[Z06] What should it Cost?
07-25-2014, 10:57 PM
#61
How do your track videos prove that a bronze guide is superior to a PM guide, that SS valves is superior to the F2042P valves? There are plenty of track videos on this forum from members running our heads. I believe we even have a member on this forum with a sub 8 second nurburging time with our heads.
07-26-2014, 12:36 AM
#63
Team Owner
All we did was post up a fact: that we had a Z in the shop with wcch heads (bronze guides and SS valves) that failed its wiggle test.
Then you asked me if our guides were superior to other vendors bronze guides (im not sure if it was this thread or another that you asked this). I responded to this by posting that our guides have a hardness of hrc40 and the competitors bronze guide has a hardness of hrc25. This means that our guide is harder than the competitors guide. We feel that this alone makes our hardened PM guide superior.
I see no bashing or bad business tactics in that at all, just posting up our viewpoint. I see that you have an issue with it because it differs from your view point. While i respect your professional opinion in this matter, we feel that you are incorrect and misleading alot of CF member when you consistently tell members to go bronze and solid SS. I wonder why GM didn't use bronze and a heavy SS valves, it most certainly would have been cheaper.
How do your track videos prove that a bronze guide is superior to a PM guide, that SS valves is superior to the F2042P valves? There are plenty of track videos on this forum from members running our heads. I believe we even have a member on this forum with a sub 8 second nurburging time with our heads.
Then you asked me if our guides were superior to other vendors bronze guides (im not sure if it was this thread or another that you asked this). I responded to this by posting that our guides have a hardness of hrc40 and the competitors bronze guide has a hardness of hrc25. This means that our guide is harder than the competitors guide. We feel that this alone makes our hardened PM guide superior.
I see no bashing or bad business tactics in that at all, just posting up our viewpoint. I see that you have an issue with it because it differs from your view point. While i respect your professional opinion in this matter, we feel that you are incorrect and misleading alot of CF member when you consistently tell members to go bronze and solid SS. I wonder why GM didn't use bronze and a heavy SS valves, it most certainly would have been cheaper.
How do your track videos prove that a bronze guide is superior to a PM guide, that SS valves is superior to the F2042P valves? There are plenty of track videos on this forum from members running our heads. I believe we even have a member on this forum with a sub 8 second nurburging time with our heads.
But I am glad to see you took a chill pill after your tirade earlier today. Yes it was archived.
And I will likely share your recent tactics with the membership. I know during our discussions of our motors and valve trains in the paddock tomorrow, you will be the center of the conversation.
DH
07-26-2014, 12:47 AM
#64
Racer
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alright I need to know if those heads were stamped from WCCH. so now what???? I'm waiting for my heads from wcch should I be going th AH route????? WTF...help help meltdown mode. lol
Last edited by telly444; 07-26-2014 at 01:03 AM.
07-26-2014, 01:21 AM
#65
Supporting Vendor
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Yes this particular head was engraved near the coolant plug. We have had other bronze guides and ss valve'd head fail the wiggle test from other rebuilders as well. Some were up on the miles and should have been out of spec and some were not. All parts wear out eventually.
I don't see why some are finding this so hard to believe. I am just posting what we know and what we have seen. We don't post based on hype, we post based on what we see and know as a fact (first hand). some owners of vehicles don't like their information shared on a public forum (weather they are member of said public forum or not). We keep our customers information private unless they give us permission to share it. We respect our customers privacy.
telly444: if you already sent your heads out to another rebuilder then please don't stress. The rebuilder you mentioned does very good work and very high quality work, you more than likely will not have anything to worry about any time soon. Sleep easy sir you will be ok.
We are just presenting an alternative to the conventional though process of bronze and solid ss. We are of the new school of though, the school of thought that technology improves, alloys improve and techniques improve.
I don't see why some are finding this so hard to believe. I am just posting what we know and what we have seen. We don't post based on hype, we post based on what we see and know as a fact (first hand). some owners of vehicles don't like their information shared on a public forum (weather they are member of said public forum or not). We keep our customers information private unless they give us permission to share it. We respect our customers privacy.
telly444: if you already sent your heads out to another rebuilder then please don't stress. The rebuilder you mentioned does very good work and very high quality work, you more than likely will not have anything to worry about any time soon. Sleep easy sir you will be ok.
We are just presenting an alternative to the conventional though process of bronze and solid ss. We are of the new school of though, the school of thought that technology improves, alloys improve and techniques improve.
Last edited by American Heritage; 07-26-2014 at 01:24 AM. Reason: spelling
07-26-2014, 12:29 PM
#66
Melting Slicks
07-26-2014, 01:56 PM
#67
Yep,
And I'd like to tell him: Thank you so very much for the info on the variable and inconsistent valve stem wall thickness of the stock hollow stemmed exhaust valves which he examined, as I am believing that he did in fact inspect a genuine stock LS7 exhaust valve, and I'm not about to call him a liar on that. Wouldn't dream of it, and I believe every word of his findings on the wall stem thickness of the OEM exhaust valves.
And I'd like to tell him: Thank you so very much for the info on the variable and inconsistent valve stem wall thickness of the stock hollow stemmed exhaust valves which he examined, as I am believing that he did in fact inspect a genuine stock LS7 exhaust valve, and I'm not about to call him a liar on that. Wouldn't dream of it, and I believe every word of his findings on the wall stem thickness of the OEM exhaust valves.
07-27-2014, 11:43 AM
#68
Burning Brakes
Yep,
And I'd like to tell him: Thank you so very much for the info on the variable and inconsistent valve stem wall thickness of the stock hollow stemmed exhaust valves which he examined, as I am believing that he did in fact inspect a genuine stock LS7 exhaust valve, and I'm not about to call him a liar on that. Wouldn't dream of it, and I believe every word of his findings on the wall stem thickness of the OEM exhaust valves.
And I'd like to tell him: Thank you so very much for the info on the variable and inconsistent valve stem wall thickness of the stock hollow stemmed exhaust valves which he examined, as I am believing that he did in fact inspect a genuine stock LS7 exhaust valve, and I'm not about to call him a liar on that. Wouldn't dream of it, and I believe every word of his findings on the wall stem thickness of the OEM exhaust valves.
07-27-2014, 01:24 PM
#70
Melting Slicks
Indeed they do. 88K miles of hard track use in Howies car even with guide wear and no refreshes. That says it all. Thanks for pointing that out.
Im still looking for those results in a Z06 with SS valves. Do you know where I can find that?
07-27-2014, 06:26 PM
#71
Team Owner
DH
07-27-2014, 06:31 PM
#72
07-27-2014, 06:34 PM
#73
Melting Slicks
Yes, in the beginning when these cars were failing many thought a broken spring was the culprit when indeed it was most likely worn guides. But yes, broken spring is always a possibility.
Were you just plain lucky to have lasted that long? Could be. It seems you got a lot out of them before they let go that's for sure considering how few miles others have gone when it let go.
08-01-2014, 03:08 AM
#74
Supporting Vendor
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^This is why I went with American Heritage... it all comes down to what you believe after doing YOUR research... is right for YOU, and what allows you to sleep better at night. For me, bronze guides were used in racing application... ran 7000+RPM's for a short while then rebuilt (no real long term data). I chose PM guides for their durability vs bronze. What do I know... but I sleep great at night. Thank Khole!!
08-01-2014, 10:10 AM
#75
Team Owner
I would like to see your response if it was you at the recieving end of those remarks.
My PM and Email were burning up with local members asking why our Corvette Challenge thread which is updated at least twice a month scince 2009 had suddenly been taken down.
Its not just the comments but the actions taken. I have a right to respond.
DH
08-01-2014, 10:22 AM
#76
Team Owner
Lose the hostility and the personal attacks if this thread's going to stay open.
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/foru...rd-others.html
Personal attacks/hostility toward others
The Forum should be a place where we treat one another with civility so that it remains a fun and friendly place to hang around with other Corvette enthusiasts. Hostility to others is rude and inappropriate.
Personal attacks cannot be tolerated. Attack ideas, not fellow Forum members.
The Forum should be a place where we treat one another with civility so that it remains a fun and friendly place to hang around with other Corvette enthusiasts. Hostility to others is rude and inappropriate.
Personal attacks cannot be tolerated. Attack ideas, not fellow Forum members.
08-01-2014, 12:11 PM
#77
Safety Car
Yes this particular head was engraved near the coolant plug. We have had other bronze guides and ss valve'd head fail the wiggle test from other rebuilders as well. Some were up on the miles and should have been out of spec and some were not. All parts wear out eventually.