Car and Driver Test C7 vs 911
#261
Melting Slicks
Thread Starter
44 design awards since 1981...All the brand’s products are designed in the Porsche Design-Studio in Zell am See, Austria.
http://exhibition.ifdesign.de/winner...et=0#AwardList
http://exhibition.ifdesign.de/winner...et=0#AwardList
#262
Melting Slicks
Thread Starter
Notch and Guibo, I suggest the two of you study up on the Bauhaus School of design started in Germany than moved to Chicago by Walter Gropius and Marcel Breuer after the WW2. Maybe then the two of you will grasp whats going on with this so called Porsche design entity. Just a group of industrial designers hired by Porsche to assist various companies to brand the Porsche name. Very common with lots of auto manufacturers.
#263
And some of those points were awarded back to the Corvette for having more cargo space, so your scoring is off. Where did the Porsche receive points for all of those things that are not even available on the Corvette at any price? In any event, the price of both of these cars would likely be a consideration before seats or cargo space, if liability and indemnity are issues, which they usually are in these tests. The manufacturers don't just throw the keys to anyone.
You're complaining about flexibility? The 991 can be slotted into automatic and driven like any auto (particularly handy in stop and go traffic), or downshifted in the blink of an eye, yet the Corvette won on flexibility points anyway.
You're complaining about flexibility? The 991 can be slotted into automatic and driven like any auto (particularly handy in stop and go traffic), or downshifted in the blink of an eye, yet the Corvette won on flexibility points anyway.
I'm not complaining about flexibility, just mentioning that a category called "top gear passing" has little meaning if one of the cars is not in top gear. I would be fine if they allowed both cars to shift (and included the vettes shift time in the results) or if they used manual mode to force the 911 into seventh as well. But I've had that pet peeve for years now in this type of test and therefore no longer give it credence. It was just part of the discussion surrounding the main point that it could be argue that it was the Vette that had better performance.
As for your last point, both cars have features not found in the other. I assume the points awarded for those are included in other categories or are deemed inconsequential enought to omit (or maybe the reader is deemed intelligent enough to weight those features on their own).
-T
#264
Burning Brakes
Odd -- the nearly daily compliments, stares and lookbacks I get on my 13 YO Vette suggest it has aged very well indeed. I suspect your opinion (and that's all it is) is very much in the minority in the real world as well as on this Forum.
I will confess I appreciate the 911's styling, particularly the very clean, light and airy '60s vintage ones. I will also confess that, while I really like the C7's looks, I have a strong feeling it is one Vette that will not age particularly well. There's a lot going on there, and I think most of the cars that become true design classics tend to be great shapes with minimal extraneous detailing. The '80's Ferrari Testarossa comes to mind. Loved it when it came out, but it looks quite overwrought to me today. The 1970-vintage GTB-4 Daytona, however? Pure genius...
I will confess I appreciate the 911's styling, particularly the very clean, light and airy '60s vintage ones. I will also confess that, while I really like the C7's looks, I have a strong feeling it is one Vette that will not age particularly well. There's a lot going on there, and I think most of the cars that become true design classics tend to be great shapes with minimal extraneous detailing. The '80's Ferrari Testarossa comes to mind. Loved it when it came out, but it looks quite overwrought to me today. The 1970-vintage GTB-4 Daytona, however? Pure genius...
#265
Also note that the picture I posted of the 961 was in the Porsche museum.
Very different atmosphere, in terms of both the design of the building as well as the interaction between viewers and their subjects.
Very different atmosphere, in terms of both the design of the building as well as the interaction between viewers and their subjects.
#266
You brought up the points advantage for price, indicaiting that the Vette had an advantage by a specific amount before the contest even began. I was merely correcting your inaccurate assessment by showing areas where the 911 scored in similar ways.
I'm not complaining about flexibility, just mentioning that a category called "top gear passing" has little meaning if one of the cars is not in top gear. I would be fine if they allowed both cars to shift (and included the vettes shift time in the results) or if they used manual mode to force the 911 into seventh as well. But I've had that pet peeve for years now in this type of test and therefore no longer give it credence. It was just part of the discussion surrounding the main point that it could be argue that it was the Vette that had better performance.
As for your last point, both cars have features not found in the other. I assume the points awarded for those are included in other categories or are deemed inconsequential enought to omit (or maybe the reader is deemed intelligent enough to weight those features on their own).
-T
I'm not complaining about flexibility, just mentioning that a category called "top gear passing" has little meaning if one of the cars is not in top gear. I would be fine if they allowed both cars to shift (and included the vettes shift time in the results) or if they used manual mode to force the 911 into seventh as well. But I've had that pet peeve for years now in this type of test and therefore no longer give it credence. It was just part of the discussion surrounding the main point that it could be argue that it was the Vette that had better performance.
As for your last point, both cars have features not found in the other. I assume the points awarded for those are included in other categories or are deemed inconsequential enought to omit (or maybe the reader is deemed intelligent enough to weight those features on their own).
-T
Despite its slower times, the Corvette got more points for flexibility. Obviously the top-gear acceleration times aren't even factored into the scoring, so why even mention it? The added versatility of driving in full-auto mode appears to be absent as well.
But according to some here, the reader is not deemed intelligent enough. There has to be accusations that the test was somehow biased toward the Porsche. Otherwise, a 2% spread in the final score ("value") cannot be deemed palatable.
#267
Could you provide examples of other companies clamoring for GM Design's work? I seriously doubt Porsche is one of those companies, but we know that Porsche was one of the companies specifically used by GM as an interior benchmark for the C7 (Audi being the other).
#268
Burning Brakes
If the acceleration and braking between the C7 and 991S are approximately equal, and the points evaluation that factors in price to give the C7 the overall win, then it sounds like C&D is trying to say that they are slightly less than 50-50 about whether all the subjective factors that gave the 991S its points were worth the money.
Seems pretty clear though that when taken together, the Corvette's balance, handling, torque and grip far exceed the 991S on streets of willow.
Seems pretty clear though that when taken together, the Corvette's balance, handling, torque and grip far exceed the 991S on streets of willow.
#269
Melting Slicks
Thread Starter
There is nothing cheap in detailing or execution of the products that you can actually hold; have you ever? If it were cheap, companies like IWC and Franck Muller would have nothing to do with them. Bauhaus, as you say, is old...yet it is still considered modern.
Could you provide examples of other companies clamoring for GM Design's work? I seriously doubt Porsche is one of those companies, but we know that Porsche was one of the companies specifically used by GM as an interior benchmark for the C7 (Audi being the other).
Could you provide examples of other companies clamoring for GM Design's work? I seriously doubt Porsche is one of those companies, but we know that Porsche was one of the companies specifically used by GM as an interior benchmark for the C7 (Audi being the other).
http://www.dmaa.at/projekte/detail-p...he-museum.html
http://www.poggenpohl.com/en/world-o...pohl/heritage/
#270
You and Notch clearly do not understand what is going on there at Porsche design. You are either naive or delusional or maybe even both if you think they have anything to do with these products or buildings or millwork companies. Your comments indicate your inexperience in this level of manufacturing and design. I'm sure Delugan Meissl and his talented team of architects would love to hear from you on how Porsche designed their own museum or Rem Koolhaus and his firm on the Tower in Miami. Maybe you could have Porsche design your new kitchen so that Poggenpohl can build it to their specs. You actually believe your own nonsense??? Here's Meissl's firm you could study up on. Pay close attention to their conceptual thoughts. You might begin to understand the process of architecture, high end construction and manufacturing.
http://www.dmaa.at/projekte/detail-p...he-museum.html
http://www.poggenpohl.com/en/world-o...pohl/heritage/
http://www.dmaa.at/projekte/detail-p...he-museum.html
http://www.poggenpohl.com/en/world-o...pohl/heritage/
Have you ever picked up a Porsche Design product? Which one?
Nothing exciting...yeah right.
(Technically now a street car. )
#271
Burning Brakes
80 posts out of 269 are made by two guys who dislike the corvette.
How weird is it that so much time would be spent on a c7 corvette forum if you actually preferred Porsches...?
Thanks
How weird is it that so much time would be spent on a c7 corvette forum if you actually preferred Porsches...?
Thanks
#272
Melting Slicks
http://reputationx.com/