C7 General Discussion General C7 Corvette Discussion not covered in Tech
Sponsored by:
Sponsored by:
View Poll Results: LT1 Minimum Acceptability Poll
450 - 459 hp
74
36.63%
460 - 469 hp
20
9.90%
470 - 479 hp
71
35.15%
480 - 489 hp
17
8.42%
490 - 499 hp
4
1.98%
500 - 509 hp
16
7.92%
Voters: 202. You may not vote on this poll

LT1 Minimum HP Acceptability Poll

Old 05-02-2013, 09:02 PM
  #41  
JustinStrife
Team Owner
 
JustinStrife's Avatar
 
Member Since: Mar 2006
Location: San Diego
Posts: 27,567
Received 96 Likes on 66 Posts

Default

450+ and I'm good for a DD C7.

If I need more, I'll bring out the C5. It'll out-accelerate a Zr1 anyway.
Old 05-02-2013, 09:06 PM
  #42  
lt4obsesses
Le Mans Master
 
lt4obsesses's Avatar
 
Member Since: Dec 2006
Location: H-Town Texas
Posts: 5,139
Received 481 Likes on 261 Posts

Default

Originally Posted by tuxnharley
You presume too much. I voted 470-479 because that it is what it will take to be worth it to me to spend the $$$ to replace my C6. It's not just about "buying the car"; it's about whether the replacement cost to value result is worth it to the individual making the decision - not your opinion of what they should do.
Well, I certainly cannot tell you what is important to you. However, from watching the chassis seminar, and all the other info out there. The C7 brings alot more advancement to the table than a measly 20 hp. If this thing in fact does come out at "only" 450HP, it seems to me that compared to the C6 it's going to feel more like 480. More balance, finer tune suspension, stiffer chassis, rev match, more downforce, an of course assuming the Michelins super sports are what they say.

You get more torque off the line. You should be able to go into the corner faster, hold faster, and exit faster. Less dive on the brakes, and less lift on the gas. Less body roll and twist. C'mon, there's alot more than just the HP number at work here. But, hey, to each his own.
Old 05-02-2013, 09:06 PM
  #43  
CJJ
Racer
 
CJJ's Avatar
 
Member Since: Mar 2013
Location: Richmond VA
Posts: 461
Received 5 Likes on 1 Post
Default

i could care less. I know its going to drive great and get to 60 less than 4sec. I have mine on order and so happy!!
Old 05-02-2013, 09:12 PM
  #44  
sam90lx
Le Mans Master
 
sam90lx's Avatar
 
Member Since: May 2010
Location: Ventura CA
Posts: 7,775
Received 172 Likes on 138 Posts

Default

Originally Posted by lt4obsesses
Well, I certainly cannot tell you what is important to you. However, from watching the chassis seminar, and all the other info out there. The C7 brings alot more advancement to the table than a measly 20 hp. If this thing in fact does come out at "only" 450HP, it seems to me that compared to the C6 it's going to feel more like 480. More balance, finer tune suspension, stiffer chassis, rev match, more downforce, an of course assuming the Michelins super sports are what they say.

You get more torque off the line. You should be able to go into the corner faster, hold faster, and exit faster. Less dive on the brakes, and less lift on the gas. Less body roll and twist. C'mon, there's alot more than just the HP number at work here. But, hey, to each his own.
What if you already have Michelins?
Old 05-02-2013, 10:11 PM
  #45  
lt4obsesses
Le Mans Master
 
lt4obsesses's Avatar
 
Member Since: Dec 2006
Location: H-Town Texas
Posts: 5,139
Received 481 Likes on 261 Posts

Default

Originally Posted by sam90lx
What if you already have Michelins?
Good for you?
Old 05-03-2013, 02:33 AM
  #46  
SCM_Crash
Le Mans Master
 
SCM_Crash's Avatar
 
Member Since: Jul 2009
Location: Los Angeles California
Posts: 9,526
Likes: 0
Received 10 Likes on 10 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by sshu
Funny how a few hp can make all the difference.

450hp= little disappointed
460hp= acceptable
470hp= happy


The base C6 had 20 less hp than the C5 Z06, I expect something similar. My prediction and hope is 470hp+.
This!

Tadge already stated it's over 450. So we're good.
Old 05-03-2013, 03:47 AM
  #47  
Trackaholic
Pro
 
Trackaholic's Avatar
 
Member Since: Mar 2013
Posts: 742
Received 154 Likes on 69 Posts

Default

Voted for 450-459, but I hope it will have more.

Still, 20 HP (5%) won't be enough to sway me one way or the other. It will all come down to how this thing drives.

-T
Old 05-03-2013, 08:08 AM
  #48  
CaliKushMan
Intermediate
 
CaliKushMan's Avatar
 
Member Since: Mar 2013
Posts: 25
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

if it had 450hp I would wait and probably end up not getting it, and supercharge my c6.
if it had 475+ I would get it when the c7 z06 hit streets, supercharge c6 in the meantime.
if it had 500, I would be saving my pennies and searching everyday in the used market, and that supercharger money is my downpayment :-) .
Old 05-03-2013, 08:10 AM
  #49  
bigblock427
Le Mans Master
 
bigblock427's Avatar
 
Member Since: Feb 2011
Location: Edmond, Oklahoma
Posts: 8,781
Received 1,345 Likes on 1,057 Posts

Default

I voted for 460 - 469. But I am buying one at 450 if that is what the rating is.
Old 05-03-2013, 10:00 AM
  #50  
BlueOx
Race Director
Thread Starter
 
BlueOx's Avatar
 
Member Since: Feb 2012
Posts: 10,776
Likes: 0
Received 6 Likes on 6 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by bigblock427
I voted for 460 - 469. But I am buying one at 450 if that is what the rating is.
Then you voted wrong. The question was what is the minimum you would accept.
Old 05-03-2013, 10:40 AM
  #51  
Jinx
Le Mans Master
 
Jinx's Avatar
 
Member Since: Feb 2000
Location: Oakland, CA
Posts: 8,099
Received 398 Likes on 207 Posts

Default

Originally Posted by lt4obsesses
C'mon, there's alot more than just the HP number at work here.
I don't think it's fair to suggest that those unmoved by 450hp are dismissing all other improvements. It's still a matter of buying X more than what you have for Y dollars, and for each of us there is a point below which X isn't compelling. This poll fixes X for each of us except for horsepower, so actually in this poll there isn't anything more than the HP number to play with here.
Old 05-03-2013, 12:43 PM
  #52  
BlueOx
Race Director
Thread Starter
 
BlueOx's Avatar
 
Member Since: Feb 2012
Posts: 10,776
Likes: 0
Received 6 Likes on 6 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by Jinx
I don't think it's fair to suggest that those unmoved by 450hp are dismissing all other improvements. It's still a matter of buying X more than what you have for Y dollars, and for each of us there is a point below which X isn't compelling. This poll fixes X for each of us except for horsepower, so actually in this poll there isn't anything more than the HP number to play with here.
Exactly.

There are people who won't bother buying a C7 until and unless their particular HP number is reached. Not saying there are a lot of those folks, but they are out there.
Old 05-03-2013, 01:34 PM
  #53  
RC000E
Le Mans Master
 
RC000E's Avatar
 
Member Since: Sep 2009
Location: My interests are mobile
Posts: 6,937
Received 346 Likes on 208 Posts
Default

It's already confirmed that the car is faster than the GS around VIR, along with the fact Jim Mero went on and on how incredible the car is...

They can put 405hp on the little marketing materials...who gives a f**k?

People whining about these peak hp numbers, when that number doesn't amount to sh*t need to look at the bigger picture.
Old 05-03-2013, 01:41 PM
  #54  
BlueOx
Race Director
Thread Starter
 
BlueOx's Avatar
 
Member Since: Feb 2012
Posts: 10,776
Likes: 0
Received 6 Likes on 6 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by RC000E
It's already confirmed that the car is faster than the GS around VIR, along with the fact Jim Mero went on and on how incredible the car is...

They can put 405hp on the little marketing materials...who gives a f**k?

People whining about these peak hp numbers, when that number doesn't amount to sh*t need to look at the bigger picture.
I totally agree.

But whether we like it or not, some people do place a certain level of importance on that number.
Old 05-03-2013, 03:35 PM
  #55  
tail_lights
Race Director
 
tail_lights's Avatar
 
Member Since: Apr 2009
Location: SE TEX
Posts: 10,581
Received 252 Likes on 210 Posts

Default

I voted 470-479 just for the fact that we all know the new LT is capable of a bit more than 450. I believe anything less than 470 is just GM playing with us.
Old 05-03-2013, 06:31 PM
  #56  
04_Z06_CE
Safety Car
 
04_Z06_CE's Avatar
 
Member Since: Jun 2006
Location: Westlake Village, Ca
Posts: 3,717
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Default

Seems like 40-50 hp jump in generations have been the norm . IMO this car needs at least 485
Old 05-03-2013, 06:36 PM
  #57  
04_Z06_CE
Safety Car
 
04_Z06_CE's Avatar
 
Member Since: Jun 2006
Location: Westlake Village, Ca
Posts: 3,717
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by RC000E
It's already confirmed that the car is faster than the GS around VIR, along with the fact Jim Mero went on and on how incredible the car is...

They can put 405hp on the little marketing materials...who gives a f**k?

People whining about these peak hp numbers, when that number doesn't amount to sh*t need to look at the bigger picture.
Hey bro no need to get your self all worked up.
When it comes it to sports cars the one thing that gets asked is what is the hp ? Everything else come second ..yes hp doesn't make the car but its a damn big enough reason to warrant al this speculation on gm actually giving the numbers. All good and I do Bellve the tires are a little sticker on the c7 which you know makes a little difference going around a track.. On a side note it looks like it will be about 100 lbs heavier than c6. This is from article I ready not sure if true.

Get notified of new replies

To LT1 Minimum HP Acceptability Poll

Old 05-03-2013, 07:15 PM
  #58  
bigterpsfan
Melting Slicks
 
bigterpsfan's Avatar
 
Member Since: Mar 2009
Location: Odenton MD
Posts: 2,151
Received 69 Likes on 28 Posts

Default

If the C7 slightly out performs the C6 GS, I hope the C7 Z06 ( if there is one) slightly out performs the C6 ZR1. That is all I ask.
Old 05-03-2013, 07:16 PM
  #59  
BlueOx
Race Director
Thread Starter
 
BlueOx's Avatar
 
Member Since: Feb 2012
Posts: 10,776
Likes: 0
Received 6 Likes on 6 Posts
Default

Just in case you wanted to review...

All-New 2014 Corvette LT1 V-8 a Technological Powerhouse

Advanced technologies including direct injection, active fuel management, continuously variable valve timing support advanced combustion system
Preliminary output of 450 horsepower (335 kW) and 450 lb.-ft. of torque (610 Nm)
Helps deliver estimated 0-60 performance in less than four seconds and best-ever fuel economy in the Corvette

DETROIT – When the all-new 2014 Chevrolet Corvette arrives late next year, it will be powered by a technologically advanced, racing-proven 6.2L V-8 delivering an estimated 450 horsepower and helping produce 0-60 times in less than four seconds.
The new Corvette LT1 engine, the first of the Gen 5 family of Small Block engines, combines several advanced technologies, including direct injection, Active Fuel Management and continuously variable valve timing to support an advanced combustion system.

“Our objective for the development of the all-new LT1 was to raise the bar for performance car engines,” said Mary Barra, senior vice president, global product development. “We feel that we have achieved that by delivering a true technological masterpiece that seamlessly integrates a suite of advanced technologies that can only be found on a handful of engines in the world.

“What makes this engine truly special is the advanced combustion system that extracts the full potential of these technologies. The art and science behind that combustion system make the Corvette LT1 one of the most advanced V-8 engines in the world,” said Barra.

Output, performance, and fuel economy numbers will not be finalized until early next year, but the new LT1 engine is expected to deliver:

The most powerful standard Corvette ever, with preliminary output of 450 horsepower (335 kW) and 450 lb.-ft. of torque (610 Nm)
The quickest standard Corvette ever, with estimated 0-60 performance of less than four seconds
The most fuel-efficient Corvette ever, exceeding the 2013 EPA-estimated 26 miles per gallon on the highway.
“The Holy Grail for developing a performance car is delivering greater performance and more power with greater fuel economy and that’s what we’ve achieved,” said Tadge Juechter, Corvette chief engineer. “By leveraging technology, we are able to get more out of every drop of gasoline and because of that we expect the new Corvette will be the most fuel-efficient 450 horsepower car on the market.”

Advanced combustion system optimized with 6 million hours of analysis

“The Corvette LT1 represents the most significant redesign in the Small Block’s nearly 60-year history – building on its legacy to make one of the world’s best engines even better,” said Sam Winegarden, vice president, Global Powertrain Engineering. “More than just great horsepower, the LT1 has been optimized to produce a broader power band. Below 4,000 rpm, the torque of the Corvette LT1 is comparable to that of the legendary, 7.0L LS7 out of the current Corvette Z06. The LT1 is a sweetheart of a power plant and drivers will feel its tremendous torque and power at every notch on the tachometer.”

Increased power and efficiency were made possible by an unprecedented level of analysis, including computational fluid dynamics, to optimize the combustion system, the direct injection fuel system, active fuel management and variable valve timing systems that support it. More than 10 million hours of computational analysis were conducted on the engine program, including 6 million hours (CPU time) dedicated to the advanced combustion system.

Direct injection is all-new to the engine architecture and is a primary contributor to its greater combustion efficiency by ensuring a more complete burn of the fuel in the air-fuel mixture. This is achieved by precisely controlling the mixture motion and fuel injection spray pattern. Direct injection also keeps the combustion chamber cooler, which allows for a higher compression ratio. Emissions are also reduced, particularly cold-start hydrocarbon emissions, which are cut by about 25 percent.

Active Fuel Management (AFM) – a first-ever application on Corvette – helps save fuel by imperceptibly shutting down half of the engine’s cylinders in light-load driving.

Continuously variable valve timing, which GM pioneered for overhead-valve engines, is refined to support the LT1 AFM and direct injection systems to further optimize performance, efficiency and emissions.

These technologies support the all-new, advanced combustion system, which incorporates a new cylinder-head design and a new, sculpted piston design that is an integral contributor to the high-compression, mixture motion parameters enabled by direct injection.

The LT1 head features smaller combustion chambers designed to complement the volume of the unique topography of the pistons’ heads. The smaller chamber size and sculpted pistons produce an 11.5:1 compression ratio, while the head features large, straight and rectangular intake ports with a slight twist to enhance mixture motion. This is complemented by a reversal of the intake and exhaust valve positions, as compared to the previous engine design. Also, the spark plug angle and depth have been revised to protrude farther into the chamber, placing the electrode closer to the center of the combustion to support optimal combustion.

The pistons feature unique sculpted topography that was optimized via extensive analysis to precisely direct the fuel spray for a more complete combustion. The contours of the piston heads are machined to ensure dimensional accuracy – essential for precise control of mixture motion and the compression ratio.

Race-proven legacy, state-of-the-art performance

The first Small Block V-8 debuted in the Corvette in 1955. It displaced 4.3L (265 cubic inches) and was rated at 195 horsepower, drawing air and fuel through a four-barrel carburetor. Five years later, V-8 power helped Corvette secure its first victory at the 24 Hours of Le Mans.

In 2012, the Small Block-powered Corvette Racing C6.R beat Ferrari, BMW and Porsche to sweep the drivers’, team, and manufacturer championships in production-based American Le Mans Series GT class. These championships make Corvette Racing the most successful team in ALMS history, with a total of 77 class wins, eight drivers’ championships, and nine manufacturer and team championships since 2001.

“The engine requirements for a production car and a race car are remarkably similar,” said Jordan Lee, Small Block chief engineer and program manager. “In both cases, you want an engine that is powerful and efficient, compact and lightweight, and durable. That combination is what made the original Small Block so successful. Today, the introduction of state-of-the-art technologies and engineering makes one of the best performance car engines in the world even better.”

As an example, the new LT1 engine is 40 pounds lighter than a competitor’s twin-turbo 4.4L, DOHC V-8 with similar output. That weight savings not only improves the Corvette’s power-to-weight ratio, but also contributes to a near-perfect 50/50 weight balance for enhanced steering response and handling.

The new LT1 is also four inches shorter in overall height than the competitive DOHC V-8. That also improves handling by lowering the center of gravity while enabling a low hood line – contributing to the Corvette’s iconic profile, as well as ensuring exceptional driver visibility.

The new LT1 is the third engine in the Corvette’s history to be so-named, with previous versions introduced in 1970 (Gen 1) and 1992 (Gen 2). All iterations of the LT1 – and all Small Block engines – have shared a compact design philosophy that fosters greater packaging flexibility in sleek vehicles such as the Corvette.

“The power and efficiency of the Small Block V-8 are hallmarks of Corvette performance,” said Lee. “But, the compact size and great power-to-weight are just as important for the overall driving experience. The all-new LT1 will play a huge role in making the all-new Corvette a world-class sports car, in terms of technology, performance, and refinement.”

Engine features and highlights

All-aluminum block and oil pan: The Gen 5 block was developed with math-based tools and data acquired in GM’s racing programs, providing a light, rigid foundation for an impressively smooth engine. Its deep-skirt design helps maximize strength and minimize vibration. As with the Gen 3 and Gen 4 Small Blocks, the bulkheads accommodate six-bolt, cross-bolted main-bearing caps that limit crank flex and stiffen the engine’s structure. A structural aluminum oil pan further stiffens the powertrain.

The block features nodular iron main bearing caps, which represent a significant upgrade over more conventional powdered metal bearing caps. They are stronger and can better absorb vibrations and other harmonics to help produce smoother, quieter performance.

Compared to the Gen 4 engine, the Gen 5’s cylinder block casting is all-new, but based on the same basic architecture. It was refined and modified to accommodate the mounting of the engine-driven direct injection high-pressure fuel pump. It also incorporates new engine mount attachments, new knock sensor locations, improved sealing and oil-spray piston cooling.

Advanced oiling system, with available dry-sump system: The LT1 oiling system – including oil-spray piston cooling – was also optimized for improved performance. It is driven by a new, variable-displacement oil pump that enables more efficient oil delivery, per the engine’s operating conditions. Its dual-pressure control enables operation at a very efficient oil pressure at lower rpm coordinated with AFM and delivers higher pressure at higher engine speeds to provide a more robust lube system for aggressive engine operation.

Standard oil-spray piston cooling sprays the underside of each piston and the surrounding cylinder wall with an extra layer of cooling oil, via small jets located at the bottom of the cylinders. For optimal efficiency, the oil jets are used only when they are needed the most: at start-up, giving the cylinders extra lubrication that reduces noise, and at higher engine speeds, when the engine load demands, for extra cooling and greater durability.

An available dry-sump oiling system promotes exceptional lubrication system performance during aggressive driving maneuvers and high cornering loads. It includes two stages: a pressure stage and a scavenge stage. The pressure stage includes the new, dual-pressure-control and variable-displacement vane pump.

Dexos semi-synthetic motor oil, with a 5W30 specification, helps reduce friction to further enhance the LT1’s efficiency.

New, tri-lobe camshaft: Compared to the Gen 4 Small Block, the camshaft remains in the same position relative to the crankshaft and is used with a new rear cam bearing, but it features an all-new “tri-lobe” designed lobe which exclusively drives the engine-mounted direct injection high-pressure fuel pump, which powers the direct-injection combustion system. The cam’s specifications include 14mm/13.3mm (0.551/0.524-inch) intake/exhaust lift, 200/207-crank angle degrees intake/exhaust duration at 0.050-inch tappet lift and a 116.5-degree cam angle lobe separation.

New, cam-driven fuel pump: The direct injection system features a very-high-pressure fuel pump, which delivers up to 15Mpa (150 bar). The high-pressure, engine-driven fuel pump is fed by a conventional fuel-tank-mounted pump. The direct injection pump is mounted in the “valley” between cylinder heads – beneath the intake manifold – and is driven by the camshaft at the rear of the engine. This location ensures any noise generated by the pump is muffled by the intake manifold and other insulation in the valley.

PCV-integrated rocker covers: One of the most distinctive features of the new engine is its domed rocker covers, which house the, patent-pending, integrated positive crankcase ventilation (PCV) system that enhances oil economy and oil life, while reducing oil consumption and contributing to low emissions. The rocker covers also hold the direct-mount ignition coils for the coil-near-plug ignition system. Between the individual coil packs, the domed sections of the covers contain baffles that separate oil and air from the crankcase gases – about three times the oil/air separation capability of previous engines.

Intake manifold and throttle body assembly: The LT1’s intake manifold features a “runners in a box” design, wherein individual runners inside the manifold feed a plenum box that allows for excellent, high-efficiency airflow packaged beneath the car’s low hood line.

Acoustic foam is sandwiched between the outside top of the intake manifold and an additional acoustic shell to reduce radiated engine noise, as well as fuel pump noise.

The manifold is paired with an electronically controlled throttle, featuring an 87mm bore diameter and a “contactless” throttle position sensor design that is more durable and enables greater control.

Four-into-one exhaust manifolds: The LT-1 uses a cast version of the “four-into-one” short-header exhaust manifold design used on the Gen 4 LS7 engine. The cast header passages enable consistent exhaust flow into the “wide mouth” collector at the converter.

Cooling system, humidity sensor and more: Additional features and technologies of the Gen 5 Small Block include:

A revised cooling system with an offset water pump and thermostat for more efficient performance
Air induction humidity sensor ensures optimal combustion efficiency, regardless of the surrounding air’s humidity
58X ignition system with individual ignition coil modules and iridium-tip spark plugs
All-new “E92” engine controller.
Old 05-03-2013, 07:22 PM
  #60  
rcallen484
Race Director
 
rcallen484's Avatar
 
Member Since: Dec 2011
Posts: 10,355
Likes: 0
Received 11 Likes on 10 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by 04_Z06_CE
Hey bro no need to get your self all worked up.
When it comes it to sports cars the one thing that gets asked is what is the hp ? Everything else come second ..yes hp doesn't make the car but its a damn big enough reason to warrant al this speculation on gm actually giving the numbers. All good and I do Bellve the tires are a little sticker on the c7 which you know makes a little difference going around a track.. On a side note it looks like it will be about 100 lbs heavier than c6. This is from article I ready not sure if true.
I disagree. That is true as to hot rods, drag cars and other muscle cars. With sports cars I think the more popular questions deal with overall capabilities and how quickly it will make it around this track or that track.

Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Quick Reply: LT1 Minimum HP Acceptability Poll



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:06 PM.