Z-Dreaming

I have heard that Zaino is the best for medium to light paint colors. I've heard that Blackfire is best for dark paint colors. Normally I would go with the Zaino since I've heard great testimonials from fellow members, but I recently heard that Blackfire was specially formulated for dark colors, and gives more of a shimmering wet look than Zaino. This same person loves Zaino on his other car, but described the Zaino on his black paint to resemble being wrapped in plastic. He said it looked good, but felt Blackfire was better on dark colors.
http://store.yahoo.com/classic-motor...acwhatdif.html

http://store.yahoo.com/classic-motoring/blaccomkit.html

Since I have polo green, I would like some opinions from everyone before I invest in one of the cleaning kits.





[Modified by Z-Dreaming, 4:04 PM 12/20/2002]

DsC5

I've also heard good things about blackfire, but never used it. Between the two - I can't imagine it being any better than Zaino, it is outstanding.

However, on dark cars, I have found Pinnacle Souveran to look better - on our black Z06 - Zaino didn't do it justice. Don't get me wrong, it looked great, but not as good as I expected. Light colored cars are a different story - Zaino hands down is the best on our white coupe. P21s is also supposed to be a great wax, but as with all carnaubas - durability is not very good.

Bottom line - I'm not a huge fan of Zaino on dark colors. I think carnaubas look better. I don't think there are many people who have tried Blackfire on this board - but hopefully someone has some advice. :seeya

Z-Dreaming

Thanks, hopefully a few members have tried it.

I posted this question on the general forum, but before anyone could answer, a moderator locked the thread and told me to try here. I thought that was unfair because other members post waxing/Zaino related threads there without being locked down. I emailed the moderator to ask why, yet no reply. I think there might be a double standard in this place, but I'm trying hard not to go off on what I perceive as Napoleonic power trips by some of the moderators. By the way, where is it ok to discuss a subject like that?

Anyway I just assumed that the majority of members visited that board, and I wasn't even aware that this one existed. I noticed on one of the links that I posted, the kit includes a claybar, & clay Lubricant by Pinnacle, so I wonder if they are connected in some way?

MaSTeRofDZaSTeR

Wow I never heard of Blackfire. Better than Zaino for darks? This I gotta see. Zaino is one serious shine. I couldn't really imagine anything better...........although I do see how it could be lookin like it's wrapped in plastic. I'd love to try this Blackfire or Pinnacle Sovereign. I'll check em out this week asap. :thumbs:

DsC5

Classic Motoring Accessories(CMA) - the company you linked to - offers many packages of polishes, waxes, clay, quick detailers, etc. Blackfire is, from what I understand, a product manufactured by or subbed out and distributed by CMA. Pinnacle is a separate company - and all of their products are first rate. Expensive, but first rate. I bought a kit from http://www.autogeek.net - it included the Pinnacle Paintwork Cleansing Lotion, the tin of Souveran wax, the Crystal Mist detail spray, some microfiber towels and a microfiber applicator. I use the MF towels only on windows, they work great, and I really like the MF applicator for the wax.

As for the claybar - the Mothers clay bar which is readily available at most auto part stores works very well, as does the Zaino bar, if you go that route. If you go to http://www.zainobros.com and email Sal, he can put you in touch with a local distributor. Either choice - Zaino or Pinnacle is great. Zaino will be more reflective and glossy, Pinnacle will be a bit deeper. Both look great. Zaino has the added bonus of being much, much more durable. It all comes down to personal preference, there is no bad choice. :seeya

DetailingDude

I have tried both Zaino and Blackfire and they are both excellent products. There are a few others out there that are excellent on dark color cars: Pinnacle Souverign and Lusso Oro..... and they both have excellent durability as well.

Z-Dreaming

Great, I look forward to your evaluation. Since I'm probably going to be buying an entire kit, I want to make the right choice. Zaino was the direction I was leaning in since so many members swear by it, but when I ran into the guy who has a black vette, I'm now not so sure. He also said that Blackfire gives him the deeper look of cannuba wax (which he said looks better on black), with the durability of a polymer.

DSC5 & Detailing Dude

Thanks for your replies. I know Zaino is a good choice, but with polo green I'm trying to decide if I want a separate polish for it. I'm definitely going to use Zaino on my 50th Anniversary 300ZX (Pewter over Black), but the vette and sub (dark metallic Blue over Beige) give me reason to consider the Blackfire.

Hopefully a few other members have tried the Blackfire to give an opinion. My New Years resolution (at least one of them) is to spend an entire weekend in Jan to do every car, truck (and maybe bike) I own.

Either that, or give the product to a detailer and pay them to do it :D

Intermezzo

I tried the newest version of Blackfire and had a lot of problems with the product smearing up. I applied the product as thinly as possible and tried every kind of towel for wipe-up. I even tried letting the product dry overnight, but to no avail. I'd be happy to send you a sample if you'd like (I've got a whole bottle of it that I'm not going to use).

The first two versions of BF didn't have this "smearing" problem and shined the paint pretty well. The early versions did in fact shine like a carnauba wax....however, I wasn't too happy with the durability.

I currently use P21S (paint cleanser + wax) on my black car and am happy with the way it looks, but I'll be switching over to Z this weekend and will be using Z exclusively on all my cars.


[Modified by Intermezzo, 5:50 PM 12/23/2002]

Z-Dreaming

Sure, I'll take you up on the offer, thanks. :)

I take it by your comment that the first few versions weren't as good as promised based on the durability. Approximately what was it's durability compared to Zaino?

As to the new version, I'll check with CMS and ask them why the stuff is smearing.

Intermezzo

Sure, e-mail me your address and I'll drop it in the mail as soon as I can.

I've actually only tried the first version of BF. A second version came out but from what I've heard, it didn't help all that much with durability. The first version would last about as long as a traditional carnauba wax (1-2 months).

DetailingDude

There are other natural waxes that have excellent durability:

Pinnacle and Lusso because of their useage of Montan Wax.

Intermezzo

This is taken directly from the website of the company that manufacturers Pinnacle:

"We do not use any bees wax, Montan wax, Palm wax or paraffin in our formulas. We pack our waxes with the maximum amount of Ivory Carnauba possible. If we put in more Carnauba, the wax would be impossible to apply."

Now, I realize that with the exception of Zaino, the last person one should trust when trying to get information about a product is the company that is trying to sell you the stuff. But it couldn't be stated any clearer that CMA's pinnacle line does not contain any Montan wax. Has your company done any testing on Pinnacle? I've used both Pinnacle Souveran and Paste Glaze.....neither product had durability worth writing home about...


[Modified by Intermezzo, 5:36 PM 12/24/2002]

hcvone

Well Tony one of of two is not that bad. ;)