The good and the not-so-good report
02-14-2014, 04:12 PM
#41
Drifting
Great review! Really enjoyed it along with your pics.
I'm a little surprised about the orange peel still being a concern, since most of the comments gradually disappeared after more cars were produced and the paint jobs improved. The first C7 I looked at I would have rejected due to multiple paint issues. The last two I looked at were acceptable. Maybe the colder weather in BG had something to do with it in late Jan.
I'm a little surprised about the orange peel still being a concern, since most of the comments gradually disappeared after more cars were produced and the paint jobs improved. The first C7 I looked at I would have rejected due to multiple paint issues. The last two I looked at were acceptable. Maybe the colder weather in BG had something to do with it in late Jan.
02-14-2014, 04:14 PM
#42
Race Director
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Tech Contributor
Great review! Really enjoyed it along with your pics.
I'm a little surprised about the orange peel still being a concern, since most of the comments gradually disappeared after more cars were produced and the paint jobs improved. The first C7 I looked at I would have rejected due to multiple paint issues. The last two I looked at were acceptable. Maybe the colder weather in BG had something to do with it in late Jan.
I'm a little surprised about the orange peel still being a concern, since most of the comments gradually disappeared after more cars were produced and the paint jobs improved. The first C7 I looked at I would have rejected due to multiple paint issues. The last two I looked at were acceptable. Maybe the colder weather in BG had something to do with it in late Jan.
02-14-2014, 04:15 PM
#43
nice summary. my more limited experience parallels yours, except i have the A6. i am quite pleased with it. bottom line: like all the mags say, its a nice car for the price. personally, id gladly pay 10k more, and have gm deal with all those annoying things that could be fixed with a little more care and qc. they all detract from the overall experience, unnecessarily so. [oh, one other thing, the rear hatch is a battle each time i shut it to get it to close properly. all for the $10-$20 per car that would get you a quality latch.]
02-14-2014, 04:24 PM
#44
nice summary. my more limited experience parallels yours, except i have the A6. i am quite pleased with it. bottom line: like all the mags say, its a nice car for the price. personally, id gladly pay 10k more, and have gm deal with all those annoying things that could be fixed with a little more care and qc. they all detract from the overall experience, unnecessarily so. [oh, one other thing, the rear hatch is a battle each time i shut it to get it to close properly. all for the $10-$20 per car that would get you a quality latch.]
02-14-2014, 04:33 PM
#46
Instructor
Thanks for the thorough write-up. I was on the fence about the R8C but now it is a go after hearing your experience. Now it is just a matter of waiting as I have decided to go with a 2015, who knows, maybe a Z06! 
02-14-2014, 05:04 PM
#47
Melting Slicks
One thing you might want to try is, instead of putting temp control on automatic, try it on manual mode (I'm assuming there IS a manual mode, altho that could be wrong on my part). In manual mode, you should have full control of both fan and temp settings. In my car (pror gen), I never use auto, just manual for the fan setting so I can change it to whatever I want.
On the rare occasions I have taken our Pontiac G8GT into the dealer (brake flush etc.) the mechanics always put the cars HVAC onto “Auto” and I invariably hate the way it works. Thinks it is smarter than I am and knows what I need/want. It doesn’t. Tends to push luke warm air in the winter and marginally cool air in the summer.
Switching to manual cures those problems completely. Additionally, unless you’re in monstrously humid conditions, keep it on “recirc”. Auto stinks in my opinion. Don
02-14-2014, 05:12 PM
#48
Le Mans Master
Thanx for a thoughtful write-up. The tranny issues are a big deal though and I hope it doesn't detract from your love of the car. I think the tranny will lossen up and you get used to so it's a distraction no more. Little disappoined on your thoughts of cyl.deact. Did you see some good MPG numbers at all? I have a Z51 7-sp sitting in my garage with no miles on it because of the winter but eager to check out the disappointing features you cite.
02-14-2014, 05:39 PM
#49
Le Mans Master
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Thanx for a thoughtful write-up. The tranny issues are a big deal though and I hope it doesn't detract from your love of the car. I think the tranny will lossen up and you get used to so it's a distraction no more. Little disappoined on your thoughts of cyl.deact. Did you see some good MPG numbers at all? I have a Z51 7-sp sitting in my garage with no miles on it because of the winter but eager to check out the disappointing features you cite.
The problem is it didn't stay on that long and would cycle back and forth once every 30 seconds to minute. And we are talking about 100's of miles of West Texas which is flat as a pancake. If V4 mode were to come on for a sustained period, that had to be the place.
I didn't try in 6th. It might have worked better in a lower gear but I didn't see the point of 7th then.
02-14-2014, 05:46 PM
#50
At 75 mph in cruise in 7th gear in V8 mode it read about 23 MPG. When V4 came on it went to about 31.
The problem is it didn't stay on that long and would cycle back and forth once every 30 seconds to minute. And we are talking about 100's of miles of West Texas which is flat as a pancake. If V4 mode were to come on for a sustained period, that had to be the place.
I didn't try in 6th. It might have worked better in a lower gear but I didn't see the point of 7th then.
The problem is it didn't stay on that long and would cycle back and forth once every 30 seconds to minute. And we are talking about 100's of miles of West Texas which is flat as a pancake. If V4 mode were to come on for a sustained period, that had to be the place.
I didn't try in 6th. It might have worked better in a lower gear but I didn't see the point of 7th then.
I've got to learn more about this back and forth of the engine's mode changing. That doesn't sound like something too pleasant to experience for 100s of miles to me.
02-14-2014, 06:23 PM
#51
Team Owner
I'm a little surprised at the gas mileage. With direct injection, cylinder deactivation and variable valve timing, I would have expected higher. My LS2 gets 28-30 at a steady 80mph, even with the top down. Nice writeup...good info!
02-14-2014, 07:35 PM
#53
Le Mans Master
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02-14-2014, 07:44 PM
#54
Race Director
Great pics!
02-14-2014, 07:54 PM
#55
FINALLY! Someone answered by demonstrating whether the C7 had BOTH an average speed indicator, AND an hour meter! Just like my Mercedes-Benz!
sincity,
RE: the back and forth of the 4 to 8 cylinders running - the late '70s/ early '80s Cadillac had a; 4/6/8 V8 engine too. It did not work so well as per dependability/functioning properly.
02-15-2014, 12:26 AM
#57
Safety Car
Ah.. good questions
Yes I used Cruise a lot and I loved it!
I was driving at about 40 MPH in weather mode when it decided to kick right. I was not in Cruise at that time. There was a lot of snow on the freeway at the time so I knew it was dangerous.
The rear got about about 30 degrees in a violent snap to the right. I thought I was in a spin for sure. I corrected and it snapped left about 10 degrees out then back to center. It all happened so fast I didn't really think about it until it was going straight again.
The snap was so violent, I thought someone hit me. Obviously, no one did.
Yes I used Cruise a lot and I loved it!
I was driving at about 40 MPH in weather mode when it decided to kick right. I was not in Cruise at that time. There was a lot of snow on the freeway at the time so I knew it was dangerous.
The rear got about about 30 degrees in a violent snap to the right. I thought I was in a spin for sure. I corrected and it snapped left about 10 degrees out then back to center. It all happened so fast I didn't really think about it until it was going straight again.
The snap was so violent, I thought someone hit me. Obviously, no one did.
02-15-2014, 02:53 AM
#58
Drove it cross country for 2400 miles over 4 days. Z51 manual convertible with 3LT trim, performance exhaust, and magnetic ride shocks.
Here's an assessment (and my opinion only. Others may disagree.)
The good:
Looks much better in person than photos. People truly love the new look and it gets a lot of positive comments. The CRM color is pretty amazing and gets a lot of good comments.
The exhaust sounds wonderful. Between 3 grand and the redline, it's terrific.
The mag ride works really well. Touring mode very comfortable, Track mode will shake your teeth loose. That's what you want.
The motor is excellent. It has plenty of torque. I could go up hills in 7th at about 1800 and it would just pull like nothing else. Impressive. (My one issue though is that it's not a smooth idler.)
Completely reliable. I lost the Sat radio and vocal nav one time but it reset after restarting the car. I don't view it as a fault. Everything else worked beautifully with no problems. This car gave me complete confidence to do almost anything with it.
The Electronic diff saved my bottom side. Hit some black ice in Little Rock and the rear went out big time. I corrected and it came back nicely. I'm sure it was the ediff at work here.
Fuel mileage is very good. Averaged 23.2 on a cross country trip at high speeds, most of which were over 70 mph the entire time.
Top works great. The car really comes to life with the top off. It's like a completely different vehicle. Drove 1200 miles topless. Used the heater when necessary. Tremendous fun.
Standard seats are very comfortable. I sat in them for 8 hours at a time and I was very surprised at how I felt during and after. These are very well done. Seat warmers work great but even in the low setting, can get pretty hot of you don't turn them off.
Rev matching: I was shocked how well I ended up liking this feature.
Radio and entertainment: Easy to figure out and use. Sat radio worked great, blue tooth easy to sync, phone worked well even with top down but obviously noisy from the wind noise.
Performance exhaust. Love you can switch it from quiet to noisy. Quiet is quiet and noisy is noisy.
HUD: Originally I thought this was a gimmick but I really liked it. It's great it's in color now as it's easy to read.
Museum delivery: Worth every penny. I can't say enough for the staff there and the help given to me to get on the road.
The not so good.
Ok, I know it's popular to rag on the paint but... there's more orangepeel on this car then I've ever seen on an expensive car before. Some areas are just .... poor. I am not a picky person on this issue but it really surprised me how some areas came out. This needs to be addressed.
There's sections of leather on the dash that look like wrinkled elephant skin. I'm shocked that it was not picked up and rejected. Should have been better given the price.
The Nav isn't as good as some other cars I've used. Its gives information in a confusing way some times and isn't easy to stop.
The touch screen is annoyingly slow to react to touch, particularly when you are trying to input addresses. Some of the arrows on the bottom are really difficult to use. There should be a "favorite" area where you can quickly shut off the nav or enable or disable the loud exhaust instead of going through several screens.
The radio switches between inputs for reasons unknown to me when you do different things.
The car has some terrible blind spots. Even looking out the back is a problem. It needed the side lane changing radar which should have been standard. With the roof up, visibility to the rear is worse than I expected.
Climate control a bit disappointing so far. The car gets really stuffy with the heat on. It's difficult to get the blower to blow full and stay that way for topless driving.
It has more road noise in Touring mode than I would have guessed. The exhaust is quiet but maybe it's the tire noise that's pretty loud. Talking on the phone at speeds of 70 mph with the top up was difficult for the other person on the other side to hear because of all the background noise.
Eco mode cylinder deactivation: I'm not sure how effective this is in the real world. I used it quite a bit but as soon as you get into a slight headwind or go up the smallest incline, it goes back to V8 mode. If you have the exhaust on loud, the sound level change is dramatic. And, when it goes from V8 to V4 it makes a shutter like the engine misfired. It takes some getting used to because your first reaction is "what's wrong with the motor". It works... I just wonder how much V4 mode is really usable given the added weight and complexity.
The manual box and clutch.... hmmm. Where to start. Now, I've driven manuals all my life so I'm no stranger to them but this one is really hard to get used to. The clutch is too light and the friction distance too small. The gearshift lever centering spring is too strong and requires you to "think" about each shift or the gears almost always end up differently than what you want. 1st gear is very hard to engage and move out smoothly without carefully and slowly slipping the clutch or releasing it and jerking your head off. The 1-4 lockout is bloody annoying when it happens! It makes zero sense to me.
Summation
Overall, the car is excellent. Perhaps with time I will get used to the gearbox and clutch. My feeling is, if this car had a DCT and some better paintwork, it would be near perfect. It's darn good as it is now though. But, everything can be improved no matter how good.
The C7 is a terrific GT to travel long distances in. Driving cross country in it was fun and thrilling. I never suffered in any way as you would expect from driving a sports car long distances.
Am I glad I bought it? Do you really need to ask?
Here's an assessment (and my opinion only. Others may disagree.)
The good:
Looks much better in person than photos. People truly love the new look and it gets a lot of positive comments. The CRM color is pretty amazing and gets a lot of good comments.
The exhaust sounds wonderful. Between 3 grand and the redline, it's terrific.
The mag ride works really well. Touring mode very comfortable, Track mode will shake your teeth loose. That's what you want.
The motor is excellent. It has plenty of torque. I could go up hills in 7th at about 1800 and it would just pull like nothing else. Impressive. (My one issue though is that it's not a smooth idler.)
Completely reliable. I lost the Sat radio and vocal nav one time but it reset after restarting the car. I don't view it as a fault. Everything else worked beautifully with no problems. This car gave me complete confidence to do almost anything with it.
The Electronic diff saved my bottom side. Hit some black ice in Little Rock and the rear went out big time. I corrected and it came back nicely. I'm sure it was the ediff at work here.
Fuel mileage is very good. Averaged 23.2 on a cross country trip at high speeds, most of which were over 70 mph the entire time.
Top works great. The car really comes to life with the top off. It's like a completely different vehicle. Drove 1200 miles topless. Used the heater when necessary. Tremendous fun.
Standard seats are very comfortable. I sat in them for 8 hours at a time and I was very surprised at how I felt during and after. These are very well done. Seat warmers work great but even in the low setting, can get pretty hot of you don't turn them off.
Rev matching: I was shocked how well I ended up liking this feature.
Radio and entertainment: Easy to figure out and use. Sat radio worked great, blue tooth easy to sync, phone worked well even with top down but obviously noisy from the wind noise.
Performance exhaust. Love you can switch it from quiet to noisy. Quiet is quiet and noisy is noisy.
HUD: Originally I thought this was a gimmick but I really liked it. It's great it's in color now as it's easy to read.
Museum delivery: Worth every penny. I can't say enough for the staff there and the help given to me to get on the road.
The not so good.
Ok, I know it's popular to rag on the paint but... there's more orangepeel on this car then I've ever seen on an expensive car before. Some areas are just .... poor. I am not a picky person on this issue but it really surprised me how some areas came out. This needs to be addressed.
There's sections of leather on the dash that look like wrinkled elephant skin. I'm shocked that it was not picked up and rejected. Should have been better given the price.
The Nav isn't as good as some other cars I've used. Its gives information in a confusing way some times and isn't easy to stop.
The touch screen is annoyingly slow to react to touch, particularly when you are trying to input addresses. Some of the arrows on the bottom are really difficult to use. There should be a "favorite" area where you can quickly shut off the nav or enable or disable the loud exhaust instead of going through several screens.
The radio switches between inputs for reasons unknown to me when you do different things.
The car has some terrible blind spots. Even looking out the back is a problem. It needed the side lane changing radar which should have been standard. With the roof up, visibility to the rear is worse than I expected.
Climate control a bit disappointing so far. The car gets really stuffy with the heat on. It's difficult to get the blower to blow full and stay that way for topless driving.
It has more road noise in Touring mode than I would have guessed. The exhaust is quiet but maybe it's the tire noise that's pretty loud. Talking on the phone at speeds of 70 mph with the top up was difficult for the other person on the other side to hear because of all the background noise.
Eco mode cylinder deactivation: I'm not sure how effective this is in the real world. I used it quite a bit but as soon as you get into a slight headwind or go up the smallest incline, it goes back to V8 mode. If you have the exhaust on loud, the sound level change is dramatic. And, when it goes from V8 to V4 it makes a shutter like the engine misfired. It takes some getting used to because your first reaction is "what's wrong with the motor". It works... I just wonder how much V4 mode is really usable given the added weight and complexity.
The manual box and clutch.... hmmm. Where to start. Now, I've driven manuals all my life so I'm no stranger to them but this one is really hard to get used to. The clutch is too light and the friction distance too small. The gearshift lever centering spring is too strong and requires you to "think" about each shift or the gears almost always end up differently than what you want. 1st gear is very hard to engage and move out smoothly without carefully and slowly slipping the clutch or releasing it and jerking your head off. The 1-4 lockout is bloody annoying when it happens! It makes zero sense to me.
Summation
Overall, the car is excellent. Perhaps with time I will get used to the gearbox and clutch. My feeling is, if this car had a DCT and some better paintwork, it would be near perfect. It's darn good as it is now though. But, everything can be improved no matter how good.
The C7 is a terrific GT to travel long distances in. Driving cross country in it was fun and thrilling. I never suffered in any way as you would expect from driving a sports car long distances.
Am I glad I bought it? Do you really need to ask?
Hey Sin City !
Thanks a MILLION for your excellent and thorough report !!!
If you don't mind, I'd like to insert my earlier posting regarding the Z51/MSRC. I think you briefly covered this area of concern(of mine), but is there anything else you can say about the Z51+MSRC? I am only going to so much trouble to ask about the Z51 because I think that it is an incredible package(and VALUE !!!) that I would absolutely like to get it - but only if the ride is not too stiff.
I know that some things, such as ride quality, are subjective. My area of a too stiff suspension may be way different than yours. And...vice-versa.
Anyway, I expect to do a fair amount of touring with my C7 and would really dislike a car that is either too loud or too rough riding.
Am I correct in assuming that you would recommend the "touring" setting combined with the MSRC set on the soft side in order to have a comfortable ride? How is the SPORT setting(on SMOOTH pavement)? Combined with a soft MSRC setting, would this still be adequate for comfortable touring, or is the SPORT setting too close to TRACK for that to be true? Did you try reducing the tire pressures at all? That might, or might not, contribute to a more comfortable combination for touring.
I would really appreciate any further advice you can lend on the Z51+MSRC combination as they relate to ride comfort. As I said, I really like the features delivered in the Z51 package(E-diff, performance traction management, larger wheels/tires/brakes, drysump, additional cooling for the gearbox, differential and brakes,
improved aero, superb Michelins) and I would really miss all of this magic if I could not get the Z51 (as well as the MSRC and Performance Traction Management).
THANKS !!!!
02-15-2014, 09:29 AM
#59
Melting Slicks
I ran in Eco mode from Atlanta to Knoxville area, roads are anything but flat. On most up hills it went back to V-8, flat and down hill in V-4.
180 miles and I averaged 30.1 mpg at 74 mph.
Not sure with the Automatic cars but with a stick it only goes into V4 mode in Eco, on Touring it does not do that from what I have seen.
Going back and 4th between V4 and V8 once you get use to it is not bad at all, mainly the sound change is what clues you in.
180 miles and I averaged 30.1 mpg at 74 mph.
Not sure with the Automatic cars but with a stick it only goes into V4 mode in Eco, on Touring it does not do that from what I have seen.
Going back and 4th between V4 and V8 once you get use to it is not bad at all, mainly the sound change is what clues you in.
