Why is it NOT a 911? I have owned a couple and am curious why you say it is not a 911? even Porsche list the 4S under 911?
http://www.porsche.com/usa/models/911/911-carrera-4s/

Well, you should've read it because it was a continuation of the driver's car competition and price and track numbers were not critical or even considered in choosing the ranking order. I'm still torn that the Porsche won. I will not buy a Porsche. I respect them, though. And I want the Corvette to slay the Porsche once and for all, but they are always playing catch up. So is everyone else (with the unanimous exception of the Ferrari 458). Ugh.

They did not say the 911 was more visceral. If that's what they were looking for, I think it's clear the F12 would have won. They said the 911 was slightly more confidence inspiring on the track and never inspires fear, never makes a mistake, always perfectly sorted, etc. I think you could argue that's almost the opposite of visceral, and that the 991 is so close to perfect that it takes the fun out of it.

I haven't been able to watch the video, but the written comparison was great. I think when you consider the parameters of the comparison (i.e. best subjective driver's car regardless of any other factors) and the extremely capable and desirable competition, this is about as close to a win for the C7 as you're going to get. And even considering those things, it sounds like the C7 was judged to be very very nearly as good as the 911.

Well now we know how the C7 performs compared to a Porsche that costs three times as much. Maybe sometime one of the car magazines could compare a C7 and Porsche of equal price or would that be just to painfull for the Porsche boys.

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/coupes/112_0901_chevrolet_corvette_ferrari_599_ gtb_comparison/specs.html

It would appear you are correct, with the 599GTO "roughly 220lbs lighter" according to motortrend.

Still, for all the weight saving measures, and for a car that's slightly smaller then the 599, that's a pretty poor end weight. Sounds familiar to a certain other car, only the ferrari didn't receive a huge interior upgrade.

?
 

How could a Vette with iron brakes out run and stop a 4-wheel drive Porsche?:willy:

But, if GM really had something extra they didn't get out there The Ring would be the place!:toetap:

But, Heh they probably just want to save that to show off the high priced TECH!:thumbs: (and we aren't stupid!)

CC Brakes$
DCT$
-100lb(fiber)$
Wider & stronger wheels and tires$
Titanium engine parts$
Heavy duty this and that$
Supercharger$
Aero$

Ka-ching$ Ka-ching$:rofl:

If the little Vette did too much....:D

:rock:

The results of this review are good to know cause I was really considering picking up a Ferrari on my salesguy salary. But now I can be content w/ just the Corvette!

I know you guys are all hung up on MT picking the beetle over the Vette, but you do realize it beat the almost half mill Ferrari, right???

So, why measure lap times or 0-60 or 1/4 mile or braking, if it's all about how the car "feels"?
But you can see if PERFORMANCE is what you're looking for, the Corvette owns the $150,000 Porsche C4S. Too funny!
"I'm the slowest guy on the track but the car "feels" great"!! :willy:

BB

Wow this C7 is sensational on the same level with a Ferrari and a Porsche.

It finished second in a close call despite the 911 having some technology that should give it a clear edge: Ceramic brakes, PDCC, PDK and AWD.

I would have like more a apples with apples comparison with a Manual trasnmission and a RWD 911.

AWD cars will always feel more confidence inspiring than RWD so in that regard is not surprising that the 911 felt better than both the C7 and the F12.

The same reason why a BRZ is so much fun to drive. None of us do laps for money and championships, we do them for fun. And most don't spend much time even doing that.

So really feel is more important than the stopwatch in this case.

Beat? In what way?

They picked the Porsche because it was 1) slowest around the track 2) slowest in the drag race and 3) had the least drama when driving because it make people seem better than they are.

And you take them seriously?

What I think is interesting is that the Vette does well when judged with others of a contemporary era. It speaks well for the car.

For the record, I don't want an easy to drive car. I want drama and excitement. If I wanted something easy, I'd hire a chauffeur.

In drama and excitement it comes in the same order as who did better with the numbers: F12 followed closely by C7 with the 911 bringing up the rear.

If you want drama buy an 84 and stuff a 460 hp 400 CI small block in there :D

Ask me why I know...

Just shows how irrelevant their judging criteria is to many of us. Oh well, people who value performance over status will still buy the corvette despite a rag giving it 2nd.

That is crazy, if they perform these various test but don't count them why bother? Oh well.

Yes, and even under those unfavorable comparison parameters (for the Corvette), it came in at a very close 2nd against two of the best performance cars you can buy right now. That's not really a loss in my book.

He's saying it's not a base 911. Whereas the Stingray is the base Corvette.

They measure those things to give a fuller picture of the car's performance.

Personally, I don't care which of the three is a tiny bit better than the other on the track. These mostly meaningless measurements (within a range, of course) are only designed to sell magazines and get the fanboys all atwitter.

How the car "feels" in normal driving and when pushed to 8/10 and beyond are more important because I don't race Porsches at Laguna Seca, but I do drive on the street and I want to know how comfortable I'll be if I push the car hard.

Beyond that, a Ferrari is something the Corvette and 911 will never be, regardless of track numbers.

(Assuming people to any large degree even track their cars)...there can only be one fastest guy at the track. Does that mean everyone feels like crap? If you value performance above all else, that's the natural conclusion. Yet, people still buy Ferraris, Maseratis, Lambos, Merc AMGs, BMW Ms, R8s, and Astons in numbers that GM and Viper would die for.
The numbers are there primarily for bragging rights (the aforementioned d*ck measuring contest), benchmarking progress against prior models within the same company, or to give an idea of relative performance. Obviously, a Miata is slower than a ZR1 and the stat sheet figures show that. Whether a car is 0.72s faster on a racetrack is not a serious consideration to most buyers in the 911's segment. And I would argue the same could be true for a lot of Corvette buyers as well: Notice how many automatics and convertibles are sold. Grand Sports optioned up into Z06 territory. 427s that are already in Z06 territory.

So, by that metric the Viper ACR was much better than the ZR1.

Seems to me MT and Randy felt there was still considerable drama and excitement to be had in wringing out the Porsche. Just that it didn't threaten to bite like the others. And it still offered a challenge to the driver: "After talking to Randy, I think the car is so good that it no longer really challenges you with its own flaws. Instead, it challenges you with your flaws*."

Compared with the Ferrari:
"The F12 was a literal handful almost everywhere on the track, and I nearly spun off the track in turn 2. While I'm no Randy Pobst, I've never nearly stuffed a car in 2."

And bear in mind Johnny O'Connell's words on the ATS:
"Cadillac factory racer Johnny O'Connell didn't mince words when he told journalists at the launch of the 2013 Cadillac ATS: 'This is the best car I've driven around the proving grounds in my 12 years at General Motors.'
Say what? Perhaps he already forgot a certain famous sports car. You know, the [C6] Corvette? Or the CTS-V?
O'Connell elaborated further while he gave us hot laps in an ATS: 'Oh sure, the Corvette has higher limits,' he explained, 'but the ATS is more forgiving when it reaches the limit.' In other words, when the Corvette begins to oversteer, it happens very quickly and it isn't easy to save, whereas the ATS can be driven up to and beyond its limits all day. Even by us average folk."

Sure, someone's going to say how a 1980s Lincoln is easy to control at the limit. The difference, with respect to the context, is that that Lincoln isn't going to be easy to control with the high limits of an ATS (nevermind a car that laps Laguna Seca in under 1:40).

*Who here among us can honestly say he is a perfect driver? Even F1 drivers stuff their cars into walls and into other drivers, through no fault of the car.

:iagree:

The Gen V Viper awaits you. :thumbs: