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This post has absolutely nothing to do with the subject at hand.
With respect to the OP's question as to whether or not GM corvette has an ethical or moral compass....my response absolutely has something to do with the subject. My response is intended for the OP as a C7Z06 owner to understand another option that may be available to him in dealing with GM. Doesn't really matter what your perception of my response is, so long as the OP gets it.
From a factual perspective since your response to my post has nothing to do with the OP's question regarding GM Corvette's ethical or moral compass, it is really your response that has absolutely nothing to do with the subject at hand.
Last edited by Shinobi'sZ; 11-11-2019 at 07:03 PM.
Again, with one exception, everyone pretty much has been proactively supportive, not just to me, but to all of our fellow Vette enthusiasts. Just to clarify a couple of points that some of you have addressed, yes, the car after market warranty is fully accepted by both of the Chevrolet dealers we prefer and trust. Thanks for that question...
And yes, the car had a full CARFAX report and warranty. But, I was surprised to discover that there is little or no protection under such CARFAX warranties if respective State DMVs have been prevented or circumvented from easily gaining access to the true history of any vehicle in question. The way that GM and perhaps their two partners, Ron Fellows & Spring Mountain, process the ownership trail of these cars makes it very unlikely that the affected DMVs and CARFAX type entities can readily or reasonably provide any meaningfully accurate information. And, that is why CARFAX warranties under such deceptive GM practices are virtually useless to the consumer. Is it possible that Spring Mountain and The Ron Fellows operations don’t really understand how GM is masking the histories of these cars? That certainly is a possibility and I hope it is the actual case.
What we (yes, “we” as in “my wife and I” ... Really??) have uncovered is that GM intentionally and willfully makes it difficult for DMVs and entities like CARFAX to do their jobs in the manner they would normally desire. We have documentation that shows that GM blocks the warranties on the cars that will be used in the racing partnership before the cars ever begin to move down the Bowling Green assembly line.
Before these vehicles, Chevrolet C7’s, C7 Z06’s, C7 ZR1’s, and Cadillac CTS V’s, are even first entered into the GM Warranty tracking computer databases, these cars have already been documented in writing to have ZERO drivetrain, steering, and brake warranties. Yet, GM subsequently allows these vehicles to be entered into the warranty tracking databases as being fully and completely warrantied as are any other new GM vehicles.
Even raising the side issue of GM’s ability or inability to track personally owned vehicles that are privately raced by their owners is disengenious at best, illogical, and the type of completely unrelated red herring that I would expect the racing partnership and GM to put forth as a distraction.
One individual has blatantly accused me of trying to scam the GM warranty program and also to intentionally lie to fellow Corvette Forum members in some supposed attempt to scam them as well when I resell this car. I will not directly respond to anything from such individuals now or in the future. This Forum doesn’t need such unjustified and unwarranted defamatory behaviors and the resulting food fights. So I will not play.
If it is not already obvious, my intent and desire by raising these issues is to protect future purchasers of used Corvettes from being denied the information that should be readily available to DMVs, CARFAX type entities, and should be readily documented in the normal GM Warranty Tracker system. If I was trying trying to scam you folks I probably wouldn’t have provided the vehicle VIN# from the outset and discussed my situation so openly. My situation simply is what it is. The dealer, myself, and CARFAX all missed the subtle hints that might otherwise have indicated that there was some kind of issue with this car. But, for anyone to espouse a defense of GMs practice of intentionally failing to fully and openly disclose the histories of their own racing vehicles and the lack of warranties on such racing cars is incomprehensible.
Luckily, I purchased from a completely stand up dealership which said from the outset, “Bring it back for a full refund or we will renegotiate the deal and give you a full extended warranty ... your choice.”
Again, I was fortunate to have dealt with a quality ethical dealership. Others in the future may not be so fortunate. That is my concern.
In that vein, I have a proposal. I think that there should be a permanent “GM Blocked Warranty Warnings” Sticky thread in the C7, C7 Z06, and the C7 ZR1 Forum sections where people like myself can disclose our stories and fully disclose that yes, we unknowingly purchased GM Spring Mountain cars, and here is how others can spot the telltale signs, and either avoid the traps or seek redress by GM. There should also be a similar warranty warning Sticky in the C8 Forum section, as undisclosed unwarrantied C8 vehicles will likely be flowing into the GM, Ron Fellows, Spring Mountain racing operation by March and likely show up in the marketplace by maybe August or September.
I can almost guarantee that GM is already ordering these new C8 cars for their own racing account and has already designated in writing that they will have blocked warranties but will continue the deceptive practice of entering them into the GM Warranty Tracker System as being fully warrantied in all respects. My only goal is to help Mary and Tadge to recognize that these behaviors must stop and that such action and change in policy will benefit both Corvette and the Corvette community.
Should the Corvette Forum decide to create such Sticky warnings, they hereby have my complete permission to enter my car and the VIN# under my Forum Name as the first vehicle owner to have fully self disclosed the information that GM should be readily disclosing to all DMVs, all used Corvette purchasers, and the various CARFAX type consumer entities without hiding in the shadows of the Internet.
Lastly, yes, “Caveat Emptor” should always be a watchword phrase for all of us. However, “Caveat Emptor” should not be the ethical policy downfall by which GM intentionally deals with some Corvette consumers.
Carfax is a joke, don't ever rely on a Carfax report - simply put Carfax report is as good as WHAT WAS OFFICIALLY REPORTED as in tied to that VIN#.
As most of you know plenty, and I mean plenty of people have accidents they don't care to pay deductibles on or risk premium increases, so they fix/repair the problem OFF THE RADAR.
Those cars will show a clean Carfax all day long. Forget Carfax it skims the surface and is just a tool but by no means the answer to a clean car. If it's too good to be true it's because generally speaking it is - go with your Gut first and then paperwork to sort it out and remember IT'S ALWAYS ABOUT THE MONEY no matter who the manufacturer is...
Funny how DC motors who sells the SM school cars even discloses on the internet that these cars have a flagged warranty but the OP's completely stand up dealership did not. The OP wants GM to do his home work while state and federal law already requires disclosure of things like a flagged warranty. He makes it sound like GM is trying to hide something while they make it very clear that the School cars will not be warrantied for drive train. While the OP make a big deal about the cars having the warranties flagged while the cars are on the assembly line, that would only make sense as they know where the cars are headed.
I am sorry but the OP is playing the victim card against the big mean company. But the company did not sell him the car. They flag all school car warranties for obvious reasons, and his completely stand up dealership was the one who lied to him about the warranty.
Oh and if he thinks anyone else will post their vin number as a flagged warranty car, he is more delusional than I thought. Why would anyone flag their car publicly as a car that once was a driving school car??? Once all warranties are over one would not disclose that history nor would they be required to do so. This would be a permanent ding on your car that would follow it for it's life....as well as diminish value.
Last edited by Road machine; 11-12-2019 at 12:40 PM.
I think multiple things happened here, OP is the 4th owner now, SM were the first ones. Per OP, GM did notify one of the previous owner about warranty block. Looks like that didn't got properly disclosed on sale. Or it was disclosed but final selling dealership didn't care about it and dropped the ball. GM did nothing wrong in this.
If I were in this situation, I would have simply returned the car and took my money back. OP mentioned in another thread that he paid $69.5K for this, I can get a brand new Z for a few grands more which gets me latest tech and full warranty and all the other benefits like SM school etc. Granted you won't find a loaded Z for that price but I would prefer other aspects in this situation. For $69.5K, I can easily find a better garage queen that will still have the legit GM warranty.
With respect to the OP's question as to whether or not GM corvette has an ethical or moral compass....my response absolutely has something to do with the subject. My response is intended for the OP as a C7Z06 owner to understand another option that may be available to him in dealing with GM. Doesn't really matter what your perception of my response is, so long as the OP gets it.
From a factual perspective since your response to my post has nothing to do with the OP's question regarding GM Corvette's ethical or moral compass, it is really your response that has absolutely nothing to do with the subject at hand.
Reading comprehension is apparently not your strong suit.
Stripped of the self serving BS to cover his lack of due diligence the complaint was the GM general access internet website didn't list the warranty block for the VIN number. The OP found out about the warranty block by going to a GM dealer. The used car dealer didn't bother to access the correct data base or he did and hid it from the OP. The original dealer got caught and appeased the OP by providing a warranty which to the OP's satisfaction covers what was blocked and then some.
In summary the problem was with the used car dealer not GM. How this morphed into a discussion about GM's "moral or ethical compass" is just bloviating by the OP attempting to self sooth his lack of due diligence.
What other cases GM, Ford etc are involved in was/is irrelevant to the subject at hand.
It's a shame that there's not a 1-800 number one could call to verify their car's history and warranty coverage prior to purchase. It's a shame that GM doesn't man that call center free of charge that people could call before plopping down $70 large and doing zero homework. A fool and their money are soon parted. Live and learn.
Well you know in all reality doesn't matter who it is Ford, GM, Dodge - you monkey with the car stock tune, or any bolt on that directly correlates to engine wear or Tranny wear - there goes your warranty and rightfully so. Why should anyone of those manufacturers back up the product you F'ed with - I wouldn't I would tell you to go scratch your ***... simple -!
I'm a carpenter you hire me to build a gorgeous set of cabinets for you in natural wood, I build them - your wife wants white, you paint them, wife now wants natural again, am I supposed to come back and sand them - ?
Last month I purchased a used 2017 C7 Z06/Z07 3 LZ M7 with 9800 miles. Immediately before and immediately after the purchase, I followed GM Website advice and logged into the “My Chevrolet” website and the My Chevrolet App to verify how much warranty was remaining on the vehicle. (Please see the three screen captures below). On both logins, the website confirmed the expected amount of warranties remaining on each warranty, which was all based on the original owner purchase date and the known mileage.
At that time I simply couldn’t have been happier. The car was everything I expected and more. A few days later I drove it to the local Chevrolet dealer to have the $350 MRSC Update accomplished. As the Service Rep typed into his computer, he turned to me and asked, “Are you aware that your car has no warranty coverage at all?” After I recovered from feinting, he explained that GM had placed a full warranty “block” on the car.
I immediately called GM/Chevrolet Customer Service and the lady said that the car had been used as a training vehicle in a racing school. After I once again awakened from feinting, I asked about the completely contradictory warranty information on the Chevrolet website and app and why none of this warranty blocking info was properly disclosed when I inquired about remaining warranties as instructed by the GM main website.
She replied that “GM is under no legal, ethical, or moral obligation to disclose warranty blocking information on their websites and that it is their policy to never disclose such warranty block information. This has been going for three weeks now. GM keeps promising that my case has been properly referred to the GM California Warranty Office Team and that they will be in touch within 48 hours. Although I have called the main GM Customer Service number five additional times, I have still yet to hear from this “California” Team. But each time I call the main number, the story changes.
Now they claim that the car wasn’t used as a race school car, but was “tracked” by the 1st owner. My position is that I followed their website remaining warranty verification instructions and received assurance that the car was under a normal group of warranties as explained in the Owners Warranty Manual. Bottom line, I never would have purchased the car if this “warranty block” had been properly disclosed.
Now, GM claims that they can’t remove the warranty block because the block was mandated by the California DMV and the DMV will not allow GM to restore the warranty. I called the Calif DMV headquarters problem resolution center in Sacramento and they say GM is not being truthful and that DMV could care less whether or not GM decides to cancel the warranty block and restore the normal warranties.
Any thoughts or similar experience tales would be appreciated. Thanks...
The
Hey B747VET,
I see we're in the same club! I just posted my horror story on Warranty/Block on my new 70th Anniversary Edition that failed at 1753 miles. Did you ever get any resolution?
There should be a sticky on this forum about Spring Mountain cars. When I was searching in for my car I came across my dream spec 2019 edition just an hour from my house. Before pulling the trigger I had my dealer run a report on the VIN and found out the car had a warranty block due to being a SM car. As a first time Vette buyer I had no clue that was even a thing.
2 weeks later I came across the same car at a popular used Corvette dealership. They had it advertised as still having the remainder of the warranty. I called them and made them aware of the warranty block and to their credit they updated their ad.
As the tough love guy said earlier in this thread….always have a dealer run a VIN report on any used car (high performance or not) before you pull the trigger.
I purchased from a high end foreign car dealership and they have no ability to discover such warranty blocks. Only a GM dealership can access such databases. At this point, that dealership is being completely standup. I have zero problem with them. They are being completely supportive. I have offered to allow GM to have the local Chevrolet dealership completely inspect the car and then decide whether to restore the warranties committed to on their websites. GM has done this in the past through Chevrolet dealerships. It is GM who pledged that the warranties were good and it is GM who falsely blamed the warranty block on California DMV.
At this point, I feel that neither the selling dealership nor I should be required to suffer any financial penalties because of GMs unethical business practices.
go after the dealer you bought it from. See if they'll spring for a 3rd party warranty from jma or the likes. Or ask them to take the car back. Or ask them for a 5 or 10k allowance so that you can pay for repairs during the remaining days , months or years you expected to be covered under warranty.
While the car was in that dealerships possession they should have figured it out. I would stand firm on that.
go after the dealer you bought it from. See if they'll spring for a 3rd party warranty from jma or the likes. Or ask them to take the car back. Or ask them for a 5 or 10k allowance so that you can pay for repairs during the remaining days , months or years you expected to be covered under warranty.
While the car was in that dealerships possession they should have figured it out. I would stand firm on that.
Uhh, this thread was started in 2019. I think his time to return the car has passed.
11-11-2019, 06:53 PM
