 'total package' not just the contents of the package.....

take my car for example, what's it worth:

1970 350 LT-1 crate engine
1962 Rochester fuel injection
copper radiator
windshield wiper conversion to push/pull cable system
kenwood radio
1965 corvette front disc brakes
1972 cadillac seville rear disc brakes
1956 rear axle housing
1962 3.36 positraction rear end
new process MY6 transmission
1960 convertible top frame
hurst shifter
8" corvette rally wheels and caps
C1 frame of some year (can't remember)
and sometime over the winter it will have a new IFS with power rack & pinion
and someday, a/c


when i bought it:


now:



to me it's priceless.... i know where every nut & bolt is one it, several times over.
Bill

vettebuyer6369

People get a little defensive about non original parts... understand that no one is saying your car isnt nice or isnt great fun or very valuable if it has a replacement motor.

However, the fact is, the car is worth significantly less in the vintage Corvette market with a replacement motor. It is easier to sell a solid-axle car when the NOM has been dressed to "look" era correct, but understand that a wrong 327 is not worth any more than a wrong old 350 or wrong crate motor.

It's hard to put a dollar figure on the difference, but $8k is not out of line and possibly low depending on the car. Also, in your specific case, it is more of a loss because a correct '62 would have a VIN derivative on the block, meaning it could have been a numbers matching car. An earlier solid axle could use a number of replacement motors and still could possibly have been considered original because there was no VIN stamping. In your case, only one block could be considered original, without consideration of creative restamping.

People get crabby about NCRS and originality, but do not lose sight of the fact it does affect value, period.

scregan

Seem to have struck a nerve. My intent was not to downgrade a modified corvette, but to get an idea of what a fare price is.

I know a fair price is what I am willing to pay & what the person that owns a car is willing to sell it for but how do we determine what that price is.

Here is another example of a car I am looking at

• 1965 convertible.
• 350 engine
• 4-speed
• Tasteful flares
• New interior.
• Frame looks good
• Side pipes
• Electric windows
• Auto meter gages
• One spot about fist size on the back where the paint is popping up due to being bumped. Otherwise paint looks good.
• 427 style hood.
• Aftermarket wheels.

Not a bad car, but what's it worth? Want to be fair with the seller but I don't want to over pay.

Thanks,


Scott

Wiscane

10 K

Frankenvette 63

You better come in out of the sun!

Shurshot

For sure the car is worth more then 10 grand...way more


If you plan to keep the car and the flares that is fine but if you plan to go back to an original appearing body figure on 10 grand just for the body work and paint. Then there is a high possibility that you will need to change wheels and tires unless they look really skinny as is.

A new correct interior is cool but if it is a "custom" job and the dash needs to be replaced it is going to hurt.

It all boils down to DO YOU LIKE THE CAR? Nobody wants to throw money away and there is always another one for sale but your satisfaction and enjoyment is priceless.

Doug

Wiscane

10 k on a base motor... sky is the limit for a big block. How do you see it different?

63 340HP

Everything is negotiable, it also depends on how serious you are from a restoration perspective.

If a true judged restoration is not important the NOM engine means nothing to detract from the value. Pay what you believe is fair, and ask for a deduction that will match your desire to own the car at a fair price. If restoration is not the goal a modern TPI 350 with an overdrive transmission could be an asset (easier on the fuel cost, more drive enjoyment, and usually more power).


If judged restoration is the goal the engine becomes very important.

The old rule was the expected cost deduction is equal to the cost to "restore" the car, to correct the NOM parts.

This is from the days when a correct casting date block could be machined and left blank (or restamped) without complaint other than the points deduction for the stamp pad condition (NCRS deduction for no broach marks and no numbers). If you want to seek the honor of NCRS Top Flight this is the route you need to consider (the cost and the deduction, and the attention to detail to be judged correct in all other areas to take the pad deduction and still make Top Flight).

These days it appears an incorrect stamp pad raises more ethical questions than a blank stamp pad (and more questions than a correct dated block with the wrong VIN and wrong option code, like a block from a full size Impala that still has broach marks). The scammers have everyone inspecting stamp pads and suspecting anything except an original pad to be an attempt to hide an option upgrade (trying to upgrade FI in an original L76, etc.). If you do not want to hear questions and challenges about the cars "original" configuration years down the road anything but the original block will be less than satisfactory (a NOM car is not what you want, even if it is free).

The cost of a correct 62 block with a casting date within the 6-months before the car assembly date will run up to $500. The block and engine will have to be rebuilt ($2000-$5000 depending on who does the labor).

If the engine is NOM there is a very good chance the accessories are not original, parts that will also need to be replaced for zero-deduction Top Flight judging (needed because the irregular stamp pad). This is where the cost to correct a non-original engine can get very expensive, as the component parts of all the little engine details can be more expensive than the basic block. The accessories can run up the cost of a correct engine restoration to well over $10K (more for FI).

This is how the $10K deduction number is estimated (a starting point for the engine and configuration restoration).

The last issue to consider is the resale forecast. You will not lose money if the resale forecast is a decade or more, regardless of engine (they don't make cheap C1/C2 clones ... yet). The question of cost to correct the NOM configuration will be the future buyers problem (and all the years of driving enjoyment in between will be your benefit).

.

Ironcross

Because the HP race is back on the front burner. BB`s are more impressive and have the more desired HP. I guess either pay now or pay later.

dcress1127

I LIKE the before. I LOVE the after. Nice car Bill.

dcress1127

I have been to a lot of NCRS meets and am in awe of the cars and the guys or gals who do them or have them done because I know it is mostly love that goes into it not to mention the committment of time and money so you can't take anything away from that. I purely admire the patience and hard work, but funny - sometimes ha ha and some times strange- they don't seem to want to ackowledge the guys and gals who just like Corvettes in any condition. I waited many years for my first. Bought it in a junk yard and made a decent driver and loved the car. Somehow just never ended up getting past the driver stage for me. Still go to NCRS and swoon though. Room for all of us I guess.

jrepoff

I feel after reading this thread I realized that like many hobbies this one has a dollar value associated with some individuals satisfaction. To those individuals I wish you the best but for those others I think you should just enjoy and do not let the dollar values influence how you enjoy those drivers. I understand that to many it is important to win a first place trophy but when driving down the road in your none matching numbers car who really cares!!! If it feels right, do it and enjoy.

Brucets11

I'm one that's really not too interested in finding a car with the original motor. I had this in a different car and it was always in the back of my mind that I might hurt it or that I should limit my driving because of the original motor. My '66 does not have the original motor and I'm quite happy that I bought one without the original motor. My enjoyment comes from evening rides with my wife, Sunday mornig breakfast runs with her and an occasional car show.

ptuner1

'60 350 ci

67-427ci

I installed a 454/425hp GM Performance Parts crate engine in my 67 Coupe. It was an original Big Block car (as far as I can tell), but had a pretty beat 402 when I purchased it. Still has the L71 Tri-Power and runs great.
Roy