Engine Dyno Testing Major Headers Very Soon!!! :)
12-04-2013, 11:44 PM
#82
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Thread Starter
Just for fun reference guy both our engine dyno motor and katechs engine dyno motor gained something like 10 hp from installing dyno headers...
12-05-2013, 06:08 PM
#83
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St. Jude Donor '09
Were you using the cats etc. from the headers back?
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"World Class Performance for your Corvette"
Intake Design and Engineering since 1999
Halltech Systems, LLC
262-510-7600
For service email:
orders@halltechsystems.com
www.halltechsystems.com
12-05-2013, 06:14 PM
#84
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St. Jude Donor '09
Is you motor still on the engine dyno? We have your intake ready, but the heat shield mold is going through a change to add a cover to encapsulate the filter and allow only airflow through the stock fender-well location.
Testing the IATs with the stock intake today surprised me. 21F outside air temps we saw +20F delta AOT to IAT, and +40F when idling.
That is where we are with our intake with our CPAPS fan off, but the cover will help with that delta. We typically see +4 to +5F on the road.
The heat shield we have has not been cutout yet, so Monday we could ship it for the engine dyno, but it would not be ready for prime time on the car. I would rather have you wait for the completed airbox.
Testing the IATs with the stock intake today surprised me. 21F outside air temps we saw +20F delta AOT to IAT, and +40F when idling.
That is where we are with our intake with our CPAPS fan off, but the cover will help with that delta. We typically see +4 to +5F on the road.
The heat shield we have has not been cutout yet, so Monday we could ship it for the engine dyno, but it would not be ready for prime time on the car. I would rather have you wait for the completed airbox.
12-05-2013, 09:43 PM
#86
12-05-2013, 10:28 PM
#87
Former Vendor
While I'm sure some folks would prefer to see these tests performed on a stock vehicle we aren't able to offer that at this time. We WILL be able to show the power band of each system on the same dyno with the same tuner with no other variables being introduced.
With some shops showing 10rwhp gains and others showing 50rwhp gains we hope this testing provides a bit of consistency and allows consumers to make a more informed decision when purchasing headers.
On a side note Kooks reached out to us today and will be sending a system to be tested as well. We will have ARH long tubes installed and tuned tomorrow and will post results ASAP.
12-06-2013, 08:39 AM
#88
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Someone commented on your FB page that the Pfadts were a PITA to mount.
Any comment on that? I'm sure fittment and installation will be a deciding factor for people as well, especially if the systems come in close performance wise.
Thanks.
Any comment on that? I'm sure fittment and installation will be a deciding factor for people as well, especially if the systems come in close performance wise.
Thanks.
12-06-2013, 09:19 AM
#89
Former Vendor
It would not be fair for me to say the Pfadt headers are a PITA to install Vs other brands until I have installed other manufacturer systems. We will have the ARH longtubes buttoned up this morning and I can atleast comment on these two systems.
12-06-2013, 06:22 PM
#90
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Thread Starter
I have Kooks & ARH here Ron. Are you going to sell the Pfadts off that car? I'll buy from ya if your taking off so I can test.
12-06-2013, 11:25 PM
#92
Ron,
I understand you are, or will be using the same vehicle to test these setups.
Since you don't have a baseline, why not make one? When you take off a setup, go back to OEM, custom tune, and you have your baseline, providing the rest of the car is OEM. To me it seems this would be a very useful and important piece of data, and, providing you can rather easily go back to OEM, provides a most meaningful base.
I know I keep pressing the issue. As you know, given all the work you will be or are doing, the baseline makes the whole process much more useful.
... but then again, I am probably missing something?
I understand you are, or will be using the same vehicle to test these setups.
Since you don't have a baseline, why not make one? When you take off a setup, go back to OEM, custom tune, and you have your baseline, providing the rest of the car is OEM. To me it seems this would be a very useful and important piece of data, and, providing you can rather easily go back to OEM, provides a most meaningful base.
I know I keep pressing the issue. As you know, given all the work you will be or are doing, the baseline makes the whole process much more useful.
... but then again, I am probably missing something?
12-06-2013, 11:34 PM
#93
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Thread Starter
I can test on the engine dyno and Ron can test on a car. This way we get double data. I will use the engine dyno so we can watch airflow, multiple o2s, etc. the best part is we can track all the way down to coolant temps and oil temps to make sure everything is similar. I expect I can dyno 5 headers in under 2 hours on the engine dyno so there won't be much time for the environment to change.
12-06-2013, 11:49 PM
#95
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Ron,
I understand you are, or will be using the same vehicle to test these setups.
Since you don't have a baseline, why not make one? When you take off a setup, go back to OEM, custom tune, and you have your baseline, providing the rest of the car is OEM. To me it seems this would be a very useful and important piece of data, and, providing you can rather easily go back to OEM, provides a most meaningful base.
I know I keep pressing the issue. As you know, given all the work you will be or are doing, the baseline makes the whole process much more useful.
... but then again, I am probably missing something?
I understand you are, or will be using the same vehicle to test these setups.
Since you don't have a baseline, why not make one? When you take off a setup, go back to OEM, custom tune, and you have your baseline, providing the rest of the car is OEM. To me it seems this would be a very useful and important piece of data, and, providing you can rather easily go back to OEM, provides a most meaningful base.
I know I keep pressing the issue. As you know, given all the work you will be or are doing, the baseline makes the whole process much more useful.
... but then again, I am probably missing something?
I for one don't care which of those headers will produce the most power on a stock car, simply because I know they all will probably be close. and I am sure Ron and the guys at Vengeance Racing don't care that much either, as again most likely the data they will get now will probably be enough to figure out what works better.
12-07-2013, 01:02 AM
#96
Ron already have a stock dyno sheet and tune only! so he does have a baseline. the car is cammed and as long as its the same cam, you don't really need to go back to a stock cam to figure out which of these headers will make more power. I know it will be different with the stock cam but most likely the best headers with the cam Ron is running, will still be the best headers on a stock car. (except maybe if you are thinking about running a stock tune and want to see how every different brand will do?) I know its probably not that simple, but it really is!
I for one don't care which of those headers will produce the most power on a stock car, simply because I know they all will probably be close. and I am sure Ron and the guys at Vengeance Racing don't care that much either, as again most likely the data they will get now will probably be enough to figure out what works better.
I for one don't care which of those headers will produce the most power on a stock car, simply because I know they all will probably be close. and I am sure Ron and the guys at Vengeance Racing don't care that much either, as again most likely the data they will get now will probably be enough to figure out what works better.
12-07-2013, 01:19 AM
#97
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I understand. The thing is with a baseline tuned car, the non-experts get to see how much the headers 'really' make, over a tuned OEM car. I suspect much of the claims by manuf will be 'high'. Seeing the rough, 'true' gains gives the user/buyer a much more down to earth look at the $/HP. I suspect there won't be much difference between them, either. I would like to be surprised, though!
but this is what Texas-speed is doing now!
12-07-2013, 01:30 AM
#98
Safety Car
I'd like to add my thoughts on this dyno test. Jason has a set of our long tubes headers he'll be putting thru their paces but as I explained to him in a PM earlier, our headers have already been tested by some very reputable shops. Matt at Tune Time, Graham at Lingenfelter, Fran at Race Proven, Stephen at LMR, Nick at Fastlane, Mike at Hennessey to name a few, can all fill you in on what ARH C7 header systems produce.
And to make a slight correction to something mentioned earlier by Jason, we dyno test to death every design we manufacture and for the C7 we have 2 distinctly different designs. Jason only has our long tube system. i welcome him to test our Mid Lengths as they are killer.
Keep in mind that we're in the HP making business where everything we build is highly scrutinized. Our goal, with every set of headers we build, is maximizing power and make sure the system provides the least amount of compromises.
We only build headers and we know exactly what needs to be done to produce the desired results long before the first pipe is even bent. This is why ARH is used exclusively by GM, Ford and Chrysler on all their race programs.
Good luck with your test Jason. We especially appreciate working with Texas Speed. Top notch shop for sure!
Nick
A.R. Headers
And to make a slight correction to something mentioned earlier by Jason, we dyno test to death every design we manufacture and for the C7 we have 2 distinctly different designs. Jason only has our long tube system. i welcome him to test our Mid Lengths as they are killer.
Keep in mind that we're in the HP making business where everything we build is highly scrutinized. Our goal, with every set of headers we build, is maximizing power and make sure the system provides the least amount of compromises.
We only build headers and we know exactly what needs to be done to produce the desired results long before the first pipe is even bent. This is why ARH is used exclusively by GM, Ford and Chrysler on all their race programs.
Good luck with your test Jason. We especially appreciate working with Texas Speed. Top notch shop for sure!
Nick
A.R. Headers
Here's your mid lengths dyno'ed at The Vette Doctors today
12-07-2013, 10:54 AM
#99
Hey Ron, any results on your header test? Would really like to see the differences between these headers..
12-07-2013, 11:03 AM
#100
Former Vendor
We have completed testing of the ARH 1 7/8 4 into 1 Long tubes (ORX)/Pfadt Tri y Long tubes (ORX) and ARH Mid Length (CATTED).
We will get the results posted this weekend and place a link in this thread for all who are interested.
Please keep in mind our testing was conducted on a cammed and tuned C7.. Our testing will show the differences between header systems for a modified engine, but will not show gains from adding headers to a stock car. I know this may not be what some of you are looking for, but hopefully the information is beneficial to a portion of the group. Hopefully Jason @ TSP can cover the gains portion on his engine dyno.
Stay tuned. I have to head out for a photo shoot with our C7 this morning and Ill get the results posted as soon as I can.
Jason, Ill shoot you a PM