C7 Z06=Old News - 707 HP Dodge Hellcat=C7 ZR1 with 750hp
07-10-2014, 01:51 PM
#281
Race Director
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That's what the Other Cars section is for. And if it makes you feel better, the Hellcat is cool, but it ain't that cool.
07-10-2014, 02:37 PM
#282
Team Owner
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St. Jude Donor '06
I frankly would like to see all this great HP being made by all of the big 3 US Auto Makers naturally aspirate instead of supercharged, but I know that will never happen b/c of fuel mileage, gas guzzler, engine efficiency, etc. That being said I am not complaining and love to be living as a hardcore US performance car guy during these times of crazy horsepower and torque and hope it continues to last for at least several more years.
Last edited by Mopar Jimmy; 07-10-2014 at 02:45 PM.
07-10-2014, 03:03 PM
#283
Instructor
Have we discussed that the Challenger has to actually hook up to get any kind of value out of all that HP and torque? What good is it if you ain't got the grip? Any specs on the Hellcat tires? Its gonna need a lot of rubber back there...and a wear rating of like 80.
Last edited by sriser; 07-10-2014 at 05:07 PM.
07-10-2014, 03:48 PM
#284
Le Mans Master
lol just kidding. That would be funny though. Id like to know what size tires come on the hellcat also. I did a quick search but could not find the info.
07-10-2014, 05:08 PM
#286
Instructor
07-10-2014, 05:17 PM
#288
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Not that I dont like the looks of the new challenger but, Dodge is notorious for lying about horse power levels. When they first introduced the New Hemi trucks Dodge claimed them to put out 350 hp. Independant testers had the power level at 275. I could understand 345 or 340, but 275! thats stretching it too much. That is why chevy had an independant tester certify the Z06 to 505 hp. That test was done with full stock exhaust and all Accessories. Until an independant tester gets hold of the new 707 I won't believe what Dodge is rating thier car at.
There's not a SINGLE 5.7 HEMI in the world, when running right, that makes 275 on an engine dyno. That engine remain largely unchanged from 2003 to 2009, and their rwhp are very indicative of crank hp. Neither under-rated nor over-rated.
Now, if you're talking rwhp, 275 is actually very GOOD on a 3rd gen Ram. Most dyno 25x.
Why? The ancient piece of crap 545RFE. Which is an old 4 speed auto designed for the Grand Cherokee, with a 5th programmed in to call it "5 speed". In 2012, marketing reprogrammed it again to make it a useless "6 speed".
It's weak, and the HEMI is hit with severe torque management. That coupled with a transfer case in a truck, and you loose 30+% of power at the wheels.
Now, if you're talking rwhp, 275 is actually very GOOD on a 3rd gen Ram. Most dyno 25x.
Why? The ancient piece of crap 545RFE. Which is an old 4 speed auto designed for the Grand Cherokee, with a 5th programmed in to call it "5 speed". In 2012, marketing reprogrammed it again to make it a useless "6 speed".
It's weak, and the HEMI is hit with severe torque management. That coupled with a transfer case in a truck, and you loose 30+% of power at the wheels.
So many want to discount this and that because of the weight and yet they forget that little GTR over there. Yes, it did it with AWD though which will help it hook up really well. But those same people in denial forgot to add that little caveat.
I personally think the Z06 will be quicker around a track and will more than likely be quicker in the 1/4. I think tires will play a big part in the Z06 being able to hook better but who knows. You never know who will win until you line them up and race.
And for the clowns who say the Challenger interior is a joke, they must have been living in a closet the last couple of years. The interior was and has been a strong point for the Challenger. Don't discount the boys over at SRT. They have had the time to get some things worked out right for this car. The thing that makes me cringe and get pissed off is why did they wait so long to get a car in this race?
I personally think the Z06 will be quicker around a track and will more than likely be quicker in the 1/4. I think tires will play a big part in the Z06 being able to hook better but who knows. You never know who will win until you line them up and race.
And for the clowns who say the Challenger interior is a joke, they must have been living in a closet the last couple of years. The interior was and has been a strong point for the Challenger. Don't discount the boys over at SRT. They have had the time to get some things worked out right for this car. The thing that makes me cringe and get pissed off is why did they wait so long to get a car in this race?
07-10-2014, 05:25 PM
#289
Le Mans Master
I read the 0-60 times were in the mid 3 second range. Quite quick if thats true. I agree though that 275 is rather thin for a car with that kind of power lol I could be wrong but i could have sworn my 1999 LS1 Camaro Z28 came with 275's on the rears. One would think 15 years later and at about twice the horsepower there would ertainly big some big wide tires on this thing.
07-10-2014, 05:37 PM
#290
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I read the 0-60 times were in the mid 3 second range. Quite quick if thats true. I agree though that 275 is rather thin for a car with that kind of power lol I could be wrong but i could have sworn my 1999 LS1 Camaro Z28 came with 275's on the rears. One would think 15 years later and at about twice the horsepower there would ertainly big some big wide tires on this thing.
with less than half the horsepower 
07-10-2014, 05:40 PM
#291
Instructor
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Only numbers that mean anything to me will be track times(1/4 and roadcourse)because I like an all around car... I'll be the first to say(I read all 15 pages)that I can't afford any of the cars mentioned. I'll stick to my GTO's, F-bodies, and C5z's until I either get out of the Military and make real money, or they fall into my price range. I do have first hand experiance of power to weight involving the SRT8 though...
A close friend of mine has a 2013? SRT8 392, minor bolt ons untuned A5, and I had my 05 GTO with exhaust and heavier 18" wheels M6... His car struggled to keep up every time, yeah he has more HP, but he out weighted me by a significant amount... And whoever it was bashing the Chally's interior, obviously their first Vette if they owned one was a C7 because anything prior to that was garbage...
In closing, I too am excited about this modern HP war, but the vette shouldn't be the one worried, in a straight line with me in the vette, and John Force in the Hellcat, then yeah the vette is not going to win... But that says nothing about the car, go over to Camaro5 and start shaking, not CF...
A close friend of mine has a 2013? SRT8 392, minor bolt ons untuned A5, and I had my 05 GTO with exhaust and heavier 18" wheels M6... His car struggled to keep up every time, yeah he has more HP, but he out weighted me by a significant amount... And whoever it was bashing the Chally's interior, obviously their first Vette if they owned one was a C7 because anything prior to that was garbage...
In closing, I too am excited about this modern HP war, but the vette shouldn't be the one worried, in a straight line with me in the vette, and John Force in the Hellcat, then yeah the vette is not going to win... But that says nothing about the car, go over to Camaro5 and start shaking, not CF...
07-10-2014, 08:00 PM
#293
6th Gear
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Why does GM have to respond to the 707 horses from a Challenger by coming out with a ZR1? First off, it's a completely different audience and buyer. 707 horses is but a small number in a complex puzzle. The Challenger is built on a 300 platform. In other words it is a heavy car that is ill handling, so i'll handing that Chrysler has made no effort to race it against the Camaro or Mustang. 1/4 mile times are a load of crap and by no means a measure of any significant performance. Throw enough money at any car and you get over 1,000 streetable horses. Put the Challenger on a track where a variety of different handling challenges are introduced and a Z/28 or ZO6 would spank it. Why? Because, unlike Chrysler, GM has invested the engineering money and resources with a focus to produce cars that have a very specific task, yet are useable in an everyday environment. The irony in all of this is that I am a car guy, I see things for what they are, and above all am a diehard Mopar guy, but brand loyalty doesn't mean that I have to be blind to reality.
Last edited by lusospeed; 07-10-2014 at 08:03 PM.
07-11-2014, 10:33 AM
#295
I agree they are porky but everyone seems to want that comfort and toys of all kind in their cars and it all adds up to making the car heavy..I personally could care less for all the toys like nav and such things.
07-11-2014, 10:42 AM
#296
07-11-2014, 10:46 AM
#297
Le Mans Master
Tire compounds today are vastly superior to tires produced a decade ago.
Where Dodge has a chance to produce a car with this motor that trumps all other cars in its class would be the Hi HP 4dr sedan and large coupe market where the CTSV is still the current reigning champ (unless one wants to spend mega money for some foreign cars)
However, as it is for now Dodge/Chrysler is once again shooting themselves in the foot with the announced plan not to make this motor available in the Chrysler 300
The word is it will be available in a Charger, however, anyone who is able to afford a CTSV for a DD will never be satisfied driving a lowly Charger on a daily basis.
On the other hand a fully optioned out 300 may be good enough
Where Dodge has a chance to produce a car with this motor that trumps all other cars in its class would be the Hi HP 4dr sedan and large coupe market where the CTSV is still the current reigning champ (unless one wants to spend mega money for some foreign cars)
However, as it is for now Dodge/Chrysler is once again shooting themselves in the foot with the announced plan not to make this motor available in the Chrysler 300
The word is it will be available in a Charger, however, anyone who is able to afford a CTSV for a DD will never be satisfied driving a lowly Charger on a daily basis.
On the other hand a fully optioned out 300 may be good enough
07-11-2014, 10:55 AM
#298
Scraping the splitter.
Here you go...10.85 at 126 in an A8 on DR's:
Looks like the car is on Nitto NT555R's (~2:30), which makes sense since they are on 20" wheels. Trap speed of 125-126 is decent, and I'd guess they'll pick up in nice air especially being supercharged.
S.
Looks like the car is on Nitto NT555R's (~2:30), which makes sense since they are on 20" wheels. Trap speed of 125-126 is decent, and I'd guess they'll pick up in nice air especially being supercharged.
S.
