View Poll Results: If you have had catastrophic engine failure or a dropped valve: please check one
Voters: 21. You may not vote on this poll
[Z06] Poll on LS7's with dropped valves or catastrophic engine failure
06-27-2010, 06:43 AM
#21
for 2 motors it was exhaust valve that gave way both times? did you have the hollow sodium filled on both failures?
GM tech i have spoken to, says every ls7 that he has seen that comes in thats blown apart has a tune, if you leave the tune alone, he says these motors will last forever. This guy is a hot rodder - has a 2005 c6 with a blower on it.
The poll so far has stock engine no mods and stock tune blowing up 2 to 1 over modded or tuned LS7's.
GM tech i have spoken to, says every ls7 that he has seen that comes in thats blown apart has a tune, if you leave the tune alone, he says these motors will last forever. This guy is a hot rodder - has a 2005 c6 with a blower on it.
The poll so far has stock engine no mods and stock tune blowing up 2 to 1 over modded or tuned LS7's.
Stock engines have snapped exhaust valves...
Tune is 99.99999999% sure not the problem.
Give the poll time....
06-27-2010, 09:01 AM
#22
Melting Slicks
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I can beleive this will happen to a stainless valve only if the valvetrain geometry it not setup properly otherwise let's hear from the expert shop what really happend.
06-27-2010, 10:03 AM
#23
Le Mans Master
Thread Starter
Kinda early to declare any type of results. If I started to form an opinion already as you have I'd say out of 25,000+ Z06's built only 5 of those 25k LS7's have had a dropped valve and 1 of the 5 saw the track regularly 1 was modded, only 3 failed bone stock. So 3 out of 25k vettes dropped a valve........ IMO -nothing to worry about here
06-27-2010, 11:07 AM
#24
Le Mans Master
06-27-2010, 11:15 AM
#25
Le Mans Master
Thread Starter
Kinda early to declare any type of results. If I started to form an opinion already as you have I'd say out of 25,000+ Z06's built only 5 of those 25k LS7's have had a dropped valve and 1 of the 5 saw the track regularly 1 was modded, only 3 failed bone stock. So 3 out of 25k vettes dropped a valve........ IMO -nothing to worry about here
06-27-2010, 11:31 AM
#26
Safety Car
The reason there was no "no issues" selection is because it would over shadow the "wow" factor that the op is hoping to get with yet another pole, or just doesn't want to show you the actual true percentage of failure against none failures (which would actuall mean something)
The whole theory about the gm valves being craped was just nulled out in this very thread where one engine had aftermarket SS valves (the answer of all problems if you've read all the other threads on how SS is the fix). ooops!
So how about revising the pole and add a "no issues" selection?
The whole theory about the gm valves being craped was just nulled out in this very thread where one engine had aftermarket SS valves (the answer of all problems if you've read all the other threads on how SS is the fix). ooops!
So how about revising the pole and add a "no issues" selection?
06-27-2010, 02:00 PM
#27
Kinda early to declare any type of results. If I started to form an opinion already as you have I'd say out of 25,000+ Z06's built only 5 of those 25k LS7's have had a dropped valve and 1 of the 5 saw the track regularly 1 was modded, only 3 failed bone stock. So 3 out of 25k vettes dropped a valve........ IMO -nothing to worry about here
Only SMALL handful of these Vette owners post on the forum or even are members of this forum.. or any other forum. So you can't include the entire Vette population. You must take the entire ACTIVE Z06 Forum population to get your percentages.
or and another option to the poll for those who own Z06s and have not had total engine failures to have a better overall picture? Just a thought.
06-27-2010, 02:13 PM
#28
Le Mans Master
Thread Starter
The reason there was no "no issues" selection is because it would over shadow the "wow" factor that the op is hoping to get with yet another pole, or just doesn't want to show you the actual true percentage of failure against none failures (which would actuall mean something)
The whole theory about the gm valves being craped was just nulled out in this very thread where one engine had aftermarket SS valves (the answer of all problems if you've read all the other threads on how SS is the fix). ooops!
So how about revising the pole and add a "no issues" selection?
The whole theory about the gm valves being craped was just nulled out in this very thread where one engine had aftermarket SS valves (the answer of all problems if you've read all the other threads on how SS is the fix). ooops!
So how about revising the pole and add a "no issues" selection?
This poll has nothing to do with bashing the LS7. I love my Z06 and its LS7.
So what i have seen off this small sample is it appears that a tune will not harm the engine as almost an equal number of tuned cars versus stock cars have had a serious issue.
06-27-2010, 02:16 PM
#29
Le Mans Master
Thread Starter
The reason there was no "no issues" selection is because it would over shadow the "wow" factor that the op is hoping to get with yet another pole, or just doesn't want to show you the actual true percentage of failure against none failures (which would actuall mean something)
The whole theory about the gm valves being craped was just nulled out in this very thread where one engine had aftermarket SS valves (the answer of all problems if you've read all the other threads on how SS is the fix). ooops!
So how about revising the pole and add a "no issues" selection?
The whole theory about the gm valves being craped was just nulled out in this very thread where one engine had aftermarket SS valves (the answer of all problems if you've read all the other threads on how SS is the fix). ooops!
So how about revising the pole and add a "no issues" selection?
06-27-2010, 02:23 PM
#30
Melting Slicks
my 07 has not had a problem with anything, it has 12,000 mile with about 60 1/4 mile n/a passes on it, and another 15 or so nos passes
it might be a combo of thing that cause the fail
it might be a combo of thing that cause the fail
06-27-2010, 03:29 PM
#31
_"SCOTT"_
........................................ .....THIS THREAD =
06-27-2010, 03:42 PM
#32
Melting Slicks
06-27-2010, 04:45 PM
#33
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Mine went down like a world war 2 fighter!
From an Interested UK owner......Can't understand why people are so Protective of the Marque [let me say I have owned three Vettes a 2004 C5 Z06 a Flappy Paddle C6 and a 2007 C6 Z06.....a Superb car in so many ways....... don't get me wrong..... and I still own it! So I am a 'Enthusiast and a Fan.... but I'm not Blinkered] ........My car was a one owner with 16k I had put about 1k on it whilst accelerating through the Gears past 4th .....it let go [speed around 95......Absolutely nothing the car should find difficult..... I had a Ferrari 355 a Porsche C4S ....Audi ...Subaru 22B... Ford Cosworth etc. and many other Performance cars and the very Last thing in the world I would think about is the Engine letting go ........Driving the car as a 'Perfomance' Vehicle. I repeat there should be NO issue of the Engine letting go in this way and far from protect the Marque we should be shouting at the Top of our Voices there is something WRONG! My car was repaired under warranty a Brand New Engine and all Ancillaries including the Dry Sump....Very Good you might say..... a Bl**dy Relief would have cost me just under 20 thousand of our UK Pounds!
The Dealership handled it all very 'Quitley' They did not want any Praise on the Forums as Corvettes are their Business and did not wan't more Bad Press I know from what they said they had done them before. [Makes me wonder how many have gone unreported .....The owners like me just so relieved to have her back running at No Cost under Warranty.....That should never have been required that's my point!]
GM should not get of Lightly and hide it away .....or be allowed to.....there is a Problem with a Performance Engine that 'Lets Go' [Mine was 'Stock' in every way was being driven as a Performance car.....Briskly.....Shock Horror......This is a Sports Car and should be well capable of Brisk Driving.....I can Understand an Engine from any Marque being Tuned aftermaket to with in an inch of it's life that is the risk that owner Took. GM have a problem ......or any Poll ....of any sort with or without Options would not be necessary......Have I been involved in a Poll with any other Marque? have I had my Engine Blow at all? ....Never mind in such Spectaular Fashion......The Fact there are 'any '......and obviously 'many' GM need to sort out that Engine.
Your Engine maybe OK [now] if It let's Go tomorrow I would love to see the Look on some of your Faces.....Don't be Smug and think it can't Happen to you ....it can and you would very Quickly change your Tune if your Vehicle was over three years old or 36k.....Looking back out the rear Hatch........Oh My Goodeness.....that's Going to be Mega Expensive!
I still own mine..... as I said still drive it Briskly ....it's never 'Redlined'
with only 2k on it's new engine..... I am comfortable with it now!
06-27-2010, 04:58 PM
#34
Drifting
Poll does only apply to those on this forum so it isnt really accurate no... But that was probably the smartest thing I've heard relating to this valve dropping thing. Stuff does happen yes, but if that includes more then 1 engine out of ten thousand why does everyone think that its ok??? It shouldnt happen to any engine that was built to actually see redline. If 7,000(supposed testing was them revving it to 8000rpms which, if true, would throw the whole people over revving them out the window) is indeed too high then it shoulda been 6700 just to be safe. If 505hp was a tad too much then it should been 490 instead of just selling them to make a buck. I really want to believe that the LS7 design team made the most rock solid engine, but there are mulitple ones that have kicked the bucket therefor they didnt. As Kenny put it, a lot of people dont seem to believe it till it happens to them, not that I wish that on any of you.
06-27-2010, 05:08 PM
#35
Guest
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From an Interested UK owner......Can't understand why people are so Protective of the Marque [let me say I have owned three Vettes a 2004 C5 Z06 a Flappy Paddle C6 and a 2007 C6 Z06.....a Superb car in so many ways....... don't get me wrong..... and I still own it! So I am a 'Enthusiast and a Fan.... but I'm not Blinkered] ........My car was a one owner with 16k I had put about 1k on it whilst accelerating through the Gears past 4th .....it let go [speed around 95......Absolutely nothing the car should find difficult..... I had a Ferrari 355 a Porsche C4S ....Audi ...Subaru 22B... Ford Cosworth etc. and many other Performance cars and the very Last thing in the world I would think about is the Engine letting go ........Driving the car as a 'Perfomance' Vehicle. I repeat there should be NO issue of the Engine letting go in this way and far from protect the Marque we should be shouting at the Top of our Voices there is something WRONG! My car was repaired under warranty a Brand New Engine and all Ancillaries including the Dry Sump....Very Good you might say..... a Bl**dy Relief would have cost me just under 20 thousand of our UK Pounds!
The Dealership handled it all very 'Quitley' They did not want any Praise on the Forums as Corvettes are their Business and did not wan't more Bad Press I know from what they said they had done them before. [Makes me wonder how many have gone unreported .....The owners like me just so relieved to have her back running at No Cost under Warranty.....That should never have been required that's my point!]
GM should not get of Lightly and hide it away .....or be allowed to.....there is a Problem with a Performance Engine that 'Lets Go' [Mine was 'Stock' in every way was being driven as a Performance car.....Briskly.....Shock Horror......This is a Sports Car and should be well capable of Brisk Driving.....I can Understand an Engine from any Marque being Tuned aftermaket to with in an inch of it's life that is the risk that owner Took. GM have a problem ......or any Poll ....of any sort with or without Options would not be necessary......Have I been involved in a Poll with any other Marque? have I had my Engine Blow at all? ....Never mind in such Spectaular Fashion......The Fact there are 'any '......and obviously 'many' GM need to sort out that Engine.
Your Engine maybe OK [now] if It let's Go tomorrow I would love to see the Look on some of your Faces.....Don't be Smug and think it can't Happen to you ....it can and you would very Quickly change your Tune if your Vehicle was over three years old or 36k.....Looking back out the rear Hatch........Oh My Goodeness.....that's Going to be Mega Expensive!
I still own mine..... as I said still drive it Briskly ....it's never 'Redlined'
with only 2k on it's new engine..... I am comfortable with it now!
06-27-2010, 05:24 PM
#36
_"SCOTT"_
...more info please.I'm sorry that your car let go. I'm sure it's the worst feeling in the world but I am glad that you're back on the road with no out of pocket cost to you...
Hearing the more than occasional story of an LS7 letting go certainly doesn't make me feel all warm and fuzzy by any means, but tell me guys, what are we going to do about it?
1. Sell the car?...
2. Take it extra easy with our Z's?...
3. Extend the warranty and drive the **** out of it?...
4. Make an educated guess and fix the weak link?..(bye-bye warranty)
5. ???? "Feel free to add any more ideas" ????
06-27-2010, 05:38 PM
#37
Burning Brakes
I bought mine this week and have logged around 500 miles in 3 days and have been racing it and enjoying it to the fullest .
If i go out and beat on the car like i did last night (trashing mustangs and boosted srt4's) and it breaks , oh well , I will fix it and go back to having fun .
My z has 36k miles on it with no warrenty so i cant really chime in on broken stuff but they are race cars in sheeps clothing and they will break something ,some time ,some how .
To anyone that dropped a valve or a motor trashed out at low milage , i would be pissed also
If i go out and beat on the car like i did last night (trashing mustangs and boosted srt4's) and it breaks , oh well , I will fix it and go back to having fun .
My z has 36k miles on it with no warrenty so i cant really chime in on broken stuff but they are race cars in sheeps clothing and they will break something ,some time ,some how .
To anyone that dropped a valve or a motor trashed out at low milage , i would be pissed also
06-27-2010, 05:58 PM
#38
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Over here in the UK Scott this is a 'Rare Beast' and I'm Proud to own it...... with Ferrari 430 Performance and Road Prescence to match I love it!.......I was Lucky [you could say] The car is Immaculate and apart from this Minor Distraction.....I still have a Grin when I come back from a run out and find myself 'Stealing' an Admiring Glance as I leave it.....The engine has a Known weakness GM should have sorted this...... it's alright 'quietly' putting in New Engines......knowing it will be out of Warranty soon!
Extended warranties would'nt help or I'd take Option 3 on your List [Extended Warranties over here would preclude everything .........unless the Crank Snapped clean in half .....and then they would want it proved it was a 'Fault in Manufacturing' or it would be considered 'Fair Wear and Tear']
It is a weakness and a 'Fault'......... GM should have released a Fix......Even if it was available at Cost with a Favourable Fixed price fitment thru their Dealerships for out of Warranty cars and a re-call for under warranty cars.............Goodness knows what they have paid out in Warranty for this Problem ............in the States and Worldwide
Yes still drive it as a Sports Car.................Scott!
Extended warranties would'nt help or I'd take Option 3 on your List [Extended Warranties over here would preclude everything .........unless the Crank Snapped clean in half .....and then they would want it proved it was a 'Fault in Manufacturing' or it would be considered 'Fair Wear and Tear']
It is a weakness and a 'Fault'......... GM should have released a Fix......Even if it was available at Cost with a Favourable Fixed price fitment thru their Dealerships for out of Warranty cars and a re-call for under warranty cars.............Goodness knows what they have paid out in Warranty for this Problem ............in the States and Worldwide
Yes still drive it as a Sports Car.................Scott!
06-27-2010, 06:09 PM
#39
Drifting
Intention is not to start anything. Simply sharing my experience
In response to several inquiry are as follows:
First Motor:
1. First and foremost: IMO, engines just like most parts in my car are consumables. That said, I feel that I got LOT of used from both of my motor (really beat on in the track & even on street).
2. First failure was on the stock hollow sodium field exhaust valve. From Summer of '06 to fall of '08. ~40 track days (RR) & total of 17,xxx miles. First 14k miles, car only had KB CAI & tune. I then added the cam & headers after 14k miles & then lost the motor at 17,xxx miles.
3. It happened in the track going from 2nd to 3rd gear. Not a mis-shift at all. It tore up the stock pistons & hairline crack on block sleeve. Crank & conn rods were fine. (exhaust valve#2)
2nd motor (build objective was more durable rather than hp/tq. Dyno'd at 550 hp 500 tq. Forged bottom plus all the usual goodies in the heads like crowler rockers, etc...
1. 20k miles on the motor and 18 track days.
2. It happened with me going ~150+ mph & was waiting for close to redline before shifting but before I could shift to 5th, it blew.
3. This time was on stainless steel exhaust valve. Tore up the block, conn rod & piston (exhaust valve #2). Not sure if its a coincidence re: exhaust valve #2 braking.
To those who were suggesting driver error, yes. That is a possibility. But that did not happened to me. At any rate, I believe we just have to take extra precaution. As i mentioned before, I was already planning on tearing it down at 15k miles to check & refresh but delayed it cuz of lack of funds. There's no way around it guys. You play you pay! I enjoyed every mile! Was disappointed that I lost the motor sure. But just have to work, save $ for the next motor.
First Motor:
1. First and foremost: IMO, engines just like most parts in my car are consumables. That said, I feel that I got LOT of used from both of my motor (really beat on in the track & even on street).
2. First failure was on the stock hollow sodium field exhaust valve. From Summer of '06 to fall of '08. ~40 track days (RR) & total of 17,xxx miles. First 14k miles, car only had KB CAI & tune. I then added the cam & headers after 14k miles & then lost the motor at 17,xxx miles.
3. It happened in the track going from 2nd to 3rd gear. Not a mis-shift at all. It tore up the stock pistons & hairline crack on block sleeve. Crank & conn rods were fine. (exhaust valve#2)
2nd motor (build objective was more durable rather than hp/tq. Dyno'd at 550 hp 500 tq. Forged bottom plus all the usual goodies in the heads like crowler rockers, etc...
1. 20k miles on the motor and 18 track days.
2. It happened with me going ~150+ mph & was waiting for close to redline before shifting but before I could shift to 5th, it blew.
3. This time was on stainless steel exhaust valve. Tore up the block, conn rod & piston (exhaust valve #2). Not sure if its a coincidence re: exhaust valve #2 braking.
To those who were suggesting driver error, yes. That is a possibility. But that did not happened to me. At any rate, I believe we just have to take extra precaution. As i mentioned before, I was already planning on tearing it down at 15k miles to check & refresh but delayed it cuz of lack of funds. There's no way around it guys. You play you pay! I enjoyed every mile! Was disappointed that I lost the motor sure. But just have to work, save $ for the next motor.
06-27-2010, 06:23 PM
#40
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Hi redZ06bri .........[I'll start by saying the car was never 'Tracked' by me or the Previous owner who was a 'businessman'] so..........'Let Go'.....OK I went out for a half hours run round the Block just for the Pleasure of it......driving and accelerating 'Briskly' between the Gears I was on a straight bit of Road I had exited a roundabout about by 1/2 mile and was heading towards another Mini Roundabout coming up in say 1/2 mile as I changed into 4th and applied the throttle [perfectly Blended clutch and throttle ie: it was not a missed gear and soaring Rev's that some ts are trying to claim as a reason... I was applying Power when I heard a Massive and continuous ....... BHRRRRRRR! Looking out the rear Hatch it Looked like a World War 2 Spitfire that had been shot down a 'Con Trail' of Bluey White Smoke [or a Formula one car Blowing it's Engine at Full Chat!]
I heard two seperate 'ting's' Like a Guitar Struck behind the Frett Board and that was it I was now heading for the roundabout and had no choice but to negotiate it as I hardly dared Brake with all the Fluids on the rears as it Happens I still spun to face oncoming traffic but fortunately Harmlessly..........This was caused by a Fault in the cars Engine.
Nothing in a Pleasure Drive like that in a Sports Car of any Marque would Cause that.
I am 58 and have been Driving for 40 years from early Lotus Europas... Elans.... and Esprits thru to Ferrari and Porsche [and two other Vettes] I say this to Clarify this is not 'User Error' This is a Specific Fault on this LS7 Engine.
I heard two seperate 'ting's' Like a Guitar Struck behind the Frett Board and that was it I was now heading for the roundabout and had no choice but to negotiate it as I hardly dared Brake with all the Fluids on the rears as it Happens I still spun to face oncoming traffic but fortunately Harmlessly..........This was caused by a Fault in the cars Engine.
Nothing in a Pleasure Drive like that in a Sports Car of any Marque would Cause that.
I am 58 and have been Driving for 40 years from early Lotus Europas... Elans.... and Esprits thru to Ferrari and Porsche [and two other Vettes] I say this to Clarify this is not 'User Error' This is a Specific Fault on this LS7 Engine.