lager99

and it sure doen't seem to bead like it does with just Pinnacle Souveran. I topped it with NXT...I think I'll stick to the caranuba, it was easier too.

ZaneO

You topped Souveran with NXT?

lager99

Yip.

ZaneO

Oh, just wondering...usually you want to put the sealant under the carnauba.

KLO

I think Zane will agree with me, bad move, NXT is a cleaner wax thereby removing the Souveran which is a non cleaner wax.... BTW, The Wax Test by www.gurureports.org rated Pinnacle Paste Glaz which is 1/2 the cost of 70 bucks (their tested price) just as high as the Souveran................

ZaneO

There is a chance that the cleaners/abrasives in NXT removed some or all of the NXT, but if it gives you the results desired, have fun and be happy

lager99

I've read on Autogeek where they layered pinnacle & Wolfgang in different orders depending on the color, trial & error for different results. That may be the case though.

The Souveran will last for a long time, I really don't like any of the liquid stuff personally.

ZaneO

Wolfgang and NXT are quite different products.

My personal opinion and preference when topping is that one should layer as many coats of sealant as desired, then top with the desired coats of wax.

Like I said, if it makes you happy, good for you

lager99

It didn't make me happy. I'll try that next time. Why layer a sealant with multiple layers?

ZaneO

The same reason you would layer anything...added protection and appearance.

Won't do much good to use more than a couple of coats of NXT due to the cleaners/abrasives.

You might be interested in trying AIO. It will clean the paint well, make a great base for any product you use, and add some protection.

lager99

I was always happy with Souveran, just had a free bottle of NXT & wanted to try it.

ZaneO

MANY people swear by the AIO/Souveran combo

0Killrwheels@Autogeek

KLO no offense but the Guru's Wax Report is over three years old and testing started October 2001. Since then almost every product has been modified and some even discontinued. Paste Glaz was discontinued at the end of the last holiday season, although some may still be found at retailers. Sig Series brought the bar closer to Souveran and the choice to replace was obvious. Their is a difference between Paste Glaz, Sig Series, Souveran Liquid, and Souveran Paste but the line now covers all price points and hobbist to experienced detailer alike.

lager99

what's AIO?

0Killrwheels@Autogeek

http://www.autogeek.net/klasseallinone.html

ZaneO

AIO is a *very* versatile cleaner/polish/protectant that does a great job of helping prep the paint surface for a wax or sealant. There are many places to purchase it from including Autogeek.

Anthony Orosco

Water beading is not a gauge for wax being present on the finish. Ideally you want water to sheet on your car, not bead. With sheeting gravity pulls water from the cars surface, thus leaving less of a chance for water spotting. Water beads will act like tiny magnifying glasses which can cause severe etching in your paint, wax or no wax.

Water beads will form on a car with no wax at all so again it is not what you should use as a gauge.

Layering does little to nothing at all for waxed surfaces as all paste and liquid waxes contain solvents, thus one layer will effect the layer it is being laid upon, creating diminishing effects. Sealants can be layered but you should give it time to properly bond, crosslink with the painted finish before applying another layer. Then you can wax, just make sure it is not a wax designed to be a cleaner/wax.

Anthony

KLO

Yes, the test is a little old, they are supposed to do a Wax Test 2 I am told for the newer products, even out product that won the whole thing, Zaino Z-2, has been changed since then.

I think you will agree, that everyone here could learn some things about car car products in general if they had a copy of it, I am sure you have a copy correct?

KLO

Sal Zaino on water beading:

Water Beading and Sheeting... as a Measure of Durability

Almost all polishes, waxes, etc. bead water initially. As they are removed, breakdown or dissipated by washing, exposure to sunlight and heat, expansion and contraction, abrasion, abrasion from pollen and other pollutants, the water beading is diminished. This is due to the reduction in surface tension of the polish or wax once it is removed or breaks down.

If the surface has any protection when there is no water beading is the subject of much controversy. Especially when the polish or wax exhibits good water beading immediately after the initial application. If there is any protection left, how would one know? There are no scientific tests to my knowledge that can determine this. Most consumers and especially wax/polish manufacturers use the reduction in the height, contact angle and diameter of water beading as a gauge to know when to re-apply polish/wax for continued protection.

If a polish/wax gives water beading initially but then stops beading after washing, part of the polish formula has been removed. If this happens, is there any protection left???? Was the chemical or film that caused the water beading also the protection????

If a manufacturer claims that their polish/wax will bead water initially and then magically change to sheeting... I say impossible!!!! Let them prove that the polish/wax film protection initially applied is still there...

Until a specific test is developed and not some fake, razzle-dazzle test, these questions will remain unanswered and I will continue to use water beading, (height, contact angle and diameter) as a major factor in gauging a polish/wax protection.

P.S. Please remember that healthy paint will bead water without any polish/wax applied. This confuses many people to believe a polish/wax is lasting longer than they think.

To test your polish/wax, you must measure the water beading of your paint (height, contact angle and diameter) without any polish/wax applied. Next, measure the water beading of your paint (height, contact angle and diameter) within 24 hours after initially applying your polish/wax. This is your starting point. This will also be the gauge for determining the water beading (longevity, duration and changes) for that specific product. As the water beads start to diminish (get wider and shallower and loses contact angle), the polish/wax and its film protection factor is going away. When the water beading is the same as before you apply your product, the polish/wax and its protection are gone.

Jet-Jock

This comment in not in contrast to what Sal stated, but more so on the properties of water. Naturally it wants to attract to itself, and each bead or drop is attracted to an adjacent bead or drop.

It really depends on how the water gets on the finish. I'll post a few pictures to demonstrate this below. If it is a sprinkle or light rain, it will bead generally in small beads. If the surface is flooded a very high percent of the water on the finish will stick together and sheet off leaving very little water remaining.

In the pictures below, I use them to demonstrate how to let the water itself dry the car, well most of it, and your left with just a few water drops to wipe or blow off.

After one is finished with washing the vehicle and sprays it off, turn off the hose and remove the spray nozzle. Then turn on the hose about 1/3 volume and holding the end a safe distance from the body flood each surface and pull the water away quickly. Of course highest point first, roof - hood/rear deck - sides/wheels.

In the first picture I just finished a Z7 wash and sprayed it off. The finish has a week old Z5 application:



Then I removed the nozzel, flooded the surface and the water sticks together and sheets off leaving just a few beads. The results is less chance of water spot and a less towels to dry it.



If the vehicle is outside and it rains, a fresh polish/wax/sealant is going to bead. I would consider the ideal situation as: after the water beads that the beads attract to themselves - collect and the heavy weighted beads roll off the surface.