Originally Posted by ANTIVNOM

Auto or DCT, I don't care. As long as it comes with a true manual, I'm good to go. Self-shifting trannies may be faster, but they are for sissies.

Originally Posted by Snorman

Dig in, because there is going to be a long year if they start building later in 2014.
We're going to be hearing how GM cheaped out and should have offered a DCT.
We're going to be told that they should have revised the rear fascia to appease the "majority" of people who don't like the rear of the C7 (this includes that it should have had round taillights).
We're going to hear that they screwed up by not offering a bigger cube NA engine.
It's going to be bench raced to death against the C6 Z06 and ZR1, very likely with many owners of the latter telling us that it's not going to be as fast and GM is lying about its performance numbers.

Basically, the entire C7-Detractors Playbook will be brought out in full force.
S.

Originally Posted by Snorman

Dig in, because there is going to be a long year if they start building later in 2014.
We're going to be hearing how GM cheaped out and should have offered a DCT.
We're going to be told that they should have revised the rear fascia to appease the "majority" of people who don't like the rear of the C7 (this includes that it should have had round taillights).
We're going to hear that they screwed up by not offering a bigger cube NA engine.
It's going to be bench raced to death against the C6 Z06 and ZR1, very likely with many owners of the latter telling us that it's not going to be as fast and GM is lying about its performance numbers.

Basically, the entire C7-Detractors Playbook will be brought out in full force.
S.

Originally Posted by glass slipper

"Slushboxes" are from the '50s when they had fluid couplers. Those were replaced by torque converters in the '60s, lockup torque converters in the '70s, pulse width modulated (PWM) lockup torque converters in the '90s, and the 2000s brought us multi-disc PWM lockup torque converters capable of transmitting the maximum power of high performance engines in lockup mode. The 6L80 torque converter goes into lockup in 2nd gear and I'm sure the 8L90 will too. The PWM feature "pulses" the lockup clutch hydraulic pressure to achieve as much as 80-100 RPM "slippage" between the input/output of the torque converter at low RPM cruise to dampen engine vibrations due to low frequency power pulses from individual piston power strokes. The modern day torque converter has nothing in common with the old "slushbox" fluid coupler...welcome to the 21st century.

A DCT has two multi plate wet clutches that are hydraulically applied/released in a clutch to clutch architecture. The 8L90 has multiple multi plate wet clutches that are hydraulically applied/released in a clutch to clutch architecture. The same exact thing just different. There is no reason the 8L90 can't shift as fast as a DCT...they both use multi plate wet clutches and a hydraulic pump in conjunction with proportional "solenoid" valves that control the speed of the clutch engagement/shift.

I like the term "torque converter MCT" for the 8L90...it has more than two clutches so DCT wouldn't be proper. Plus, more is better.

Any standing start contest will be won handily by the 8L90 with the torque converter multiplying torque and letting the engine get up on top of its HP curve faster. They weigh about the same and efficiency will be about the same but the 8L90 will be smaller. The 8L90 will kick any DCT to the curb when it comes to drivability and you don't have to worry about the computer second guessing what you want to do. You also don't have to worry about being in the wrong gear all of a sudden since the DCT can only pre-select one gear...all gears are engaged all of the time in the 8L90.

I think if people took the time to understand 21st century automatics, we wouldn't have so many naysayers. Hopefully there will be plenty of info at the reveal but it's the proverbial "you can lead a horse to water" all over again...you can't drown them because they breathe through their butt.

Originally Posted by ByByBMW

I'm going to change the tone of this statement.
Manual shifting trannies are for sissies who are afraid to go faster.

I think I like it this way better.

Originally Posted by gthal

I guess all of the F1 drivers are sissies

Didn't GM also deliver a blue C7 to a well known Nascar driver recently who also opted for an auto? Sissy.

The misplaced testosterone and chest thumping is highly entertaining

Originally Posted by Daekwan06

Its a supercar because of the performance it delivers. Not because of who made it.

Originally Posted by glass slipper

"Slushboxes" are from the '50s when they had fluid couplers. Those were replaced by torque converters in the '60s, lockup torque converters in the '70s, pulse width modulated (PWM) lockup torque converters in the '90s, and the 2000s brought us multi-disc PWM lockup torque converters capable of transmitting the maximum power of high performance engines in lockup mode. The 6L80 torque converter goes into lockup in 2nd gear and I'm sure the 8L90 will too. The PWM feature "pulses" the lockup clutch hydraulic pressure to achieve as much as 80-100 RPM "slippage" between the input/output of the torque converter at low RPM cruise to dampen engine vibrations due to low frequency power pulses from individual piston power strokes. The modern day torque converter has nothing in common with the old "slushbox" fluid coupler...welcome to the 21st century.

A DCT has two multi plate wet clutches that are hydraulically applied/released in a clutch to clutch architecture. The 8L90 has multiple multi plate wet clutches that are hydraulically applied/released in a clutch to clutch architecture. The same exact thing just different. There is no reason the 8L90 can't shift as fast as a DCT...they both use multi plate wet clutches and a hydraulic pump in conjunction with proportional "solenoid" valves that control the speed of the clutch engagement/shift.

I like the term "torque converter MCT" for the 8L90...it has more than two clutches so DCT wouldn't be proper. Plus, more is better.

Any standing start contest will be won handily by the 8L90 with the torque converter multiplying torque and letting the engine get up on top of its HP curve faster. They weigh about the same and efficiency will be about the same but the 8L90 will be smaller. The 8L90 will kick any DCT to the curb when it comes to drivability and you don't have to worry about the computer second guessing what you want to do. You also don't have to worry about being in the wrong gear all of a sudden since the DCT can only pre-select one gear...all gears are engaged all of the time in the 8L90.

I think if people took the time to understand 21st century automatics, we wouldn't have so many naysayers. Hopefully there will be plenty of info at the reveal but it's the proverbial "you can lead a horse to water" all over again...you can't drown them because they breathe through their butt.

Originally Posted by heavychevy

Manuals are for the sissies who want to drive the car faster, not have the car drive them faster.

Originally Posted by DaveFerrari458

Who knows the Auto may perform as well or better than a DCT but even for marketing & perception purposes GM should have put a DCT in this car.

I can see how some (maybe ignorant) will start talking sh*t about GM always being behind the world and blah blah. Talking all their sh*t and bringing down the entire car while totally ignoring all the rest of the cars positives. If GM didn't have a DCT ready then they could have outsourced one for a year or two.

Originally Posted by The Clevite Kid

. . . and GM should offer an expensive DOHC engine for those who want it, and to appear super-technical - - - oh, they already did that? In 1990? Wow!

Originally Posted by DaveFerrari458

GM of today is much different than GM of the 90's.

Originally Posted by glass slipper

"Slushboxes" are from the '50s when they had fluid couplers. Those were replaced by torque converters in the '60s, lockup torque converters in the '70s, pulse width modulated (PWM) lockup torque converters in the '90s, and the 2000s brought us multi-disc PWM lockup torque converters capable of transmitting the maximum power of high performance engines in lockup mode. The 6L80 torque converter goes into lockup in 2nd gear and I'm sure the 8L90 will too. The PWM feature "pulses" the lockup clutch hydraulic pressure to achieve as much as 80-100 RPM "slippage" between the input/output of the torque converter at low RPM cruise to dampen engine vibrations due to low frequency power pulses from individual piston power strokes. The modern day torque converter has nothing in common with the old "slushbox" fluid coupler...welcome to the 21st century.

A DCT has two multi plate wet clutches that are hydraulically applied/released in a clutch to clutch architecture. The 8L90 has multiple multi plate wet clutches that are hydraulically applied/released in a clutch to clutch architecture. The same exact thing just different. There is no reason the 8L90 can't shift as fast as a DCT...they both use multi plate wet clutches and a hydraulic pump in conjunction with proportional "solenoid" valves that control the speed of the clutch engagement/shift.

I like the term "torque converter MCT" for the 8L90...it has more than two clutches so DCT wouldn't be proper. Plus, more is better.

Any standing start contest will be won handily by the 8L90 with the torque converter multiplying torque and letting the engine get up on top of its HP curve faster. They weigh about the same and efficiency will be about the same but the 8L90 will be smaller. The 8L90 will kick any DCT to the curb when it comes to drivability and you don't have to worry about the computer second guessing what you want to do. You also don't have to worry about being in the wrong gear all of a sudden since the DCT can only pre-select one gear...all gears are engaged all of the time in the 8L90.

I think if people took the time to understand 21st century automatics, we wouldn't have so many naysayers. Hopefully there will be plenty of info at the reveal but it's the proverbial "you can lead a horse to water" all over again...you can't drown them because they breathe through their butt.

Originally Posted by glass slipper

"Slushboxes" are from the '50s when they had fluid couplers. Those were replaced by torque converters in the '60s, lockup torque converters in the '70s, pulse width modulated (PWM) lockup torque converters in the '90s, and the 2000s brought us multi-disc PWM lockup torque converters capable of transmitting the maximum power of high performance engines in lockup mode. The 6L80 torque converter goes into lockup in 2nd gear and I'm sure the 8L90 will too. The PWM feature "pulses" the lockup clutch hydraulic pressure to achieve as much as 80-100 RPM "slippage" between the input/output of the torque converter at low RPM cruise to dampen engine vibrations due to low frequency power pulses from individual piston power strokes. The modern day torque converter has nothing in common with the old "slushbox" fluid coupler...welcome to the 21st century.

A DCT has two multi plate wet clutches that are hydraulically applied/released in a clutch to clutch architecture. The 8L90 has multiple multi plate wet clutches that are hydraulically applied/released in a clutch to clutch architecture. The same exact thing just different. There is no reason the 8L90 can't shift as fast as a DCT...they both use multi plate wet clutches and a hydraulic pump in conjunction with proportional "solenoid" valves that control the speed of the clutch engagement/shift.

I like the term "torque converter MCT" for the 8L90...it has more than two clutches so DCT wouldn't be proper. Plus, more is better.

Any standing start contest will be won handily by the 8L90 with the torque converter multiplying torque and letting the engine get up on top of its HP curve faster. They weigh about the same and efficiency will be about the same but the 8L90 will be smaller. The 8L90 will kick any DCT to the curb when it comes to drivability and you don't have to worry about the computer second guessing what you want to do. You also don't have to worry about being in the wrong gear all of a sudden since the DCT can only pre-select one gear...all gears are engaged all of the time in the 8L90.

I think if people took the time to understand 21st century automatics, we wouldn't have so many naysayers. Hopefully there will be plenty of info at the reveal but it's the proverbial "you can lead a horse to water" all over again...you can't drown them because they breathe through their butt.

Originally Posted by glass slipper

"Slushboxes" are from the '50s when they had fluid couplers. Those were replaced by torque converters in the '60s, lockup torque converters in the '70s, pulse width modulated (PWM) lockup torque converters in the '90s, and the 2000s brought us multi-disc PWM lockup torque converters capable of transmitting the maximum power of high performance engines in lockup mode. The 6L80 torque converter goes into lockup in 2nd gear and I'm sure the 8L90 will too. The PWM feature "pulses" the lockup clutch hydraulic pressure to achieve as much as 80-100 RPM "slippage" between the input/output of the torque converter at low RPM cruise to dampen engine vibrations due to low frequency power pulses from individual piston power strokes. The modern day torque converter has nothing in common with the old "slushbox" fluid coupler...welcome to the 21st century.

A DCT has two multi plate wet clutches that are hydraulically applied/released in a clutch to clutch architecture. The 8L90 has multiple multi plate wet clutches that are hydraulically applied/released in a clutch to clutch architecture. The same exact thing just different. There is no reason the 8L90 can't shift as fast as a DCT...they both use multi plate wet clutches and a hydraulic pump in conjunction with proportional "solenoid" valves that control the speed of the clutch engagement/shift.

I like the term "torque converter MCT" for the 8L90...it has more than two clutches so DCT wouldn't be proper. Plus, more is better.

Any standing start contest will be won handily by the 8L90 with the torque converter multiplying torque and letting the engine get up on top of its HP curve faster. They weigh about the same and efficiency will be about the same but the 8L90 will be smaller. The 8L90 will kick any DCT to the curb when it comes to drivability and you don't have to worry about the computer second guessing what you want to do. You also don't have to worry about being in the wrong gear all of a sudden since the DCT can only pre-select one gear...all gears are engaged all of the time in the 8L90.

I think if people took the time to understand 21st century automatics, we wouldn't have so many naysayers. Hopefully there will be plenty of info at the reveal but it's the proverbial "you can lead a horse to water" all over again...you can't drown them because they breathe through their butt.