What would you like in the C7 Z06?
04-08-2013, 03:55 AM
#61
It can't be. You cannot get over 600 hp in a naturally aspirated pushrod engine of anywhere near the displacement that GM has available. Naturally aspirated requires either very high rpms, or lots of displacement to get there.
Which leads to the question of what the Z06 will have in it to get to even 550 hp. It will either have to be another 427 or it will also have to be forced induction. VERY unlikely they can get to 550 hp with the LT1 as a starting point (with it's current displacement).
Which leads to the question of what the Z06 will have in it to get to even 550 hp. It will either have to be another 427 or it will also have to be forced induction. VERY unlikely they can get to 550 hp with the LT1 as a starting point (with it's current displacement).
As far as the Z06 is concerned, I am less certain (but hopeful) that it will stay normally aspirated. I do think that with direct injection, 7 liters of displacement, titanium valves and conn rods, eliminating AFM, tuning the VVT for high RPM torque (on-track power) rather than low RPM torque (driveability) they can get to 550 HP. I noticed that the compression ratio on the LT1 was only 11.2 I believe. Not sure why it seems so low for a direct injected engine, but perhaps there is some headroom to bump it closer to 12 for increased power in a more performance oriented design.
I'd rather the Z06 focus on weight reduction and modest power gains than adding forced induction and weight for a larger power gain.
I think either way it will be a very, very good car.
-T
04-08-2013, 08:37 AM
#62
I think it would be fun to imagine what GM will offer in the C7 Z06. What would you like them to add/subtract? Here are my thoughts:
1. AFM Delete
2. Go back to Auminum Torque Tube
3. Lighter headers
4. Fixed Roof
5. Make an LS7 version of the LT1:
5a. Increase displacement
5b. Tune for power at high RPM rather than FE
5c. All the other cool junk in the LS7 that lets it REV
Clearly I'm going for a normally aspirated engine here.
I'm thinking the following specs:
550 HP
3100-3200 lbs
Any thoughts/dreams/fantasies?
-T
1. AFM Delete
2. Go back to Auminum Torque Tube
3. Lighter headers
4. Fixed Roof
5. Make an LS7 version of the LT1:
5a. Increase displacement
5b. Tune for power at high RPM rather than FE
5c. All the other cool junk in the LS7 that lets it REV
Clearly I'm going for a normally aspirated engine here.
I'm thinking the following specs:
550 HP
3100-3200 lbs
Any thoughts/dreams/fantasies?
-T
3000lbs or less
sequential gearbox
proper brakes (doesnt matter if they are carbon or steel)
mspc tires or pirelli trofeos
option for fixed back racing buckets and option to delete luxuries like sound deadening and radio
04-08-2013, 10:31 AM
#63
Drifting
Jim, I get your point.
What I want in a C7 Z06 is valves that don't drop.
Other than that, my next wish is......I want the Z06 to be available with a "Hard Core Option". Let the team that did the 2014 Z/28 take care of that package. Reuss, are you listening???? I want a Z06 with NO power seats, mirrors, NO STEREO AT ALL (give me a block off plate). You guys get my point.
LOW WEIGHT. GIANT WIDE RUBBER AT ALL 4 CORNERS. MANUAL TRANS. 427 n/a WITH A MINIMUM OF 580HP. I want something as close to the LeMans C7R as I can get. In fact, I want them to offer the "LeMans Aero Package", and that have the exact same area pieces as the C7R.
Personally, I do not want carbon fiber for the sake of carbon fiber. If it adds $4,000 to the price of the car, and only saves 2 pounds versus the regular composite plastic, then give me plastic. Don't just **** away money.
OH, and don't let the idiots that produced the heads for the LS7 produce the heads for any more GM cars. Anyone who can mill heads wrong for 6 YEARS is an idiot, and shame on GM for not catching it sooner. Seriously, don't have another debacle like that on the C7.
What I want in a C7 Z06 is valves that don't drop.
Other than that, my next wish is......I want the Z06 to be available with a "Hard Core Option". Let the team that did the 2014 Z/28 take care of that package. Reuss, are you listening???? I want a Z06 with NO power seats, mirrors, NO STEREO AT ALL (give me a block off plate). You guys get my point.
LOW WEIGHT. GIANT WIDE RUBBER AT ALL 4 CORNERS. MANUAL TRANS. 427 n/a WITH A MINIMUM OF 580HP. I want something as close to the LeMans C7R as I can get. In fact, I want them to offer the "LeMans Aero Package", and that have the exact same area pieces as the C7R.
Personally, I do not want carbon fiber for the sake of carbon fiber. If it adds $4,000 to the price of the car, and only saves 2 pounds versus the regular composite plastic, then give me plastic. Don't just **** away money.
OH, and don't let the idiots that produced the heads for the LS7 produce the heads for any more GM cars. Anyone who can mill heads wrong for 6 YEARS is an idiot, and shame on GM for not catching it sooner. Seriously, don't have another debacle like that on the C7.
04-08-2013, 11:12 AM
#64
Melting Slicks
I think the Z06 should come with the 7.0 engine and lower geared differential or at least be an option. That 2.66 and a 3.42 is not drag strip gearing.
As far as hp, if Ford can inject 420 into a 5.0 liter base Mustang then I would think GM could do as good. With a 7.0 liter then it should have 588 hp. And of course be no heavier than it's current weight.
As far as hp, if Ford can inject 420 into a 5.0 liter base Mustang then I would think GM could do as good. With a 7.0 liter then it should have 588 hp. And of course be no heavier than it's current weight.
04-08-2013, 11:31 AM
#65
I'm not sure what either of those comments have to do with anything we are discussing here. You and I are obviously not on the same wavelength. No, I don't think the first is possible, but I never said or implied that.
Second paragraph, I agree with you and always have. I'm on record as saying that hp/liter (or litre) is a meaningless measure. Now maybe you are I are back on track!
Second paragraph, I agree with you and always have. I'm on record as saying that hp/liter (or litre) is a meaningless measure. Now maybe you are I are back on track!
04-29-2013, 05:01 PM
#66
Needs to have:
Should have:
The Z06 doesn't need more power. It needs to make better use of the power it already has. Getting 500hp down to 2 rear wheels with a crap manual shifter means this car is only enjoyed by true experts. If it wants to compete with the big boys (GT-R, 911 GT3/Turbo, R8 V10, 458, Gallardo, etc) it either needs a SIGNIFICANT suspension re-working (not going to happen) or they need to let a dual-clutch transmission and AWD get that power to the ground.
My Nissan GT-R would absolutely smoke my '08 Z06 everywhere. It's also a much easier car to live with day-to-day, gets all that power down to the ground time-after-time 24/7/365 days of the year, and has much higher standards of fit-and-finish. The C7 will take care of a lot of my Z06 complaints, but if they want the C7 Z06 to really take on these cars, they have to get beyond the thinking that you can keep slapping wider and wider tires on the back end of the car and keep pushing the HP up to ridiculous numbers. This worked for the past two generations of Corvettes but it's a new world.
I'd love for the Z06 to lure me back to the world of Corvettes but this car is going to have to be effing phenomenal to get me out of my GT-R.
Just my .02
- dual-clutch transmission with paddle shifters
- 3200lbs or less
- horsepower bump to 520+
- significant upgrade in steering-wheel feedback
- Ability to disable skip-shift nonsense from the driver's seat
- Improvements in cabin heat/cabin noise
- lightweight and/or forged wheels as factory option
- Option for real tires with roadside kit for blown tires. no more runflats.
Should have:
- All-Wheel Drive
- No more 1LZ, 2LZ, 3LZ. Make two cars - one with all options and one that is stripped-down racer
- carbon fiber hood, roof, no BS opaque roofs
The Z06 doesn't need more power. It needs to make better use of the power it already has. Getting 500hp down to 2 rear wheels with a crap manual shifter means this car is only enjoyed by true experts. If it wants to compete with the big boys (GT-R, 911 GT3/Turbo, R8 V10, 458, Gallardo, etc) it either needs a SIGNIFICANT suspension re-working (not going to happen) or they need to let a dual-clutch transmission and AWD get that power to the ground.
My Nissan GT-R would absolutely smoke my '08 Z06 everywhere. It's also a much easier car to live with day-to-day, gets all that power down to the ground time-after-time 24/7/365 days of the year, and has much higher standards of fit-and-finish. The C7 will take care of a lot of my Z06 complaints, but if they want the C7 Z06 to really take on these cars, they have to get beyond the thinking that you can keep slapping wider and wider tires on the back end of the car and keep pushing the HP up to ridiculous numbers. This worked for the past two generations of Corvettes but it's a new world.
I'd love for the Z06 to lure me back to the world of Corvettes but this car is going to have to be effing phenomenal to get me out of my GT-R.
Just my .02
04-29-2013, 07:17 PM
#67
AIR FORCE VETERAN
Needs to have:
Should have:
The Z06 doesn't need more power. It needs to make better use of the power it already has. Getting 500hp down to 2 rear wheels with a crap manual shifter means this car is only enjoyed by true experts. If it wants to compete with the big boys (GT-R, 911 GT3/Turbo, R8 V10, 458, Gallardo, etc) it either needs a SIGNIFICANT suspension re-working (not going to happen) or they need to let a dual-clutch transmission and AWD get that power to the ground.
My Nissan GT-R would absolutely smoke my '08 Z06 everywhere. It's also a much easier car to live with day-to-day, gets all that power down to the ground time-after-time 24/7/365 days of the year, and has much higher standards of fit-and-finish. The C7 will take care of a lot of my Z06 complaints, but if they want the C7 Z06 to really take on these cars, they have to get beyond the thinking that you can keep slapping wider and wider tires on the back end of the car and keep pushing the HP up to ridiculous numbers. This worked for the past two generations of Corvettes but it's a new world.
I'd love for the Z06 to lure me back to the world of Corvettes but this car is going to have to be effing phenomenal to get me out of my GT-R.
Just my .02
- dual-clutch transmission with paddle shifters
- 3200lbs or less
- horsepower bump to 520+
- significant upgrade in steering-wheel feedback
- Ability to disable skip-shift nonsense from the driver's seat
- Improvements in cabin heat/cabin noise
- lightweight and/or forged wheels as factory option
- Option for real tires with roadside kit for blown tires. no more runflats.
Should have:
- All-Wheel Drive
- No more 1LZ, 2LZ, 3LZ. Make two cars - one with all options and one that is stripped-down racer
- carbon fiber hood, roof, no BS opaque roofs
The Z06 doesn't need more power. It needs to make better use of the power it already has. Getting 500hp down to 2 rear wheels with a crap manual shifter means this car is only enjoyed by true experts. If it wants to compete with the big boys (GT-R, 911 GT3/Turbo, R8 V10, 458, Gallardo, etc) it either needs a SIGNIFICANT suspension re-working (not going to happen) or they need to let a dual-clutch transmission and AWD get that power to the ground.
My Nissan GT-R would absolutely smoke my '08 Z06 everywhere. It's also a much easier car to live with day-to-day, gets all that power down to the ground time-after-time 24/7/365 days of the year, and has much higher standards of fit-and-finish. The C7 will take care of a lot of my Z06 complaints, but if they want the C7 Z06 to really take on these cars, they have to get beyond the thinking that you can keep slapping wider and wider tires on the back end of the car and keep pushing the HP up to ridiculous numbers. This worked for the past two generations of Corvettes but it's a new world.
I'd love for the Z06 to lure me back to the world of Corvettes but this car is going to have to be effing phenomenal to get me out of my GT-R.
Just my .02
Can you price that out for us? I just want to know if I could afford it.
Thanks
04-29-2013, 07:29 PM
#70
Most important thing imo is that the car needs to have a DCT. No BS excuse from GM as to why it won't. They have almost two years to bring one out or source it from someone.
Then:
575-600 HP & TQ
Widebody
Different styling so my grandmother can tell the difference
A few exclusive colors and a few matte colors (matte white would be unbelievable)
Weight 3050-3100 lbs.
Give all this at a price of $90-100K and it will incredible!!!
Then:
575-600 HP & TQ
Widebody
Different styling so my grandmother can tell the difference
A few exclusive colors and a few matte colors (matte white would be unbelievable)
Weight 3050-3100 lbs.
Give all this at a price of $90-100K and it will incredible!!!
04-29-2013, 07:39 PM
#71
Le Mans Master
Needs to have:
Should have:
The Z06 doesn't need more power. It needs to make better use of the power it already has. Getting 500hp down to 2 rear wheels with a crap manual shifter means this car is only enjoyed by true experts. If it wants to compete with the big boys (GT-R, 911 GT3/Turbo, R8 V10, 458, Gallardo, etc) it either needs a SIGNIFICANT suspension re-working (not going to happen) or they need to let a dual-clutch transmission and AWD get that power to the ground.
My Nissan GT-R would absolutely smoke my '08 Z06 everywhere. It's also a much easier car to live with day-to-day, gets all that power down to the ground time-after-time 24/7/365 days of the year, and has much higher standards of fit-and-finish. The C7 will take care of a lot of my Z06 complaints, but if they want the C7 Z06 to really take on these cars, they have to get beyond the thinking that you can keep slapping wider and wider tires on the back end of the car and keep pushing the HP up to ridiculous numbers. This worked for the past two generations of Corvettes but it's a new world.
I'd love for the Z06 to lure me back to the world of Corvettes but this car is going to have to be effing phenomenal to get me out of my GT-R.
Just my .02
- dual-clutch transmission with paddle shifters
- 3200lbs or less
- horsepower bump to 520+
- significant upgrade in steering-wheel feedback
- Ability to disable skip-shift nonsense from the driver's seat
- Improvements in cabin heat/cabin noise
- lightweight and/or forged wheels as factory option
- Option for real tires with roadside kit for blown tires. no more runflats.
Should have:
- All-Wheel Drive
- No more 1LZ, 2LZ, 3LZ. Make two cars - one with all options and one that is stripped-down racer
- carbon fiber hood, roof, no BS opaque roofs
The Z06 doesn't need more power. It needs to make better use of the power it already has. Getting 500hp down to 2 rear wheels with a crap manual shifter means this car is only enjoyed by true experts. If it wants to compete with the big boys (GT-R, 911 GT3/Turbo, R8 V10, 458, Gallardo, etc) it either needs a SIGNIFICANT suspension re-working (not going to happen) or they need to let a dual-clutch transmission and AWD get that power to the ground.
My Nissan GT-R would absolutely smoke my '08 Z06 everywhere. It's also a much easier car to live with day-to-day, gets all that power down to the ground time-after-time 24/7/365 days of the year, and has much higher standards of fit-and-finish. The C7 will take care of a lot of my Z06 complaints, but if they want the C7 Z06 to really take on these cars, they have to get beyond the thinking that you can keep slapping wider and wider tires on the back end of the car and keep pushing the HP up to ridiculous numbers. This worked for the past two generations of Corvettes but it's a new world.
I'd love for the Z06 to lure me back to the world of Corvettes but this car is going to have to be effing phenomenal to get me out of my GT-R.
Just my .02
04-29-2013, 07:45 PM
#72
Le Mans Master
Most important thing imo is that the car needs to have a DCT. No BS excuse from GM as to why it won't. They have almost two years to bring one out or source it from someone.
Then:
575-600 HP & TQ
Widebody
Different styling so my grandmother can tell the difference
A few exclusive colors and a few matte colors (matte white would be unbelievable)
Weight 3050-3100 lbs.
Give all this at a price of $90-100K and it will incredible!!!
Then:
575-600 HP & TQ
Widebody
Different styling so my grandmother can tell the difference
A few exclusive colors and a few matte colors (matte white would be unbelievable)
Weight 3050-3100 lbs.
Give all this at a price of $90-100K and it will incredible!!!
04-29-2013, 08:23 PM
#73
Instructor
Simple.. Bump compression to 12.5 to 1, with optimized support for E85, move redline to 7500 rpm with better internals, use Xtrac sequential ( like C6R ).
Dump AFM..Configure like new Z28 with no crap weight adders...
Prob should call it an L88.
Cheers
Dump AFM..Configure like new Z28 with no crap weight adders...
Prob should call it an L88.
Cheers
04-29-2013, 08:31 PM
#74
Drifting
1. Wide body larger wheels, tires.
2. A rear wing, not some wanna be either, possibly active as well.
3. Splitter to balance rear wing, side skirts too.
4. Brakes that will pull your eyeballs out.
5. Coolers out the wazoo for all fluids.
6. Normally aspirated preferred, 550-575HP. (Not many of us have the talent to reach a C6Z'S full potential now)
7. 3000-3100lbs will do.
8. Light weight dual disc clutch, (but still streetable) Close ratio trans..
9. The current C7 competition seats look very good, just stitch a ZO6 logo in them.
10. Have a very base interior package.
I think this package would be good, and not get too expensive...
Just my thoughts
2. A rear wing, not some wanna be either, possibly active as well.
3. Splitter to balance rear wing, side skirts too.
4. Brakes that will pull your eyeballs out.
5. Coolers out the wazoo for all fluids.
6. Normally aspirated preferred, 550-575HP. (Not many of us have the talent to reach a C6Z'S full potential now)
7. 3000-3100lbs will do.
8. Light weight dual disc clutch, (but still streetable) Close ratio trans..
9. The current C7 competition seats look very good, just stitch a ZO6 logo in them.
10. Have a very base interior package.
I think this package would be good, and not get too expensive...
Just my thoughts
04-29-2013, 08:46 PM
#75
Instructor
Member Since: Dec 2010
Posts: 144
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L88 engine option (bored/stroked/etc. 'LS7-ified' LT1)
+
Comp Seats standard
+
Z51/MSRC/VTPE standard
+
6-point roll cage & 5-point harnesses
+
front splitter & side skirts
+
fixed roof
+
carbon ceramic brakes
=
C7 Z06
+
Comp Seats standard
+
Z51/MSRC/VTPE standard
+
6-point roll cage & 5-point harnesses
+
front splitter & side skirts
+
fixed roof
+
carbon ceramic brakes
=
C7 Z06
04-29-2013, 08:48 PM
#76
Le Mans Master
04-29-2013, 09:06 PM
#77
Base model needs to be faster than Z06+Z07 performance package.
That should be the baseline and improvements from there. Although, I'm sure we're getting close to limitations of street legal cars. Thus you see semi-slicks being put on cars for fast track times.
Roadcars can only produce so much mechanical grip and aggressive aerodynamics are tough to pull off with safety regs.
That should be the baseline and improvements from there. Although, I'm sure we're getting close to limitations of street legal cars. Thus you see semi-slicks being put on cars for fast track times.
Roadcars can only produce so much mechanical grip and aggressive aerodynamics are tough to pull off with safety regs.
Last edited by Robert R1; 04-29-2013 at 09:09 PM.
04-29-2013, 09:12 PM
#78
Le Mans Master
Needs to have:
Should have:
The Z06 doesn't need more power. It needs to make better use of the power it already has. Getting 500hp down to 2 rear wheels with a crap manual shifter means this car is only enjoyed by true experts. If it wants to compete with the big boys (GT-R, 911 GT3/Turbo, R8 V10, 458, Gallardo, etc) it either needs a SIGNIFICANT suspension re-working (not going to happen) or they need to let a dual-clutch transmission and AWD get that power to the ground.
My Nissan GT-R would absolutely smoke my '08 Z06 everywhere. It's also a much easier car to live with day-to-day, gets all that power down to the ground time-after-time 24/7/365 days of the year, and has much higher standards of fit-and-finish. The C7 will take care of a lot of my Z06 complaints, but if they want the C7 Z06 to really take on these cars, they have to get beyond the thinking that you can keep slapping wider and wider tires on the back end of the car and keep pushing the HP up to ridiculous numbers. This worked for the past two generations of Corvettes but it's a new world.
I'd love for the Z06 to lure me back to the world of Corvettes but this car is going to have to be effing phenomenal to get me out of my GT-R.
Just my .02
- dual-clutch transmission with paddle shifters
- 3200lbs or less
- horsepower bump to 520+
- significant upgrade in steering-wheel feedback
- Ability to disable skip-shift nonsense from the driver's seat
- Improvements in cabin heat/cabin noise
- lightweight and/or forged wheels as factory option
- Option for real tires with roadside kit for blown tires. no more runflats.
Should have:
- All-Wheel Drive
- No more 1LZ, 2LZ, 3LZ. Make two cars - one with all options and one that is stripped-down racer
- carbon fiber hood, roof, no BS opaque roofs
The Z06 doesn't need more power. It needs to make better use of the power it already has. Getting 500hp down to 2 rear wheels with a crap manual shifter means this car is only enjoyed by true experts. If it wants to compete with the big boys (GT-R, 911 GT3/Turbo, R8 V10, 458, Gallardo, etc) it either needs a SIGNIFICANT suspension re-working (not going to happen) or they need to let a dual-clutch transmission and AWD get that power to the ground.
My Nissan GT-R would absolutely smoke my '08 Z06 everywhere. It's also a much easier car to live with day-to-day, gets all that power down to the ground time-after-time 24/7/365 days of the year, and has much higher standards of fit-and-finish. The C7 will take care of a lot of my Z06 complaints, but if they want the C7 Z06 to really take on these cars, they have to get beyond the thinking that you can keep slapping wider and wider tires on the back end of the car and keep pushing the HP up to ridiculous numbers. This worked for the past two generations of Corvettes but it's a new world.
I'd love for the Z06 to lure me back to the world of Corvettes but this car is going to have to be effing phenomenal to get me out of my GT-R.
Just my .02
There is not much point in GM building a GT-R. Somebody already makes one.
Michael
04-29-2013, 09:35 PM
#79
Le Mans Master
I'm going against the grain and suggesting in this fantasy future timeline, the Z06 NOT be the ultimate track hound Corvette. It would be nice to see GM finally do some justice to the Grand Sport since it's 60's iteration. I love the C4/C6 versions but not a candle to the original's true intent.
So, for me, I'd like to see the GS free itself from the modern pigeon hole of an appearance package with some slight tweaking. A Corvette version of what the new Z28 will be like. This is THE generation of all to do it now that the name is back (Despite it being Stingray instead of Sting Ray). So far lots of great ideas from posters I'd like to see in a new Stingray with Grand Sport on the fender badges....minus any chrome or fancy gadgets....
I mean when you think about it, do a lot of people really want a race car? They want a "track weapon" but they also want sat nav, blue tooth, eight way adjustable seats, sound insulation, a nice stereo system with more speakers than teeth in your head. Keep the Z06 option as the street/track car but have the new GS as the track car just a hair from not being street legal for those feeling gutsy enough to drive one outside of a track.
So, for me, I'd like to see the GS free itself from the modern pigeon hole of an appearance package with some slight tweaking. A Corvette version of what the new Z28 will be like. This is THE generation of all to do it now that the name is back (Despite it being Stingray instead of Sting Ray). So far lots of great ideas from posters I'd like to see in a new Stingray with Grand Sport on the fender badges....minus any chrome or fancy gadgets....
I mean when you think about it, do a lot of people really want a race car? They want a "track weapon" but they also want sat nav, blue tooth, eight way adjustable seats, sound insulation, a nice stereo system with more speakers than teeth in your head. Keep the Z06 option as the street/track car but have the new GS as the track car just a hair from not being street legal for those feeling gutsy enough to drive one outside of a track.
Last edited by 1985 Corvette; 04-29-2013 at 09:37 PM.
