Why the C7 Needs GM's Latest Infotainment System
02-15-2012, 06:32 PM
#42
Pro
Yes please!!!! But make it an option so the old fogeys can still get their stripped down "drivers car" go ahead and make power windows, power seats, power steering and fuel injection options too!
02-16-2012, 12:59 AM
#43
Team Owner
I think you have it backwards LOL.Some of these household gadgets and doodads that you speak of are probably better suited to a Lincoln Town Car or Cadillac Sedan DeVille, THOSE are what old fogeys drove!
Us youthful racer types prefer faster sports cars.
02-16-2012, 08:13 AM
#44
Melting Slicks
That looks awesome! 
For people raised with the web, laptops, iPads, and iPhones it's a natural, and expected part of a new high-end luxury or sports car. The electronics are becoming inexpensive, they weigh almost nothing, and are more reliable than mechanical or analog devices. Software updates can add new features easily, also very cool.
I'm impressed this is from Cadillac. It must be part of how Cadillac turned the company around, making their cars desirable again and lowering the average buyer age from "nearly dead." They need to have a really simple default setting (limited features and buttons that mimic older cars). My mom would need years to figure this out. I still get regular questions from her about how to use an iPhone. ("How do I delete an email I don't want anymore?"
)
Cheers,
JB
For people raised with the web, laptops, iPads, and iPhones it's a natural, and expected part of a new high-end luxury or sports car. The electronics are becoming inexpensive, they weigh almost nothing, and are more reliable than mechanical or analog devices. Software updates can add new features easily, also very cool.I'm impressed this is from Cadillac. It must be part of how Cadillac turned the company around, making their cars desirable again and lowering the average buyer age from "nearly dead." They need to have a really simple default setting (limited features and buttons that mimic older cars). My mom would need years to figure this out. I still get regular questions from her about how to use an iPhone. ("How do I delete an email I don't want anymore?"
)Cheers,
JB
02-16-2012, 10:32 AM
#45
Le Mans Master
Most non-audiophiles think that a sound system that is louder and has more bass is better. No needed for high quality to do that.
People who afford Corvettes most likely have iPhones, or Androids, or Tablets to entertain their passengers or when they are stopped. Why pay for it twice.
Voice activation is the future, get with the times. For touchscreens by "feel" or memory of relative location will require larger "buttons" and less sensitivity. My non-technical wife has gotten used to and comfortable with talking both to her car and her phone to cause things to happen even with young kids in the car. Anybody can do it with good systems.
It's a sports car and not meant to be an amusement park. It it is only meant to be a rollercoaster!
Infotainment systems are for SUVs and minivans. Maybe sedans. Sports cars are meant to be their own entertainment!
People who afford Corvettes most likely have iPhones, or Androids, or Tablets to entertain their passengers or when they are stopped. Why pay for it twice.
Voice activation is the future, get with the times. For touchscreens by "feel" or memory of relative location will require larger "buttons" and less sensitivity. My non-technical wife has gotten used to and comfortable with talking both to her car and her phone to cause things to happen even with young kids in the car. Anybody can do it with good systems.
It's a sports car and not meant to be an amusement park. It it is only meant to be a rollercoaster!
Infotainment systems are for SUVs and minivans. Maybe sedans. Sports cars are meant to be their own entertainment!
.Jinx
02-16-2012, 02:56 PM
#46
Le Mans Master
My needs are simple, I lived with a C4 and the digital gauges were attrocious.
My needs are simple, twobig analog gauges, RPMs and MPH, and at least 3 other smaller analog gauges for coolant, oil temps and oil pressure. Beyond this, a good (but not necessarily great) stereo, A/C. Power windows, seats are strictly optional.
Durring the 6 years I owned my C4, the windows went up and down maybe 7 times, the seats moved maybe 3 times.
My needs are simple, twobig analog gauges, RPMs and MPH, and at least 3 other smaller analog gauges for coolant, oil temps and oil pressure. Beyond this, a good (but not necessarily great) stereo, A/C. Power windows, seats are strictly optional.
Durring the 6 years I owned my C4, the windows went up and down maybe 7 times, the seats moved maybe 3 times.
02-16-2012, 03:45 PM
#47
Team Owner
02-16-2012, 05:13 PM
#49
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"Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication" - Leonardo da Vinci
I know an old fogey, and no doubt you are smarter and know more about art and design than he ever did.
02-16-2012, 06:10 PM
#50
Team Owner
It's the online video game generation.
It's not enough that kids (most of whom can't even afford a new Corvette so I'm not exactly sure why some think that new sales will be lost if that specific demographic isn't directly targeted anyway, maybe for the distant future I suppose?) pretend to be racing away from the cops and shooting/blowing things up ('Grand Theft Auto', 'Need For Speed' etc.) while playing in their living rooms/bedrooms but now we have to cater to them being able to do it while they're actually driving as well LOL.
Roads/highways in the future will be much safer for sure LOL.
Just curious, are the buyers/drivers of 'decontented' sports cars such as the Ferrari F360 Stradale/F430 Scuderia, the various Porsche GT/Club Sport models over the years and even the BMW M3 CSL lightweight models also considered 'behind the times/old fogey' types?
02-16-2012, 11:09 PM
#51
Le Mans Master
Tactile controls are not inherently evil. Well-designed ones are efficient, effective, and do not distract the operator. And they can be much faster from decision to action to result than voice control. Voice control can be great, but its existence does not obviate tactile controls.
And lots of things are unnecessary, strictly speaking, but buyers want them and they get them. You say "I don't want it," that's fine. You say "nobody should get to have it," them's fightin' words.
The high performance sports car is itself unnecessary, so be careful arguing that things you don't like or feel are more dangerous than they're worth shouldn't be available.
.Jinx
And lots of things are unnecessary, strictly speaking, but buyers want them and they get them. You say "I don't want it," that's fine. You say "nobody should get to have it," them's fightin' words.
The high performance sports car is itself unnecessary, so be careful arguing that things you don't like or feel are more dangerous than they're worth shouldn't be available.
.Jinx
02-16-2012, 11:45 PM
#52
Team Owner
Tactile controls are not inherently evil. Well-designed ones are efficient, effective, and do not distract the operator. And they can be much faster from decision to action to result than voice control. Voice control can be great, but its existence does not obviate tactile controls.
And lots of things are unnecessary, strictly speaking, but buyers want them and they get them. You say "I don't want it," that's fine. You say "nobody should get to have it," them's fightin' words.
The high performance sports car is itself unnecessary, so be careful arguing that things you don't like or feel are more dangerous than they're worth shouldn't be available.
And lots of things are unnecessary, strictly speaking, but buyers want them and they get them. You say "I don't want it," that's fine. You say "nobody should get to have it," them's fightin' words.
The high performance sports car is itself unnecessary, so be careful arguing that things you don't like or feel are more dangerous than they're worth shouldn't be available.
All excellent points. 
I would never even attempt to try and tell anyone that simply because I don't want that they shouldn't or can't have it, that would be totally unfair and uncalled for.
But on the flip side, those of us that don't want some of these items in our car also don't want to be told "no, you HAVE TO have them because we like them" either, those too is fightin' words.
I supposed majority will rule on that one.
This is why many of us say make it 'optional'.
I ordered my C6 without navigation, On Star or XM Radio and that's exactly how I would order the car again today if I could (I of course cannot, as items such as On Star and Satellite radio are now standard).
The downside with options is that it also adds more cost for those that want that particular item (ie: making something standard across the full production/model run generally makes it cheaper of course) but GM like it's that way as they do make some good profit on the options...and of course that's how it's always been anyway.
02-17-2012, 12:39 AM
#53
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Voice control does not obviate the need for tactile controls (real ***** and buttons). It supplements them. A touch screen is not a a true tactile control.
The OP was about if we agree or disagree that the Corvette NEEDS the latest infotainment system. I clearly disagree. I am stating why I disagree. Infotainment systems are for minivans and SUVs, not sports cars.
Do I think they should urade the electronics in the Corvette? Absolutely. They should make it so the passenger can operate the Nav system while in motion. It is entirely possible to tell if it the passenger or the driver that is operating the system. The screen should be bigger and higher resolution. I think they should do more with the heads-up.
Look if people want infotainment systems that allow the car to drive itself, and have dual drop down 17" screens, great. I don't want it, and I think that sort of thing is contrary to the purpose of the Corvette, I don't to have to have it to get better leather or certainly anything vaguely related to performance.
It's a sports car, not a living room on wheels.
The OP was about if we agree or disagree that the Corvette NEEDS the latest infotainment system. I clearly disagree. I am stating why I disagree. Infotainment systems are for minivans and SUVs, not sports cars.
Do I think they should urade the electronics in the Corvette? Absolutely. They should make it so the passenger can operate the Nav system while in motion. It is entirely possible to tell if it the passenger or the driver that is operating the system. The screen should be bigger and higher resolution. I think they should do more with the heads-up.
Look if people want infotainment systems that allow the car to drive itself, and have dual drop down 17" screens, great. I don't want it, and I think that sort of thing is contrary to the purpose of the Corvette, I don't to have to have it to get better leather or certainly anything vaguely related to performance.
It's a sports car, not a living room on wheels.
02-17-2012, 01:32 AM
#54
Le Mans Master
I interpreted the OP that GM's latest infotainment system needs to be available in C7, not that every aspect of it be made standard. I think the responses in this thread show enough demand for that. And I doubt GM would give away navigation -- they'll use it to sell heated seats and HUD at a tidy profit.
But an infotainment system is just an improvement on the car stereo. I know some folks think sports cars shouldn't play any music but the engine roaring and the tires squealing, but that's a very small minority. A computer already drives the instruments, and the center stack already has small status displays for HVAC and audio, and the customer demand for built-in navigation is at least a significant minority if not a majority at this point -- enough that the center console needs to be designed with a relatively large display. If the screen is there, and the need to display basic system status is there, make use of it to provide more for those who are asking for it. Without getting rid of those fixed-position physically-differentiated basic controls, of course
And yes, a simple touch screen is not tactile, but check out the CUE demo -- it's more than a simple touch screen.
.Jinx
But an infotainment system is just an improvement on the car stereo. I know some folks think sports cars shouldn't play any music but the engine roaring and the tires squealing, but that's a very small minority. A computer already drives the instruments, and the center stack already has small status displays for HVAC and audio, and the customer demand for built-in navigation is at least a significant minority if not a majority at this point -- enough that the center console needs to be designed with a relatively large display. If the screen is there, and the need to display basic system status is there, make use of it to provide more for those who are asking for it. Without getting rid of those fixed-position physically-differentiated basic controls, of course
And yes, a simple touch screen is not tactile, but check out the CUE demo -- it's more than a simple touch screen.
.Jinx
02-17-2012, 02:42 AM
#55
Team Owner
I interpreted the OP that GM's latest infotainment system needs to be available in C7, not that every aspect of it be made standard. I think the responses in this thread show enough demand for that. And I doubt GM would give away navigation -- they'll use it to sell heated seats and HUD at a tidy profit.
But an infotainment system is just an improvement on the car stereo. I know some folks think sports cars shouldn't play any music but the engine roaring and the tires squealing, but that's a very small minority. A computer already drives the instruments, and the center stack already has small status displays for HVAC and audio, and the customer demand for built-in navigation is at least a significant minority if not a majority at this point -- enough that the center console needs to be designed with a relatively large display. If the screen is there, and the need to display basic system status is there, make use of it to provide more for those who are asking for it. Without getting rid of those fixed-position physically-differentiated basic controls, of course
And yes, a simple touch screen is not tactile, but check out the CUE demo -- it's more than a simple touch screen.
But an infotainment system is just an improvement on the car stereo. I know some folks think sports cars shouldn't play any music but the engine roaring and the tires squealing, but that's a very small minority. A computer already drives the instruments, and the center stack already has small status displays for HVAC and audio, and the customer demand for built-in navigation is at least a significant minority if not a majority at this point -- enough that the center console needs to be designed with a relatively large display. If the screen is there, and the need to display basic system status is there, make use of it to provide more for those who are asking for it. Without getting rid of those fixed-position physically-differentiated basic controls, of course
And yes, a simple touch screen is not tactile, but check out the CUE demo -- it's more than a simple touch screen.
It does seem to be want the majority are seeking and I really do want GM/Chevrolet to sell as many Corvettes as they possibly can in order to keep the price of mine down and to also ensure that we will still be able to buy new Corvettes in the future as well.
02-17-2012, 07:26 AM
#56
Racer
The opposition to the CUE system in the C7 is ill advised. These sorts of systems are an absolute must in a car in this price range. In fact, they are becoming pervasive even in less expensive cars. Corvette has to compete in an increasingly competitive market for the sports car dollar. Look at the systems in Porsche, BMW, MB, Audi etc. Those systems are the benchmark. Optional doesn't cut it. This stuff is becoming standard equipment and has come a long way since the original BMW iDrive. Much has been learned along the way and the Corvette needs to catch up and fast.
A Corvette that doesn't measure up will be badly disadvantaged and GM can't afford that.
A Corvette that doesn't measure up will be badly disadvantaged and GM can't afford that.
Last edited by BobRBob; 02-17-2012 at 10:43 AM.
02-17-2012, 10:34 AM
#57
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I have gone back and reviewed the video, press release, and other articles. This system is not as bad as I thought, but still too many layers to get to things. Perhaps it is better than the video shows, as explaining the whole interface would be lengthy.
I like the configurable gauge cluster, but would have to see more to see how much.
The programmable part is a bit concerning. If it is like android, without centralized testing, it could be bad. If it is like Apple, not so bad, but even Apple has let some bad things through. How strong is the security? how is the sytem separated for auto control systems? What info is collected and stored and transmitted?
Can you imagine the cost of repairs? eek! The 1980's LCD cluster cost like $1800.
Just saw this article on a new report from the NTSB on distracted driving and disabling certain features when driving. http://www.autoweek.com/article/2012...NEWS/120219898
I like the configurable gauge cluster, but would have to see more to see how much.
The programmable part is a bit concerning. If it is like android, without centralized testing, it could be bad. If it is like Apple, not so bad, but even Apple has let some bad things through. How strong is the security? how is the sytem separated for auto control systems? What info is collected and stored and transmitted?
Can you imagine the cost of repairs? eek! The 1980's LCD cluster cost like $1800.
Just saw this article on a new report from the NTSB on distracted driving and disabling certain features when driving. http://www.autoweek.com/article/2012...NEWS/120219898
Last edited by Racer X; 02-17-2012 at 10:58 AM. Reason: Added link
02-17-2012, 11:21 AM
#58
Le Mans Master
Yes, Ray LaHood, US Secretary of Transportation, has been championing various ideas to make distracted driving impossible. He called for banning all phone use in cars last year IIRC.
02-17-2012, 12:16 PM
#59
Melting Slicks
I've had two cars (not GM) with built-in GPS and cell phones using touch screens. Both had nice user interfaces. But neither allowed you to program addresses, change GPS route options, or dial phone numbers while the car was moving. This I'm certain was a safety feature to protect the company from lawsuits. Unfortunately a passenger can't do it for you either while the car was moving, so we use a GPS App and made calls from an iPhone at times. You could still change radio stations and program XM radio on the touch screen when the car was moving. Limited voice input was possible but it was unpredictable and I couldn't remember the instructions it would recognize so I seldom used it.
Cheers,
JB
Cheers,
JB
02-17-2012, 04:09 PM
#60
Team Owner
The opposition to the CUE system in the C7 is ill advised. These sorts of systems are an absolute must in a car in this price range. In fact, they are becoming pervasive even in less expensive cars. Corvette has to compete in an increasingly competitive market for the sports car dollar. Look at the systems in Porsche, BMW, MB, Audi etc. Those systems are the benchmark. Optional doesn't cut it. This stuff is becoming standard equipment and has come a long way since the original BMW iDrive. Much has been learned along the way and the Corvette needs to catch up and fast.
A Corvette that doesn't measure up will be badly disadvantaged and GM can't afford that.
A Corvette that doesn't measure up will be badly disadvantaged and GM can't afford that.
If they make too many add on items standard with the base car and it ultimately drives the base MSRP up much higher then it can hurt sales.
If they don't make it standard and yet these same features are standard in another automaker's base performance offerings then it could hurt sales as well.
One factor that you may not be considering though is that those entry level/base model Porsches/BMWs/Nissans etc (some of which can also MSRP almost as high as a base Corvette) DO NOT offer many other critical 'standards' (ie: power/performance/acceleration/braking/handling etc.) that a base Corvette offers either. So the Corvette might just be able to afford to bypass having some of that high tech touch screen electronics as standard and yet still sell very well.
Or maybe not.