Have you thought about one of the ZZ short blocks and a cam,heads and intake
I have a zz4 and this is what I wish I would have done. Read the warranty for any GM crate engine very very closely |
550 torque @3250......red line@6200.....any questions??.....BBZZ 502.....BB ZZ 454 500 torque....490 hp.....red line 6200........:chevy
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Size matters.
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Originally Posted by OzzyTom
(Post 1569963120)
"Horses for courses" as they say..
You want reliable low down grunt... get the big block. They were designed for trucks after all. ;) By the way, the ZZ383 doesn't match a 502 in off idle torque stakes. The ZZ502 has the torque, but gets asthmatic as it nears 5000 rpm. And that's fine. Just pick the next gear and away you go. And that's OK. It's just that some of us buy and build up our vettes as real performance cars, not daily commuters, and many of us like the sound of a chev doing what it does best at 6000+. :thumbs: I'm not looking to run around town at 8k just to hear a SB scream. I have a 5.7 Hemi that will pull well past 7500 but the bottom end won't take it so she limited at 6250. The definition of "real performance cars" varies with the user, this vette will never see a road course and will be used mainly for handing out but whoopins on the street and occasionaly grudge night at the drag strip. Freight train pull is what I'm after and the sooner it comes in the better. I don't care much if it does not pull past 6k as that's tight enough for me anyway.
Originally Posted by PRATASEIS
(Post 1569964202)
546HP@6500
510TQ@4750 :thumbs:
Originally Posted by tigers123
(Post 1569965016)
You limit yourself. How aboust a carbureted ls6? Light in weight and good power.
However I do want that BB old school look when I pop the hood.
Originally Posted by ZZ71S
(Post 1569966275)
Have you thought about one of the ZZ short blocks and a cam,heads and intake
I have a zz4 and this is what I wish I would have done. Read the warranty for any GM crate engine very very closely
Originally Posted by 3JsVette
(Post 1569963007)
As long as we're adding to the list you also might want to think about the aluminum head ZZ454. In a recent Super Chevy test (3/09) it made close to 500 (491 to be exact) horse power which is not too bad for a motor that's advertized at 440.
$6k + a cam and she's just this side if a ZZ502 and I leave 2k in my pocket for that billet pulley set up from March or Billet specialties. Gonna be hard not to go that route. |
If you're going to all the trouble to go BB...might as well get a good one.
Find a builder doing 540-555's....get good heads on it..and cut back on the cam. The cam is what will give you all the manners....and an extra 40+ cubes is HUGE! They look the same on the outside and you end up with a better block and internals. The ZZ502's are anemic to me unless you add a good cam etc. I sold my old Camaro to a buddy less my iron headed oval port 427 with a nice little flat tappet cam. The 427 would walk all over the 502 all day long. It's dead by 5200 rpm. Once you move into the larger motors, you will soon forget all that *it's all about TQ..and low rpm TQ*. You will quickly find that TQ at higher RPM is a LOT easier to control...a LOT more fun...and a LOT faster!! 6500-7000 rpm is nothing for these type motors with a decent valvetrain in them. There's a lot of performance in that extra 1000 rpm! JIM |
ZZ502 but it needs a bigger cam. GM's cams are all on the small side.
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I am seeing a consistent mantra of the ZZ motors needing bigger cams, with the factory cam in a ZZ502, what is the idle like? A little chop is fine but it needs to pull enough vacuum to run the brakes ect.
Maybe I am overestimating how radical the idle is in these things?? |
Originally Posted by mtcraigco
(Post 1569969608)
I am seeing a consistent mantra of the ZZ motors needing bigger cams, with the factory cam in a ZZ502, what is the idle like? A little chop is fine but it needs to pull enough vacuum to run the brakes ect.
Maybe I am overestimating how radical the idle is in these things?? Take a look at this 630hp 502 build and see how mild that cam is as well. http://www.gilbertracingparts.com/Ch...timate_502.cfm More engine ideas here: http://www.gilbertracingparts.com/start.cfm |
Originally Posted by SteveG75
(Post 1569970025)
The ZZ502 cam specs out a 224/234@.050" lift. That is a street cam for a 350/383. A 502 will calm that cam right down. There is a reason that the ZZ502 has a 5800 rpm and peaks at 5200 rpm, not enough cam.
Take a look at this 630hp 502 build and see how mild that cam is as well. http://www.gilbertracingparts.com/Ch...timate_502.cfm More engine ideas here: http://www.gilbertracingparts.com/start.cfm |
Originally Posted by mtcraigco
(Post 1569969608)
I am seeing a consistent mantra of the ZZ motors needing bigger cams, with the factory cam in a ZZ502, what is the idle like? A little chop is fine but it needs to pull enough vacuum to run the brakes ect.
Maybe I am overestimating how radical the idle is in these things?? |
And that sums it up pretty good for me, if I can't keep a $6k 490hp 454 hooked up, why spend $12k just to not be able to hook up a 625HP 550 or whatever.:willy:
It seems the ZZ454 will do everything I want and have plenty of room for more HP later on, for $2k or more less than the next BB option. I DO want the aluminum heads and it seems that getting them on the ZZ454 is about 1k less than getting a short block and buying a pair so it's a good value from that standpoint to. The ZZ454 just seems like the way I'll go, drop a 502 cam in it for a bit more breathing and maybe a different intake and call it good. Thanks to 3JsVette for the suggestion! :cheers: |
Originally Posted by mtcraigco
(Post 1569970818)
And that sums it up pretty good for me, if I can't keep a $6k 490hp 454 hooked up, why spend $12k just to not be able to hook up a 625HP 550 or whatever.:willy:
It seems the ZZ454 will do everything I want and have plenty of room for more HP later on, for $2k or more less than the next BB option. I DO want the aluminum heads and it seems that getting them on the ZZ454 is about 1k less than getting a short block and buying a pair so it's a good value from that standpoint to. The ZZ454 just seems like the way I'll go, drop a 502 cam in it for a bit more breathing and maybe a different intake and call it good. Thanks to 3JsVette for the suggestion! :cheers: Good luck with what ever you decide. :cheers: |
Thanks, I am still looking at a 502 short block with a top end kit, it'd put the 502 around 600HP for the same money, (a bit less actually) as the ZZ502 Turnkey Crate motor.
BUT that takes me back to getting the HP to the street. :willy: Well at least I have solidly decided to go Big Block, that's progress! |
zz502 with top end kit :thumbs::thumbs:
My nr 605 hp @ 5500rpm 600trq @ 4700rpm :cheers: |
Why not the bargainmotor zz454 with nearly 500 brake hp ?. (Proven underrated engine)
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Originally Posted by Big454
(Post 1569985718)
zz502 with top end kit :thumbs::thumbs:
My nr 605 hp @ 5500rpm 600trq @ 4700rpm :cheers:
Originally Posted by AnTra
(Post 1569985790)
Why not the bargainmotor zz454 with nearly 500 brake hp ?. (Proven underrated engine)
ZZ502 with Edelbrock performer TE kit 600/600 at $7600.00 ZZ454 with same top end kit (for it) 540/?? (I'd assume at least 540 ft lbs) at $6500 $1100.00 diff in price and 75 less HP/TQ (give or take) I wish it was $2k diff, then it'd be easier to decide but I am leaning towards the 454 and putting the rest towards a fuel injection set up for it. Big454, how does that 600/600 stay hooked up? Can you actually use the power or is it just too much to get to the ground? Same question to anybody else in the 500/500 + range. I need a beer to help me think! :cheers: |
Originally Posted by mtcraigco
(Post 1569986750)
Big454, how does that 600/600 stay hooked up? Can you actually use the power or is it just too much to get to the ground?
Same question to anybody else in the 500/500 + range. :cheers: More than that power level, and you need to learn respect. You need to learn that the pedal on the right has more than two positions! :thumbs: 600 horses can only be tamed by judicious use of your right foot. Isn't it better to know there's more power than you really need. |
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