Europe goes no more manuals
#1
Drifting
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Europe goes no more manuals
"Lamborghini research and development director, Maurizio Reggiani, has confirmed to MotorTrend magazine that Lamborghini will no longer offer a manual transmission option. The Aventador will be the first lamborghini offered without such an option and all indications are that the rest of the industry is following the same course.In the interview, Reggiani explains that just one to two percent of the 1,200 cars that left the factory last year opted for a manual transmission. When the Gallardo replacement, due next year, is introduced it will not include a manual option either. The explanation offered is that for the whole car to work seamlessly, an automated transmission must be offered to make the most of other automated components. It seems Lamborghini want to give customers a faultless experience and remove the potential for driver error.
A decision will also be made on the possibility of a Sesto Elemento limited edition run in the next few months. The technology used in the model is nearing production feasibility. A number of improvements have also ensured that quality levels are at an all-time high at the factory.
The manual gearbox news won’t come as a surprise to most who follow the supercar industry, we reported before on this subject. Next to that Ferrari have produced their last manual gearbox in the California, with models following this all being automated only."
It appears that to appeal in Europe, the C7 Corvette will have to offer a trans that will be the match of this approach.
A decision will also be made on the possibility of a Sesto Elemento limited edition run in the next few months. The technology used in the model is nearing production feasibility. A number of improvements have also ensured that quality levels are at an all-time high at the factory.
The manual gearbox news won’t come as a surprise to most who follow the supercar industry, we reported before on this subject. Next to that Ferrari have produced their last manual gearbox in the California, with models following this all being automated only."
It appears that to appeal in Europe, the C7 Corvette will have to offer a trans that will be the match of this approach.
#2
Burning Brakes
It seems Lamborghini want to give customers a faultless experience and remove the potential for driver error.
#3
Look, I have insisted on owning only manuals for my last 10 cars but the writing is on the wall. Dual-clutch systems or sequential manuals are simply the future. After spending about 20 minutes in a '10 M3 with the double-clutch/paddle shifter I was completely sold - it is clearly better for the racetrack AND offers welcome relief for those who daily drive their cars in stop-and-go traffic.
Is it as involving and fun as a manual? ehhh....debatable. When you get perfect upshifts and can keep focused on your lines rather than your shifting, it is more fun. But it does take an element of driver control out of the equation for sure.
All I know is that GM would simply be falling behind its competitors if it does not offer this kind of transmission. It's not an option for them, they must include it for the C7.
Is it as involving and fun as a manual? ehhh....debatable. When you get perfect upshifts and can keep focused on your lines rather than your shifting, it is more fun. But it does take an element of driver control out of the equation for sure.
All I know is that GM would simply be falling behind its competitors if it does not offer this kind of transmission. It's not an option for them, they must include it for the C7.
#4
Team Owner
Outside of a Ferrari, it'll be a cold day in hell that my sports cars will have anything but a manual transmission. Just the way I am. Of course I'm not saying GM shouldn't look into alternatives for their cars, but for us gear heads, they need that manual transmission option.
#5
The poster is incorrect about the Ferrari California being the last Ferraari that offered a manual tranny. The California only offers the dual clutch tranny. The last Ferrari to offer it was the F430 and is the 599.
I have owned 10 Vettes, all with 6 speeds. Currently have a 10 GS. Also owned 2 Ferraris, a 360 spider with a 6 speed and an F430 spider with an F1. I love a 6 spped, but if the C7 should offer a 6 speed and a true DCT, I would opt for the DTC. It is impossible to shift a 6 speed as quickly as a DTC, and, a DTC or true F1 tranny is fun to drive.
I have owned 10 Vettes, all with 6 speeds. Currently have a 10 GS. Also owned 2 Ferraris, a 360 spider with a 6 speed and an F430 spider with an F1. I love a 6 spped, but if the C7 should offer a 6 speed and a true DCT, I would opt for the DTC. It is impossible to shift a 6 speed as quickly as a DTC, and, a DTC or true F1 tranny is fun to drive.
#6
Burning Brakes
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Location: KADS- If it has wings or an engine, I can break it. Dallas TX
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Most of the people who knock the DCT, have never tried them. The new trannys are awesome, never miss a shift, improve your lap times on EVERY lap, easy to drive in stop and go traffic.
Kinda blows my mind, some people in the corvette community spends thousands or tens of thousands of dollars to get that extra little bit of performance or shave a couple of tenths off lap times. And then shoot themselves in the foot, with a antique gearbox. Because I'm a "real car guy".
Kinda blows my mind, some people in the corvette community spends thousands or tens of thousands of dollars to get that extra little bit of performance or shave a couple of tenths off lap times. And then shoot themselves in the foot, with a antique gearbox. Because I'm a "real car guy".
#7
Burning Brakes
Look, I have insisted on owning only manuals for my last 10 cars but the writing is on the wall. Dual-clutch systems or sequential manuals are simply the future. After spending about 20 minutes in a '10 M3 with the double-clutch/paddle shifter I was completely sold - it is clearly better for the racetrack AND offers welcome relief for those who daily drive their cars in stop-and-go traffic.
Is it as involving and fun as a manual? ehhh....debatable. When you get perfect upshifts and can keep focused on your lines rather than your shifting, it is more fun. But it does take an element of driver control out of the equation for sure.
All I know is that GM would simply be falling behind its competitors if it does not offer this kind of transmission. It's not an option for them, they must include it for the C7.
Is it as involving and fun as a manual? ehhh....debatable. When you get perfect upshifts and can keep focused on your lines rather than your shifting, it is more fun. But it does take an element of driver control out of the equation for sure.
All I know is that GM would simply be falling behind its competitors if it does not offer this kind of transmission. It's not an option for them, they must include it for the C7.
#8
Instructor
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read carefully how lotus converts a camry transmission into a performance transmission to go clutch less
http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...ive/index.html
http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...ive/index.html
#9
Team Owner
Most of the people who knock the DCT, have never tried them. The new trannys are awesome, never miss a shift, improve your lap times on EVERY lap, easy to drive in stop and go traffic.
Kinda blows my mind, some people in the corvette community spends thousands or tens of thousands of dollars to get that extra little bit of performance or shave a couple of tenths off lap times. And then shoot themselves in the foot, with a antique gearbox. Because I'm a "real car guy".
Kinda blows my mind, some people in the corvette community spends thousands or tens of thousands of dollars to get that extra little bit of performance or shave a couple of tenths off lap times. And then shoot themselves in the foot, with a antique gearbox. Because I'm a "real car guy".
#11
Team Owner
#13
Melting Slicks
#14
Drifting
Personally I do not like the trend in automotives. Increasingly the car is being controlled more & more by computer systems & this means less & less interactions between driver & car. To me, when I think of the enjoyment of driving a car it is not specifically the speed or lap time but the interaction & thrill of driving a car which means controlling it near or at its limits.
With all of these computer over rides it begs me to question if people want to drive a car or play a video game?
I have been very critical of the GT-R for this reason. Auto tranny, many computer over rides, AWD, all = taking away from interaction of driving a car by using skill. I would have bought a 370Z if it had 100 more hp then the 350Z being it is a small, fun smaller car to drive. A GT-R to me was totally out of the question being it reminded me of a computer game vs a drivers car.
With all of these computer over rides it begs me to question if people want to drive a car or play a video game?
I have been very critical of the GT-R for this reason. Auto tranny, many computer over rides, AWD, all = taking away from interaction of driving a car by using skill. I would have bought a 370Z if it had 100 more hp then the 350Z being it is a small, fun smaller car to drive. A GT-R to me was totally out of the question being it reminded me of a computer game vs a drivers car.
Last edited by zland; 07-13-2011 at 01:29 AM.
#15
Melting Slicks
Personally, I enjoy a manual. I don't mind shifting in traffic all day. Maybe because it is because I am ADD and become bored in anything else. +1 6 speed
#16
Team Owner
I do love shifting and heel-toeing...
#17
Drifting
Personally I do not like the trend in automotives. Increasingly the car is being controlled more & more by computer systems & this means less & less interactions between driver & car. To me, when I think of the enjoyment of driving a car it is not specifically the speed or lap time but the interaction & thrill of driving a car which means controlling it near or at its limits.
With all of these computer over rides it begs me to question if people want to drive a car or play a video game?
I have been very critical of the GT-R for this reason. Auto tranny, many computer over rides, AWD, all = taking away from interaction of driving a car by using skill. I would have bought a 370Z if it had 100 more hp then the 350Z being it is a small, fun smaller car to drive. A GT-R to me was totally out of the question being it reminded me of a computer game vs a drivers car.
With all of these computer over rides it begs me to question if people want to drive a car or play a video game?
I have been very critical of the GT-R for this reason. Auto tranny, many computer over rides, AWD, all = taking away from interaction of driving a car by using skill. I would have bought a 370Z if it had 100 more hp then the 350Z being it is a small, fun smaller car to drive. A GT-R to me was totally out of the question being it reminded me of a computer game vs a drivers car.
#18
Drifting
I happen to like them both, the DTC and manual, but when driving around, not racing
a pure manual is hard to beat, the feeling seems more connected to the car.
Most ppl here could careless about a 10th of second better lap times, when they just drive for fun. I think the same can be said about the Ferrari community, I don't ever see any Ferrari's at the track, unless it is a parade day.
Most ppl are magazine racers... when it comes to stats..
a pure manual is hard to beat, the feeling seems more connected to the car.
Most ppl here could careless about a 10th of second better lap times, when they just drive for fun. I think the same can be said about the Ferrari community, I don't ever see any Ferrari's at the track, unless it is a parade day.
Most ppl are magazine racers... when it comes to stats..
#19
Drifting
99% of corvette owners lack the driving skill to wring out every ounce of performance of these cars anyway. Meaning, for 99% of us, 1/10th of a sec is the LEAST of our problems.
That being said, GM would be FOOLS to not at least OFFER a DCT style tranny of some form on ALL of their Vette models.
I love driving stick shift. I have only owned ONE auto car in my life, and it was my first one...an 88' Chevy Corsica. And that car sucked. It's been 4 and 5 speeds ever since. I went through a lot of crap just to find an 05 civic, my current DD, with a 5 speed, some years ago, when I bought it new. Manual trans are just more fun, bottom line. Yes, I have driven the other...in two cars, a Lancer, and a 10' M3. It was nice, but man I wanted to see what a 6 speed woulda been like in that M3.
Truth be told, though, people like me, like us, are a dying breed. People don't want to do things for themselves anymore. Just look at oil changes. Hardly anyone does their own, anymore. Something as simple as that. People would rather pay to have someone or something else do many of these tasks for them, and driving is no different. There will come a day when the manual gearbox is nothing more than a relic to be viewed on old classic cars, in much the same way the accelerator handle is on the old Model T Fords. Kids will ask, "What's THAT, dad?" And we'll have to explain, that once upon a time, humans actually controlled the clutch while driving. People like us won't have a choice, because it would not make good business since to keep offering an option that fewer people purchase...much cheaper to screw us out of the equation, and just mass produce all the same style tranny.
That being said, GM would be FOOLS to not at least OFFER a DCT style tranny of some form on ALL of their Vette models.
I love driving stick shift. I have only owned ONE auto car in my life, and it was my first one...an 88' Chevy Corsica. And that car sucked. It's been 4 and 5 speeds ever since. I went through a lot of crap just to find an 05 civic, my current DD, with a 5 speed, some years ago, when I bought it new. Manual trans are just more fun, bottom line. Yes, I have driven the other...in two cars, a Lancer, and a 10' M3. It was nice, but man I wanted to see what a 6 speed woulda been like in that M3.
Truth be told, though, people like me, like us, are a dying breed. People don't want to do things for themselves anymore. Just look at oil changes. Hardly anyone does their own, anymore. Something as simple as that. People would rather pay to have someone or something else do many of these tasks for them, and driving is no different. There will come a day when the manual gearbox is nothing more than a relic to be viewed on old classic cars, in much the same way the accelerator handle is on the old Model T Fords. Kids will ask, "What's THAT, dad?" And we'll have to explain, that once upon a time, humans actually controlled the clutch while driving. People like us won't have a choice, because it would not make good business since to keep offering an option that fewer people purchase...much cheaper to screw us out of the equation, and just mass produce all the same style tranny.
#20
Drifting
99% of corvette owners lack the driving skill to wring out every ounce of performance of these cars anyway. Meaning, for 99% of us, 1/10th of a sec is the LEAST of our problems.
That being said, GM would be FOOLS to not at least OFFER a DCT style tranny of some form on ALL of their Vette models.
I love driving stick shift. I have only owned ONE auto car in my life, and it was my first one...an 88' Chevy Corsica. And that car sucked. It's been 4 and 5 speeds ever since. I went through a lot of crap just to find an 05 civic, my current DD, with a 5 speed, some years ago, when I bought it new. Manual trans are just more fun, bottom line. Yes, I have driven the other...in two cars, a Lancer, and a 10' M3. It was nice, but man I wanted to see what a 6 speed woulda been like in that M3.
Truth be told, though, people like me, like us, are a dying breed. People don't want to do things for themselves anymore. Just look at oil changes. Hardly anyone does their own, anymore. Something as simple as that. People would rather pay to have someone or something else do many of these tasks for them, and driving is no different. There will come a day when the manual gearbox is nothing more than a relic to be viewed on old classic cars, in much the same way the accelerator handle is on the old Model T Fords. Kids will ask, "What's THAT, dad?" And we'll have to explain, that once upon a time, humans actually controlled the clutch while driving. People like us won't have a choice, because it would not make good business since to keep offering an option that fewer people purchase...much cheaper to screw us out of the equation, and just mass produce all the same style tranny.
That being said, GM would be FOOLS to not at least OFFER a DCT style tranny of some form on ALL of their Vette models.
I love driving stick shift. I have only owned ONE auto car in my life, and it was my first one...an 88' Chevy Corsica. And that car sucked. It's been 4 and 5 speeds ever since. I went through a lot of crap just to find an 05 civic, my current DD, with a 5 speed, some years ago, when I bought it new. Manual trans are just more fun, bottom line. Yes, I have driven the other...in two cars, a Lancer, and a 10' M3. It was nice, but man I wanted to see what a 6 speed woulda been like in that M3.
Truth be told, though, people like me, like us, are a dying breed. People don't want to do things for themselves anymore. Just look at oil changes. Hardly anyone does their own, anymore. Something as simple as that. People would rather pay to have someone or something else do many of these tasks for them, and driving is no different. There will come a day when the manual gearbox is nothing more than a relic to be viewed on old classic cars, in much the same way the accelerator handle is on the old Model T Fords. Kids will ask, "What's THAT, dad?" And we'll have to explain, that once upon a time, humans actually controlled the clutch while driving. People like us won't have a choice, because it would not make good business since to keep offering an option that fewer people purchase...much cheaper to screw us out of the equation, and just mass produce all the same style tranny.