Interesting that you bring up "elitism".

I love it when some of the same people in here who accuse me of "elitism" for my comments on the wide body craze in here, are some of the very same ones who don't hesitate to look down their noses at Mustangs, the Nissan GTR and the upcoming Camaro.

"Its still not a Vette", they'll be quick to tell you. "Its an overbloated, butt ugly pig no matter how much power it makes," they'll go on.

But when I say: "Its still not a Z", when I see one of these wide bodys.... guess what happens. Some in that same crowd I refer to above call me "elitist". ;)

Not saying you of course.

But if GM simply slaps Z06 body panels onto a base Corvette, ...same as some of these "craftsmen" "auto designers" and "coach builders" :D in here have already done, and calls it a "Grand Sport", why would it be fair for me to be outspoken and critical of those "craftsmen" :D and not GM when GM would have effectively done the same thing?

i'm guessing 450hp on the GS

:lol:

So wouldn't the Grand Sport "if" it had the widebody be a attempt to make a car to look like a model which it is not?

I'd like to see 506HP and a widebody :leaving:

My Turn! My Turn! :D

I'm guessing that the GS will also have a combination Z51 and F55 as its suspension.

We're always talking about combining those suspension packages - this would be a great vehicle to do that with.

And maybe it will bring peace on earth for all of the z51 & f55 haters out there. :)

If all they are going to do is slap Z06 body panels on it, then whats the point???

Hell, you can do that. Come to think of it, you did. :D

If the Grand Sport turns out to be nothing more than another base Vette with Z06 body panels on it then I will refer to it as the faux Z06 which it would then be. If its just an esthetically dolled up base Vette, with Z06 style body panels on it, wheels, tires, brakes, and not much else, then to me its nothing more than a wannabe.

If the Grand Sport has superior performance capabilities than the base Vette, ie more power, etc. to distinguish itself from the base cars in it's year model line up, as have the Z06 and the ZR1, then I'll give it it's props.

However if its just a "handling package" like the Z51, with wide fenders bolted onto it, nope.

If all that it is, is a handling package, with "gearing and coolers" etc. and it gets model status, then why not the Z51?

So it better be more than just a "handling package" with Z06 fenders, brakes and wheels on it. Otherwise its nothing more than what you called it in your above post: "a attempt to make a car to look like a model which it is not".

They would be providing a product people want. That is the point. Why is that so hard for you to grasp?

When you plaster a "Z" on your car or if GM does it, there is no performance gain, just riding the Z name, hence poseur status.

I'm just getting a kick out of your twisted logic concerning adding wider body panels and how upset it makes you, lol. You can't control everyone man, let it go...

Z Police :willy:

:lol:

Jeez, I wish. I know the A6 can handle the power because they are using it in the CTS-V.

:iagree: No kidding. Makes you wonder how much some members even know about transmissions.:lol:

:thumbs::cheers:

"Upset", no. Let me tell you what "upset" for me would be. Having to explain to inquirers and onlookers why my car looked like all the world like a Z06 but really wasn't one.

Since I don't have to do that, no, I'm hardly "upset". :thumbs:

Actually its not hard for me to grasp. And thats why I believe that they will offer it. And its why I said "look for it". I have gone on the record as saying that the wide body style will either appear across the product line, or be optional, at least in the form of the Grand Sport.

To me, its a foregone conclusion. Its already done. People have already been to the plant and claim to have seen these cars. I believe them wholeheartedly.

In other words, there will be other factory wide bodied Vettes besides the ZR1 and Z06 for 2010. And it will either be available in, or standard for all Vettes or just the Grand Sport.

Like you say, its what the people want, and its too easy for GM to do it and would probably be crazy not to. If a guy can do this in his garage, then GM can do it at the factory.

My point though was if its just a matter of adding the wide body panels to what we have already in the base C6, then how is that any different than what some of these guys have done in their own garages? How is that any different than a faux Z06 that one can build at home?

Thats why when runutzzzzz muses:

I essentially tell him that this one will say what he has always said.

What I would like is the ability to get or get close to a Z06 in convertible form. I am not sure this new model will do that, but we'll see.

Gonna be interesting at the bash. :yesnod:

Weird, RPO Z51 used to be a suspension package. What changed? No engine upgrade.

Z51 Performance Package, Performance-oriented package for the Gymkhana/Autocross enthusiast; includes extra cooling, stiffer springs and stabilizer bars, specific shock absorbers, larger brakes with cross-drilled rotors, specific tires and Z51-specific 6-speed manual when ordered with 6-speed manual transmission or performance axle ratio with 6-speed paddle shift automatic. Not available with Magnetic Selective Ride Control.

Lets keep our fingers crossed... :thumbs:
Probably won't happen but it would make me signup today!!! :cheers:

Grand sport
 

What if it has the "hot cam" ls3 480hp engine like in the GMHP catalog with wide body and special graphics and 100k mile warranty!

It's called denial.

For me, the grand sport needs to have the body, suspension, etc of the Z06 with the powertrain of the base Vette. Now, that will be really interesting.

I see your point, but its tough to see how that would result in a better performing car, than a base narrow bodied car with Z51. In other words, if they do that, I don't see how they end up with a better performing car, than it's base 2010 sibling with a narrow body. Unless they are going to use a lighter aluminum frame for it too.

And even then you probably wouldn't see much of a performance difference between it and it's base narrow bodied 2010 sibling if they had the same powertrain. I don't see how it could if they were both making the same power.

The wider body results in an increased drag coefficient.

The larger wheels, brakes, rotors and tires more unsprung mass.

This is why I question when people say that they do wide bodys for "performance".

Show me two identically factory equipped 2008 Vettes, one with it's only modifications being made into a Z06 lookalike wide bodied '08, and the other a narrow bodied stock '08, in any type of competitive driving you like, and equal drivers, my money would certainly not be on the heavier wheel and tire, more unsprung mass, worse drag coefficient wide body, if both cars were making the same power at the crank.

Of course though if GM does what you describe above for the Grand Sport, and leaves the power right with that of a base 2010 Vette look for them to tell you that it outperforms the base car in order to sell it.

Looking at that, how would it perform better in the quarter, than a base C6 without the wide body and extra weight?

Wider tires may help, but no one sticks Z06 sized runflat rears onto a base C6 looking to improve their 60ft times and ETs.

How would it beat a base C6's 0-60 time carrying these extra items? How would it have a higher top speed than it's base sibling? And if its on runflats, how would it have significantly better lap times?

But if thats all they are going to do, suspension and brake upgrades, in effect a suspension and brake package, and then give it model status, then why does the Z51 not have the same model status, since it too is essentially the same type brake and suspension package but with the same power as the non Z51 cars?

So I'm not too optimistic about this car unless they up the power. Otherwise, if this thing turns out to be simply a wide bodied C6, then they are essentially doing what many in here have already done. Add Z06 body panels to a base C6.

So I think that they are compelled to up the power, if not for all base C6s, then most certainly for the Grand Sport. I don't see them leaving the power at 430-436 and then sticking a wide body kit and decals on it and expecting people to take it seriously just because its "wide".