Mike Ward

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...tem=4546213618

Have a look at the engine pad photos

Note that the seller claims 'matching numbers' nonetheless

Brian VH McHale

Maybe the head slid forward when it got hit in the *ss.

PHulst

Oh, the numbers match.

It's just not the original block.
Or if it is, some owner believed the machine shop guy when he said he could "make it just like original."

Jughead

I'm a numbers matching novice. Specifically, how can you tell they're re-stamped?

Mine was numbers matching until they decked the block.

ksbunting

I have the same question as jughead: How can you tell it is restamped. I have read on the NCRS site that there were some pretty bad stamps off the assembly line due to human error, restamping, or use of dull tools. I would like to know how to spot a restamp from an original. Thanks in advance,
Kurt

Dwaynes69BB

I too am curious as to how you can tell that it is a restamp?

Is it because the numbers are not evenly spaced?

CGGorman

If anything, those stampings look TOO good. They are almost never that distinct after 35 years of rust and the assembly monkeys' (to quote a famous member) poor craftmanship.

I've heard that one of the best indicators is the blanchard grinding marks from when the factory decked the block. Something about radial versus linear... Crap. I don't remember. Anybody else?

Jughead

Now that one rivet looks funny to me. The one on the right.

mandm1200

Just guessing here. Maybe because the alphanumerics are not neatly lined up. If that's the case, that about the only thing that would be neatly lined up from the factory.

Edit: Finally got my 1000th post.

captainmorgan

I too am interested in finding out how to tell a restamp from the original.

Maybe someone with a numbers matching car could post a picture so we can compare.

ksbunting

I have read that the "broaching" marks made by the milling machine at the factory are a clue to original vs. restamp. The machine that milled the heads left specific markings and I think the factory left straight lines running the length of the head while restamps leave circular swirl marks becasue the restampers don't have the expensive milling machines that GM used. I am going from memory on this and my memory could be less than 100% since I read about this years ago. I don't know how to tell the fake numbers from the real ones.
Kurt

CGGorman

That sounds right. I think the General broached the block along the long axis (Which leaves straight lines), while today's machine shops blanchard grind (which leaves circular lines)...

I also read that after '65, the VIN was moved to the right side of the pad to help clear the coolant plug in the head.

comp

Hmmmm going to have a few people looking

Mike Ward

The lack of broach marks (series of parrallel 'lines') going front to rear on the pad is the first dead give away. The swirl marks from the rotary milling machine at the rebuilder' shop are easily visible under the paint.

Some people might argue that the stampings are original, and that just the broaching marks were removed during the rebuild. If you look closely at some of the characters (the lower right leg of the 'K' in the engine code is a good example) you can see metal that has been deformed and raised above the deck surface. No way that raised metal would have remained after the milling.

The characters in the engine date and code are not bad (somewhat similar to other genuine pads) but the car VIN stamping is completely dissimilar to typical OEM stampings (wrong font and size). This is simply based on comparing lots of originals at judging meets. I beleive the content of the stamp is wrong also, but don't have my books with me.

The point of the post was (again) to show what a crock of sh*t the term 'numbers matching' is. This might indeed be the original engine for this car, but once the pad is wiped out by a careless rebuilder, who knows for sure.

Most people assume that 'numbers matching' is equivalent to 'original factory installed component'

Mike Ward

Not true for small blocks.

Jughead

Maybe the "numbers matching" feature will become irrelevant?

Budman68

I've never seen a stamp that clear. Usually you have to use the paper/pencil method to make a imprint.

I don't think the pop rivits are right either, but I'm not a NCRS guy.

ksbunting

The NCRS Technical Board recently had an interesting discussion on this subject and the point was raised that it is called the National Corvette RESTORATION Society, emphasis on restoration and therefore if an engine is RESTORED, i.e. the numbers are restamped, then it should not receive a deduction.
I am an NCRS member and have been for quite some time but frankly sometimes the more I read the Judging Manuals and all elese, the more confused I get. It gets very frustrating because many times even the NCRS "experts" can't agree among themselves. It makes it even harder for the rest of us.

Mike Ward

The key is that the pad (and numbers) are to be restored correctly to avoid a deduction, no different than any other component of the car. This pad is hardly an example of this principle.

captainmorgan

I found V0499800( I think the last number is a 0. half is missing so it looks like ]) stamped on the block in front of the right head.This does not make sense to me .

Can anyone explain what this decodes too or what it means ? It does not seems to be a standard engine ID.

Looks like the V=flint 04= month 99=day? 800=type?

The 99 and the 800 do not make any sense. Does anyone know what they mean?

Thanks