ZR1 vs Z06
12-21-2014, 06:07 PM
#101
Instructor
Member Since: Aug 2014
Location: Mesa AZ
Posts: 156
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Its funny you bring that up. If there is one company that underrates their performance cars, its BMW. M5 is rated 575hp at crank, but it dynoes 589hp in rear wheels. Thats over 650hp crank. How about that?
A friend of mine trapped 125.7 mph in his stock M6 CP. 1500 miles on odometer. Thats literally 1 mph short of Z06. Difference is M6 is rated 575hp and weighs 4200 lbs pounds and Z06 is rated 650hp and weighs 3500 lbs pounds. Thats the difference between american and german engineering. One is all about "show" and "numbers", the other one is exactly like BMW says, "wolf in sheep clothing"
Jesus, you guys have a 650hp car that cannot even come close to 130 mph and weighs only 3500 lbs. Thats just terrible.
Its the typical american mentality. Always brute force. You guys **** us off? We'll drop a nuke on your head or invade your country!
We love big and powerful stuff with lots of cylinders and noise. Its like how the government threw money at the banks and car companies 8 years ago to fix the problem. Now gm throws numbers and more power instead of properly innovating. When they said this thing only comes with a torque converter, I had a good hunch on what was about to come out and it seems like I was right.
A friend of mine trapped 125.7 mph in his stock M6 CP. 1500 miles on odometer. Thats literally 1 mph short of Z06. Difference is M6 is rated 575hp and weighs 4200 lbs pounds and Z06 is rated 650hp and weighs 3500 lbs pounds. Thats the difference between american and german engineering. One is all about "show" and "numbers", the other one is exactly like BMW says, "wolf in sheep clothing"
Jesus, you guys have a 650hp car that cannot even come close to 130 mph and weighs only 3500 lbs. Thats just terrible.
Its the typical american mentality. Always brute force. You guys **** us off? We'll drop a nuke on your head or invade your country!
We love big and powerful stuff with lots of cylinders and noise. Its like how the government threw money at the banks and car companies 8 years ago to fix the problem. Now gm throws numbers and more power instead of properly innovating. When they said this thing only comes with a torque converter, I had a good hunch on what was about to come out and it seems like I was right.So you aren't an American?
12-21-2014, 06:13 PM
#102
12-21-2014, 06:22 PM
#104
Instructor
Member Since: Aug 2014
Location: Mesa AZ
Posts: 156
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
12-21-2014, 06:37 PM
#105
12-21-2014, 06:37 PM
#106
What a helpful post. Thanks for your incredible insight.
Last edited by Skullbussa; 12-21-2014 at 06:41 PM.
12-21-2014, 06:44 PM
#107
Boy how you fanboys get personal when someone talks the truth about what they experienced between cars they actually owned and drove then posted their honest opinion...
12-21-2014, 06:51 PM
#108
Last edited by Lavender; 12-21-2014 at 07:09 PM.
12-21-2014, 06:56 PM
#109
Drifting
A bit concerned of what I have been reading, I was planning on buying a new Z06.
Hmmm.......I already have a great handling, feather weight sports car. A supercharger on my 427 would save me a ton of money over a new Z06 and my performance advantage would most likely make a C7/Z06 driver go home in tears.
Hmmm.......I already have a great handling, feather weight sports car. A supercharger on my 427 would save me a ton of money over a new Z06 and my performance advantage would most likely make a C7/Z06 driver go home in tears.
12-21-2014, 07:01 PM
#110
Team Owner
A bit concerned of what I have been reading, I was planning on buying a new Z06.
Hmmm.......I already have a great handling, feather weight sports car. A supercharger on my 427 would save me a ton of money over a new Z06 and my performance advantage would most likely make a C7/Z06 driver go home in tears.
Hmmm.......I already have a great handling, feather weight sports car. A supercharger on my 427 would save me a ton of money over a new Z06 and my performance advantage would most likely make a C7/Z06 driver go home in tears.
12-21-2014, 07:07 PM
#111
Burning Brakes
12-21-2014, 07:35 PM
#112
Team Owner
Ahhhh, DerStig shows his true colors....... anti American huh? So the Corvette and Viper will butt rape your bmw's in the twisties. Isn't that what the bmw guys used to say when they had pissant motors?
BMW is irrelevant except highway cruising. They haven't made a relevant car since the V8 M3. The rest is junk, as you so aptly suggested yourself.
BMW is irrelevant except highway cruising. They haven't made a relevant car since the V8 M3. The rest is junk, as you so aptly suggested yourself.
Then left handed males too!
12-21-2014, 07:44 PM
#113
How come the timing issue does not apply to other high end forced induction cars? Porsche turbo? BMW M3, M5, M6? Mercedes AMG? Have you ever seen a board full of people complaining about obvious timing issues and slowdown after 4 pulls?
Here is a stock M6 without competition package (they are rated 560 hp crank) doing 545 whp on a dyno. There are lots of other ones online for the M5s too, some that go as high as 570 whp for a stock car : http://www.6post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=943237
BMW rates the M5 0-60 4.2s. In real life, Car and Driver got 3.7s and so did a lot of other magazines. These cars are clearly underrated. I'd much rather the manufacturer underrate their cars than deal with what GM is doing, which is clearly wrong. Again, typical mismanagement in Detroit. What do you expect from a company which has the most number of recalls in the history? I wouldn't be surprised if they recall their 100k car too.
Coming from a 575 hp 4400 lbs M5, when I heard 650 hp and 3500, I was amazed. My jaw dropped. Something inside me kept saying "it's too good to be true". But I said, no, maybe it will be good for the competition. I guess my car and the Z are in completely opposite end of the spectrums. One is clearly underrated and overperforms, the other is heavily overrated and underperforms. I'd expect the 650hp Z which GM claims beats ZR1 to easily trap 129-130mph. Instead we are seeing people losing races to the old Z06 let alone the ZR1.
Here is a stock M6 without competition package (they are rated 560 hp crank) doing 545 whp on a dyno. There are lots of other ones online for the M5s too, some that go as high as 570 whp for a stock car : http://www.6post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=943237
BMW rates the M5 0-60 4.2s. In real life, Car and Driver got 3.7s and so did a lot of other magazines. These cars are clearly underrated. I'd much rather the manufacturer underrate their cars than deal with what GM is doing, which is clearly wrong. Again, typical mismanagement in Detroit. What do you expect from a company which has the most number of recalls in the history? I wouldn't be surprised if they recall their 100k car too.
Coming from a 575 hp 4400 lbs M5, when I heard 650 hp and 3500, I was amazed. My jaw dropped. Something inside me kept saying "it's too good to be true". But I said, no, maybe it will be good for the competition. I guess my car and the Z are in completely opposite end of the spectrums. One is clearly underrated and overperforms, the other is heavily overrated and underperforms. I'd expect the 650hp Z which GM claims beats ZR1 to easily trap 129-130mph. Instead we are seeing people losing races to the old Z06 let alone the ZR1.
Last edited by DerStig; 12-21-2014 at 07:47 PM.
12-21-2014, 08:30 PM
#115
Race Director
12-21-2014, 08:33 PM
#116
Race Director
How come the timing issue does not apply to other high end forced induction cars? Porsche turbo? BMW M3, M5, M6? Mercedes AMG? Have you ever seen a board full of people complaining about obvious timing issues and slowdown after 4 pulls?
Here is a stock M6 without competition package (they are rated 560 hp crank) doing 545 whp on a dyno. There are lots of other ones online for the M5s too, some that go as high as 570 whp for a stock car : http://www.6post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=943237
BMW rates the M5 0-60 4.2s. In real life, Car and Driver got 3.7s and so did a lot of other magazines. These cars are clearly underrated. I'd much rather the manufacturer underrate their cars than deal with what GM is doing, which is clearly wrong. Again, typical mismanagement in Detroit. What do you expect from a company which has the most number of recalls in the history? I wouldn't be surprised if they recall their 100k car too.
Coming from a 575 hp 4400 lbs M5, when I heard 650 hp and 3500, I was amazed. My jaw dropped. Something inside me kept saying "it's too good to be true". But I said, no, maybe it will be good for the competition. I guess my car and the Z are in completely opposite end of the spectrums. One is clearly underrated and overperforms, the other is heavily overrated and underperforms. I'd expect the 650hp Z which GM claims beats ZR1 to easily trap 129-130mph. Instead we are seeing people losing races to the old Z06 let alone the ZR1.
Here is a stock M6 without competition package (they are rated 560 hp crank) doing 545 whp on a dyno. There are lots of other ones online for the M5s too, some that go as high as 570 whp for a stock car : http://www.6post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=943237
BMW rates the M5 0-60 4.2s. In real life, Car and Driver got 3.7s and so did a lot of other magazines. These cars are clearly underrated. I'd much rather the manufacturer underrate their cars than deal with what GM is doing, which is clearly wrong. Again, typical mismanagement in Detroit. What do you expect from a company which has the most number of recalls in the history? I wouldn't be surprised if they recall their 100k car too.
Coming from a 575 hp 4400 lbs M5, when I heard 650 hp and 3500, I was amazed. My jaw dropped. Something inside me kept saying "it's too good to be true". But I said, no, maybe it will be good for the competition. I guess my car and the Z are in completely opposite end of the spectrums. One is clearly underrated and overperforms, the other is heavily overrated and underperforms. I'd expect the 650hp Z which GM claims beats ZR1 to easily trap 129-130mph. Instead we are seeing people losing races to the old Z06 let alone the ZR1.
12-21-2014, 08:35 PM
#117
How am I making a fool of myself?
I am a potential customer. I have money, I want a 2nd car right next to my super sedan and I am shopping between a GT3 or a Z06. I am exactly the type of customer that I thought GM was trying to target with the new C7/Z06 re-modeling? Just because I am nitpicking means I am a fool? Because I am not okay with the "Chevrolet" standards and my bar is a little higher than yours? Well guess what, if they want European car owners to seriously consider this car, they have just shot themselves in the foot.
I guarantee you a tune or a price drop will come from the factory in the next 24-36 months.
I am a potential customer. I have money, I want a 2nd car right next to my super sedan and I am shopping between a GT3 or a Z06. I am exactly the type of customer that I thought GM was trying to target with the new C7/Z06 re-modeling? Just because I am nitpicking means I am a fool? Because I am not okay with the "Chevrolet" standards and my bar is a little higher than yours? Well guess what, if they want European car owners to seriously consider this car, they have just shot themselves in the foot.
I guarantee you a tune or a price drop will come from the factory in the next 24-36 months.
12-21-2014, 08:40 PM
#118
The new BMW M turbo motors are extremely durable. My M5 can take a beating lap after lap (if you have carbon ceramic brakes) in nurburgring without a hitch, no heat soak, no timing getting pulled, none of that garbage. It will lap consistently unless the driver screws it up.
In fact, what's interesting is, there hasn't been that many engine/turbo related issues with the new M motors. There has been failures, but they were regarding to differential, transmission, electronics, etc, but not the turbo. And the catch is, BMW has NEVER advertised the M3 or an M5 as a track capable car the way GM has!. That's the biggest difference between these cars! BMW is always UNDERSTATED and UNDERRATED whereas GM is IN YOUR FACE/SHOW OFF with we will do this and we will do that to get everyone riled up and never deliver! How hard is it to see this?
There is also a big difference between the regular turbo engines BMW makes and the M turbo engines.
You are just talking none sense. What I am saying here is factual statement, you are just spreading rumors. We have a guy, a Z06 owner, who owned a ZR1, coming here and saying all of this. What more do you want? We have a guy losing 7 times to the viper. We have someone else losing to the old C6Z06. We also have numerous people posting the timing issue and stating that they clearly feel the car not being as fast after moderate use. I am merely stating these facts here and share my disappointment.
Why is it so personal for you Corvette crowd? Why can't you take constructive feedback?
12-21-2014, 08:45 PM
#120
Forget about what they look like for a second. Try and understand what I am trying to say. They are totally different looking cars serving entirely different purposes. I am talking about managing expectations and the overall perception towards the brand names.