vette ruminator

As I watched the C6R vette take the victory at Sebring this weekend, it occurred to me as a newbie Le Mans series race fan that I don't understand why there are both GT1 and GT2 classes. The GT class is surely different than the P1 and P2 class, as those cars do not even remotely resemble street machines while the GT class does. Why are the Vette, Aston Martin, and Saleen in GT1 class, while Ferrari, Porsche, Panoz, BMW, and others I may have forgotten are in GT2? I don't get the difference. Can anyone enlighten me?

dgrawr

I'm not sure, but I think it's HP or weight, or HP-weight ratio.

BigJoe

Classes are set up to group cars into similar performance categories. If you look at a club like SCCA you will see 20-30 different classes for various different cars. Just makes things fairer. No way a Porsche, of the type competing at ALMS, could compete with a C6R...

MichaelB

ALMS info Click Here
Rules Click Here

micro

The GT2 class has cars with usually less modifications than the front-engined cars in GT1. I think they have steel disc brakes while the GT1 cars use carbon fiber disc brakes.

Correct me if I am wrong, but isn't the Saleen S7R more production-based that the Corvette C6-R, Aston Martin DBR9, and the Ferrari 550/575? Road & Track has said the S7R uses the same steering rack as the production S7. The only other mid-engine GT1 car is the Lamborghini Murcielago R-GT.

check these links

http://www.ultimatecarpage.com/frame...hp&carnum=1754

Saleen S7R from 2004

http://seriouswheels.com/top-Saleen-S7R.htm

AU N EGL

There is another aspect also

GT1 are Factory based teams with Factory paid drivers. The C6R has C6 ( Not C6zo6) production frame rails and the rear bumper is the stock rear bumper of theZ06, except in carbon fiber.

GT2 may have some factory backing and ONE Factory paid driver.

Based on the rules someone could take a C6 or a C6ZO6 and addapt to GT2 rules.

The NEW GT3 racing in europe is to be more of a Gentlemans racing, the owner of the car is the driver.

When you read though the rules it can be very confusing as to which is which.

Red Gump

why hasn't anyone done this??? I always thought it was a displacement issue but the panoz cars debunked that. vettes in gt2 would make for a nice round class.

AJRocketeer

I think they all have carbon brakes.

The S7R was built before the S7...in 02 or 03 restrictions were added because Saleen had not made enough street cars, while the race car had been out of a few years.

AU N EGL

Lets see. Buy a ZO6 for 80 grand, spend 40 to 50 grand more for conversions, another 50 grand on spares, 100+ grand on hauler.
and that is before you get to the first race.

So I would guess your out 1/2 mill before the first race.

AND you can never run just one car. and each car needs lots of its own spares.
Brand new team into ALMS ??? darn close to a mill BEFORE the first green flag.

I would not be suprised that just taking a two car team with all the equipment and personal to Lemans would also be close to a million for the one race.

Solofast

It goes way back the mid sixties, when there were two GT classes, the prep rules were the basically the same for each class (production based cars with some body mods and the engine had to be based on that of the production model, but things like cams and mods within the basic castings were free), the difference being that there was a line at two liters, bigger you were in GT class and under that you were in GTU. Later that grew to 2.5 liters (to keep Porsche happy cause the stopped making 2 liter motors) and so there was amost always two GT classes.

Now it is a lot harder to figure out what car goes in what class. Used to be that you could look at the car from the outside and know if it was a GTO or GTU car, but not anymore.....

This is just one of the reasons that endurance racing has a lot of problems with getting anybody to watch it.... If you are going to have more than one class then all of the cars of any make and model should be in the same class. Otherwise it gets so confusing that it isn't worth bothering, by the time you get an hour into a 24 hour race you don't know what the h is going on........

BrianCunningham

Chevy used to run a customer C5R in the lower class. As I recall it had a 5.7L engine as opposed to a 7.0L engine.

vette ruminator

Thanks for the input. It's great that the vette has won many ALMS races, but considering there seem to be only 3 teams in GT1, it's not quite as big a deal to me. If there was some way to even out the field and have the vette in the same class as Ferrari, Porsche, Panoz, etc. it would be more fun and a greater accomplishment to win...

95jersey

I don't think money has anything to do with it. All the figures you quoted above will get you in Speed GT, no even ALMS. No, as long as their are Corvette's running in GT1 in ALMS, you will NEVER see them in any other class. GM in cooperation with ALMS would both crush it immediately.

AU N EGL

Look at the two other european teams that run in GT1 / ELMS, both cars are older P&M C5R and C6Rs. Calloway has the C6ZO6R for GT3 and sponsored in part by Corvette Europe, which is a GM company I think.

The only places to really see Corvette run / race that are not factory efforts are World Challange and T1.

Westwopper

The Sebring race was pretty good. The GT2 class is has a great mix of cars and is probably the best class:

Multimatic: is running the Panoz cars and they are pretty quick and reliable. I couldn't believe the 50 car finished, let alone won at Sebring. Note, Sebastian Bourdais was driving the 50 car as was David Brabham.

The Porsches are headed up by:

Alex Job, running only one car this year with a pretty good line up including Mike Rockenfeller (factory driver).

Peterson has Jorg Burgmeister who is always fast.

Risi is running a Ferrari F430. I worked with them for the practice week and the race. They were the fastest car. With a bit of luck, they would have won Sebring. Giving up 20 seconds per stop was hurting them. They were having an issue getting the wheels on and off the car. They also changed brake pads twice, but that was not costing them time. Melo was wicked fast at night gaining 1.5 sec a lap, but had to get out when his cool suite was not hooked up.

PTG BMW's will be fast when they get the cars sorted out. The rough track broke suspension on their cars.

Lexus should have cars by Houston or Mid Ohio... we shall see.

The Spykers will run Sebring and LeMans. They were not prepared for a surface as rough as this.

GT1 is basically a Ford Vs. Chevy affair. The Fords were faster in a straight line, but the Vettes broke better and their tires were a bit better as the Vettes were able to run faster lap times longer.

LMP1.... The Diesel Audi is a bit faster than the Lola AER V8turbos. I've never seen diesel like what the audi is using. It evaporates pretty quickly when spilled. The car is earily quiet.

LMP2.... The Porsche is almost fast enough to win overall. Could have won Sebring outright but for a few electrical issues.

If anyone wants some pictures, drop me a PM and i'll email them so someone can host them.

Regards,
Tony