taxdr1965

Went to the NY auto show to check out the new corvette. My last corvette was 1988 35th anniversary all white. The car was an utter piece of junk, dropped the rear end at 30k miles. Since then I have owned mainly german cars, not so much for the looks, but more the way they drive and are put together. BMW 530i, great car, Mercedes 500sl, sold after a year, nice looking but not fun to drive. Then in 2008 went back to BMW 335i. I looked at the 2008 corvette about the same money. Great engine,but that was it, still was not refined like a german car and the interior looked like crap. Still felt big and heavy and the body was not that tight. I could imagine that in a year or so the squeaks and rattles would appear. That pretty much does not happen in German cars. Sold the BMW and again looked at the corvette, wanted a convertible. Looked online and found one at the Porsche dealer, went for a test drive and again felt the build quality was not very good. The guy asked if I would drive a 2009 Boxster-S. I told him did not really like the look of the boxster, but why not give it a try. !0 mins later I knew the car was for me. Fast refined, felt like a quality piece of hardware. Great engine pdk, phenomenal handling. I have it 3 years now, but was curious about the Corvette. I think it looks real good, the interior looks to be upgraded. If the car is 70k or so they are competing with the boxster, m-3, and maybe 911, which is more money. The real question Chevy has to ask themselves is who is the target market. Remember people in the 20's and 30's are not buying this car too expensive for most and only 2 seats. This is more a third car. So people buying Porsche, BMW, Audi are the market 40, 50, 60. We are buying image, whether they say it or not, performance, technology, build quality etc.. Might I consider it?? Yes i was gong to buy a 991 carrera s. Don't luv the looks but it is built superbly, and drives phenomenal. I am going to wait and give Chevy a try, but they have to re-market the car. Should be in a separate area of the dealer. If your paying 70k for a car you want to feel special and somewhat exclusive. Like I said people are buying image. BMW, Porsche, Mercedes, people want these cars not only because they are good cars, but for the image. The true test is how the car drives and is put together. I was disappointed no dual clutch auto, since my wife does not drive a stick. Where is the leading edge technology?? I hope its not just a pretty looking car with no soul. I drove an ATS, and to be honest it was a real good car on par with a BMW. Maybe they should have let Cadillac build the GM sports car, at least at one time it had a good name. I guess I have to wait till Sept. or so to give it a whirl. Hopefully it matches up to the German cars, not just in numbers, but in quality and feel. Sot of like apple vs, android, they both work, but people luv apples because of the way it feels and works in your hand. Same thing with cars, has to have the right feel. Its not the 60's with just a good motor, must be refined this time.

jimmyb

With all respect, your entire post has been covered here about 5 MILLION times. Sadly, it appears that the C7 has moved in the direction of German cars in terms of fit/finish/etc, and all Corvette guys can focus on is Tadge saying the C7 makes the C6 obsolete (which it should).

Jimmy

jb_va2001

If I might paraphrase, you can't be all things to all people. And if you try, you won't do anything particularly well. Corvette needs to pick a market/price point/buyer profile and go for it.

In my area I see the younger sports car enthusiasts (30-40YOs with $$$) buying GT-Rs or BMWs over other alternatives. Before people start dissing the GT-R, we had 24 show up at Cars & Coffee yesterday. I believe Corvette has a market share lead in the 50YOs+ around me, with the 911 a close second.

Bear in mind, units sold doesn't necessarily dictate the profit generated. I suspect the average 911 is priced much higher than average Corvette, so the profits Porsche sees on fewer units vs Corvette may indicate more profits while appearing more exclusive.

Cheers,
JB

taxdr1965

FYI, this is the first time the car has appeared in the NY area where there are tons of BMW and Porsche owners. If you want the corvette to survive and get better, it will need these types of buyers.

jimmyb

24 GT-R's in ONE place? Unbelievable, you saw 2% of ALL the GT-R's in the states!!! All kidding aside, I will go with you on BMW and 911 level of sales (and desirability) but the GT-R is literally a TINY blip, it sells worse than the Viper, and that is saying something (I think Nissan has sold 1,000+ GT-R's in a calender year only ONCE).

Jimmy

mitchydkid

Perception is a dishonest beast. When my wife first got her BMW I was super impressed. 4 failed window regulators, burned out tail light harness, 2 broken sun roof mechs, stranded twice, leaky valve cover because it is plastic and warps, and all the plastics under the hood are brittle and crumbling. Oh, and the A/C has been "fixed" twice and still only blows cool, not cold air. I like the car, but the perception that German engineering is better has evaporated. My Chevy truck from the same year model is MUCH better put together and its just a base model.

My conclusion? You can't judge a car's quality by brand or previous versions. Quality fluctuates based on decisions made during that cycle's design. As for prestige... that's for impressing high school girls and I'm way past that stage in my life.

taxdr1965

We all know that any car make can have quality issues, it happens. I fialed to mention the mercedes sl500 I had needed the whole transmission replaced. Like the guy said, people in 30, 40 with $$, are buying Porsche and BMW on reputation alone. I honestly drive my Porsche hard, take it to the track 3x a year etc.. Its a perforamance car, it should be driven that way. I would luv to buy american, the jury is still out. I hope it is an awesome car, if it is I will get one.

Jon H

Wrong. Keep in mind sales would be even greater if many dealers (majority of CA dealers) didn't mark up the car every year.


US GT-R Sales Figures 6769 total sold


2013

January 48
February 98

2012

49 December
85 November
86 October
119 September
138 August
128 July
104 June
135 May
118 April
139 March
67 February
20 January

1188 sold in 2012


2011

35 December 2011
56 November 2011
101 October 2011
107 September 2011
112 August 2011
56 - July 2011
99 - June 2011
132 - May 2011
258 - April 2011
278 - March 2011
38 - February 2011
22 - January 2011


1294 Sold to date in 2011


2010:

67 - January 2010
71 - February 2010
87 - March 2010
106 - April 2010
89- May 2010
84 - June 2010
86 - July 2010
90 - August 2010
63- Sept 2010
46 - October 2010
50- November 2010
38 - December 2010

877 Sold in 2010


2009:

94 - January 09
169 - February 09
137 - March 09
171 - April 09
146 - May 09
150 - June 09
128 - July 09
100-August 09
111- September 09
117-October 09
92 -November 09
119-December 09

1,534 sold in 2009

2008:
147 - July 08
484 - August 08
421 - September 08
321 - October 08
208 - November 08
149 - December 08

1,730 sold in 2008

jimmyb

Sorry, I should have checked goodcarbadcar.net before running my mouth.

Jimmy

taxdr1965

There are quite a few former Corvette owners here, and I'm sure all of us took a good look at the pre-production C7 information before deciding to go with the 981. My last two "sports cars" were 2005 and 2009 Corvettes. I put "sports cars" in quotes because the Corvette, in spite of what many claim, is not a true sports car. It is an excellent GT, can be exceptional on the track, and is brutally fast in any configuration. It is not however, a sports car by any of my own definitions.

Why? Because as much as the car has been improved over the years, and it has been, it still lacks the feel of a true sports car and can leave the driver with little feedback. This is why I sold my 2009, which was a beautiful and trouble free high performance open top car. At one point I realized I preferred driving my Volvo S60 over the Corvette ... that was the tipping point for me.

Still, I waited for the renderings and early specs to be "leaked" before placing my order for the 981. What I saw was a further evolution of the same basic design. Bolder styling and upgraded interiors did not make this anything that convinced me to stay in the Corvette fold.

Overall, the Corvette is a solid design .. and one which has openly targeted the 911 as its standard. It is virtually the same size and weight as the 911, but that seems to be as far as that standard is followed. The Corvette is a good looking and powerful car which can generate neck snapping acceleration and eye popping lateral force around a race course. It still, however, is a GM product and manages to share certain components with other GM products. Build quality is not as good as the German cars, although it is much better than the older versions. Steering is much improved, and the latest manual transmissions are as good as anything I've used.

Ergonomics can be awkward, especially the GM system of using stalks for everything. (I don't know if the C7 continues to use this archaic layout.) The seats are comfortable for normal driving, but far from competition grade. Manual seat back controls are awkward, and I can only hope GM finally added a power seat back for the C7. The biggest problem, for me anyway, is that the car feels much bigger and heavier than it really is. I never felt that I was driving a sports car. In fact, unless pushed, it felt pretty much like any other GM sedan. When pushed, it could be truly amazing, but that's not the majority of most of our daily driving.

The move away for the Vette to the 981 was, for me, a return to a real sports car. I don't know how much actual cross shopping there will be, especially since the new Vette won't even be available until late summer/early fall. The Corvette diehards will be lined up to be the first on their block with the new C7, but sales after that initial rush will depend on how good the car turns out to be. If early reliability turns out to be good, and that can be a real problem, and the road tests are glowing, the car will sell well. Will it take sales from Porsche? My guess is that that will be very unlikely.

Zee0hSix

There are a suprising amount of BMW/Porsche owners on this forum that have no problems with the build quality of their Corvettes and I don't read about many complaints about creaks and rattles, other than the targa top which is an easy fix.

As far as the interior of the Corvette, yea, could be better, but the interior of my Wife's 3 series BMW is just down right simplistic and plain and unlike my Corvette does not even have real leather.

I find high-end German cars are over priced and expensive to maintain. I was once a big fan, now, not so much.

I am now on my second Infiniti as a DD the build quality is superb, the interiors are magnificent and the cars could not be more dependable.

Zee0hSix

I have owned, driven and raced many sports cars and the Z06 is about as sports car as you can get in every definition of the word. As far as Corvette not taking sales from Porsche I would have to agree with you. Even if the new Corvette was the best car in the world, Porsche owners are ferociously loyal.

RockIT9

I'm confused. Anyway, i couldn't take you seriously after comparing a boxster to a corvette.

Zee0hSix

Good catch and it looks like he just joined.

Did somebody say.............Troll?

taxdr1965

thats why car and driver rates the boxster the best handling sports car in the world.

skank

I too have owned Corvettes and then moved on to Ferrari's. I have also tried Lambo's and Aston Martin's. I wouldn't own a Porsche, somebody might see me in it (Jeremy Clarksons line). I have absolutely zero interest in a Porsche after driving Ferrari's. I am very interested in a C7 though. The build quality in a Porsche has their faithful in a delusional state. I also laugh every time I hear a German car fan pimp themselves.

taxdr1965

what you were reading was a post from the Planet 9 forum that I copied onto this board. I did not own a 2005 or 2009 vette. Someone on the Planet 9 board did though.

taxdr1965

Whats your opinion on Maserati??

gthal

It is a great handling car for sure BUT very few track rats would pick it because it is lacking in other ways, namely power, and is one dimensional. It gives more of a go kart feeling than many cars but as a true track oriented car, it needs more oomph! It isn't a complete package from a performance perspective like many other cars IMO... including the Corvette.

If Porsche ever put a real engine in the Cayman/Boxster then THAT would be an amazing car. But they can't unless they want to unseat the 911 in their lineup.

taxdr1965

the new boster-s runs dead even with the base 911, go figure