LINGENFELTER Z06TT - 1/4 mile = Crushing top end CHARGE!
08-25-2008, 06:41 PM
#1
Racer
Thread Starter
LINGENFELTER Z06TT - 1/4 mile = Crushing top end CHARGE!
I've been reading some great posts about twin turbo C6 Z06 results and wanted to share a timeslip from NORM's killer corvette and Lingenfelter's amazing twin turbo build.
This timeslip is from the initial test, prior to the car running 226mph in the standing mile. The car has a T56 6-speed and was running on LOW boost (approx. 6psi-9psi) for the first 3 gears. The ET was on track to hit a mid 11 second 1/4 mile when the boost controller ramped boost into 4th gear. The car took off and added 51 MPH from the 1/8 to the 1/4 with the drag radials screaming for mercy on an ice cold track!
This was the very first time out with an entirely new build so ET's were not really the focus. We wanted to test the car and tune the variable gear based boost controller prior to any serious efforts. This car makes massive power (1100rw on 93 octane) and was designed as a standing mile car. While the ET was slow thanks to a lazy launch (2.0 60 ft) and slick track, we were able to use some power on the big end of the track.
Anyway, I thought the results were pretty.... interesting..
A few details:
427 ci Twin Turbo
T56 6 speed manual
Crazy tall gears for 200++mph
NO water / methanol injection
Traction extremely limited
40 degree temps / gusting headwind (it was cold!)
More information is available here -> http://www.lingenfelter.com/Lingenfe...06ZO6TTBGB.htm
This timeslip is from the initial test, prior to the car running 226mph in the standing mile. The car has a T56 6-speed and was running on LOW boost (approx. 6psi-9psi) for the first 3 gears. The ET was on track to hit a mid 11 second 1/4 mile when the boost controller ramped boost into 4th gear. The car took off and added 51 MPH from the 1/8 to the 1/4 with the drag radials screaming for mercy on an ice cold track!
This was the very first time out with an entirely new build so ET's were not really the focus. We wanted to test the car and tune the variable gear based boost controller prior to any serious efforts. This car makes massive power (1100rw on 93 octane) and was designed as a standing mile car. While the ET was slow thanks to a lazy launch (2.0 60 ft) and slick track, we were able to use some power on the big end of the track.
Anyway, I thought the results were pretty.... interesting..
A few details:
427 ci Twin Turbo
T56 6 speed manual
Crazy tall gears for 200++mph
NO water / methanol injection
Traction extremely limited
40 degree temps / gusting headwind (it was cold!)
More information is available here -> http://www.lingenfelter.com/Lingenfe...06ZO6TTBGB.htm
08-25-2008, 07:27 PM
#2
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Good to see the 158 traps as I am extremely confident both of our TT C6Z's will see minimally high 150s in the coming weeks 
Turbo cars love the cool air which will of course hinder traction a bit but I expect the trap speeds to go through the roof
Thanks for the comparison info,
Jeff
Turbo cars love the cool air which will of course hinder traction a bit but I expect the trap speeds to go through the roof
Thanks for the comparison info,
Jeff
08-25-2008, 08:27 PM
#3
Former Vendor
Having built the transmission/diff in all three cars mentioned above they are very different builds. Props to LPE and IPS. If any of the three were to install a drag race wheel/tire combo (not drag radials) and a drag race suspension I'm sure there would be 8 sec. time slips.
08-25-2008, 11:50 PM
#4
Melting Slicks
That was a pretty decent pass on 6-9psi. I corrected my pass to your altitude and conditions based off the weather underground history site...
link to weather for day of your pass
Your pass had a DA of roughly 300 and my pass was at a DA of roughly 3120....
Corrected that would have made my pass a 9.30@157 so it appears we are making very similar power in the two cars. As for the 1100rwhp that is right about where we stopped on the dyno 1023 on mine and 1049 on Jason's car. Really we didn't see any reason to keep pushing the cars up past that on the dyno.
Congratulations on your pass last year, it definitely has a great MPH and gives me a new goal to beat. Previously I had not heard of anyone trapping nearly that high.
As with your pass, it was not my intention to go as fast as I did, it just worked out that way. This coming weekend, if I can find a track that will let me, I intend on turning the car up a bit and putting down an even better number.
I am very interested in the standing mile. I doubt seriously that my car would be in the same ball park as yours in that respect since we replaced the 6speed with an automatic.
I hope that you beat the Supra record and bring that home to the Corvettes.
If you ever want to meet up at a track somewhere I would love to see apples to apples comparison.
link to weather for day of your pass
Your pass had a DA of roughly 300 and my pass was at a DA of roughly 3120....
Corrected that would have made my pass a 9.30@157 so it appears we are making very similar power in the two cars. As for the 1100rwhp that is right about where we stopped on the dyno 1023 on mine and 1049 on Jason's car. Really we didn't see any reason to keep pushing the cars up past that on the dyno.
Congratulations on your pass last year, it definitely has a great MPH and gives me a new goal to beat. Previously I had not heard of anyone trapping nearly that high.
As with your pass, it was not my intention to go as fast as I did, it just worked out that way. This coming weekend, if I can find a track that will let me, I intend on turning the car up a bit and putting down an even better number.
I am very interested in the standing mile. I doubt seriously that my car would be in the same ball park as yours in that respect since we replaced the 6speed with an automatic.
I hope that you beat the Supra record and bring that home to the Corvettes.
If you ever want to meet up at a track somewhere I would love to see apples to apples comparison.
08-26-2008, 03:43 PM
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I had a minute over lunch so I was reading LPE's page and links and can't find a dyno graph for the 1100/1300rwhp anywhere 
Car&Driver shows the cars power at:
ENGINE TYPE: twin-turbocharged and intercooled pushrod 16-valve V-8, aluminum block and heads, port fuel injection
Displacement: 428 cu in, 7019cc
Power (C/D est): 1109 bhp @ 6350 rpm
Torque (C/D est): 932 lb-ft @ 6200 rpm
C&D explains how they got that # (Not wheel HP but 15% up on what the car actually dynoed -- approx 965rwhp in this case):
"Along the way we stopped at Wheel to Wheel Powertrain in Madison Heights, Michigan (w2wpowertrain.com; 866-903-4905). There we strapped each car to a brand of chassis dynamometer called the Mustang and measured the horsepower at the wheels. That “wheel horsepower” figure is typically 15 percent less than the output of the engine due to parasitic drivetrain losses. Since every new-vehicle brochure and our usual specifications list engine horsepower, not the at-the-wheels figure, we calculated the engine horsepower, assuming a 15-percent loss, and used that number for the specs here."
As for the claim of trapping 158mph on "6-9psi" and then ramping up here is the explanation from the article:
"So the Lingenfelter crew developed a system that limits the amount of engine horsepower available when the transmission is in the first three gears and the car is most likely to melt down the tires. The system relies on compressed nitrogen to control the turbo waste gates and limit the amount of turbo boost. In first gear, boost is limited to 6.0 psi; then it successively ramps up with each gear selection. By fourth gear, it’s making 15.5 psi."
As for the "40-degree / freezing" comments this is from the C&D article:
"We drove the Lingenfelter Corvette 185 miles from Ann Arbor to Oscoda to burn off the fuel the car arrived with to make sure it was running on pump gas. On that late-fall day, the 50-degree temperature was about 15 degrees cooler than on our initial test day four weeks earlier."
On the 50-degree day the car ran a 11.3 @ 147 with the boost ramping up from 6psi to 15.5psi by 4th gear.
"It was a terrific run. The Lingenfelter sizzled though the quarter in 11.3 seconds at 147 and by 200 mph had caught the Heffner GT, reaching that mark in 18.9 seconds. The Vette lost some time in the transition to the brakes and stopped the clock at 27.0 seconds, a half-second longer than the GT’s performance. That would have been good for second place, but the other cars might also have run quicker on the cooler day."
Now, this was just 10 minutes of reading the article LPE has on their website (From Car&Driver) so I am in no way saying the car didn't make 1300rwhp -- running 23psi it certainly should have, just that I didn't see the graph posted anywhere. I am not saying the car didn't trap 158mph either, just that it didn't do so on 6psi or 9psi per the C&D article. Since it trapped 147mph making approx 965rwhp and boost peaking at 15.5psi it obviously got quite a bit more power to add 11mph to that effort later -- larger turbos maybe?
Jeff
Car&Driver shows the cars power at:
ENGINE TYPE: twin-turbocharged and intercooled pushrod 16-valve V-8, aluminum block and heads, port fuel injection
Displacement: 428 cu in, 7019cc
Power (C/D est): 1109 bhp @ 6350 rpm
Torque (C/D est): 932 lb-ft @ 6200 rpm
C&D explains how they got that # (Not wheel HP but 15% up on what the car actually dynoed -- approx 965rwhp in this case):
"Along the way we stopped at Wheel to Wheel Powertrain in Madison Heights, Michigan (w2wpowertrain.com; 866-903-4905). There we strapped each car to a brand of chassis dynamometer called the Mustang and measured the horsepower at the wheels. That “wheel horsepower” figure is typically 15 percent less than the output of the engine due to parasitic drivetrain losses. Since every new-vehicle brochure and our usual specifications list engine horsepower, not the at-the-wheels figure, we calculated the engine horsepower, assuming a 15-percent loss, and used that number for the specs here."
As for the claim of trapping 158mph on "6-9psi" and then ramping up here is the explanation from the article:
"So the Lingenfelter crew developed a system that limits the amount of engine horsepower available when the transmission is in the first three gears and the car is most likely to melt down the tires. The system relies on compressed nitrogen to control the turbo waste gates and limit the amount of turbo boost. In first gear, boost is limited to 6.0 psi; then it successively ramps up with each gear selection. By fourth gear, it’s making 15.5 psi."
As for the "40-degree / freezing" comments this is from the C&D article:
"We drove the Lingenfelter Corvette 185 miles from Ann Arbor to Oscoda to burn off the fuel the car arrived with to make sure it was running on pump gas. On that late-fall day, the 50-degree temperature was about 15 degrees cooler than on our initial test day four weeks earlier."
On the 50-degree day the car ran a 11.3 @ 147 with the boost ramping up from 6psi to 15.5psi by 4th gear.
"It was a terrific run. The Lingenfelter sizzled though the quarter in 11.3 seconds at 147 and by 200 mph had caught the Heffner GT, reaching that mark in 18.9 seconds. The Vette lost some time in the transition to the brakes and stopped the clock at 27.0 seconds, a half-second longer than the GT’s performance. That would have been good for second place, but the other cars might also have run quicker on the cooler day."
Now, this was just 10 minutes of reading the article LPE has on their website (From Car&Driver) so I am in no way saying the car didn't make 1300rwhp -- running 23psi it certainly should have, just that I didn't see the graph posted anywhere. I am not saying the car didn't trap 158mph either, just that it didn't do so on 6psi or 9psi per the C&D article. Since it trapped 147mph making approx 965rwhp and boost peaking at 15.5psi it obviously got quite a bit more power to add 11mph to that effort later -- larger turbos maybe?
Jeff
Last edited by IPSjeff; 08-26-2008 at 04:54 PM.
08-26-2008, 05:25 PM
#6
Racer
Thread Starter
Hi Jeff,
Just to clarify - we're talking about 2 totally different events here on 2 totally separate dates. I had posted some early test data (4/2007) from a private 1/4 test in Memphis. You're referring to a later magazine test with Car and Driver. One was at a cold drag strip with drag radials and the other was at a dusty air force base with Michelin PS2s. The magazine guys had a lot of rules in place and the dyno test was right before the standing mile so the numbers were conservative, the conditions different and the setup was done with a very specific goal in mind.
To clear up a few things:
- I'm sharing the numbers for a good friend of mine and to represent the hard work from the guys at LPE.
- Noone asked me to do it, I just thought the guys should get some recognition for the car.
- Sharing dyno sheets is the perogative of the owner or the shop.
- The temperature at the drag strip was 41 degrees the morning before we ran the 1/4 (it warmed to 50's but the track stayed COLD)
- I mentioned that the car ran 6psi-9psi for the first 3 gears and ramped in 4th gear to hit 158mph. It was very low boost until 4th gear where it rolled in to 15+psi.
I'm not here to misrepresent anything or to take anything away from you, only to share some results that we're previously unmentioned (it was only a shakedown trip and all subsequent efforts were in the standing mile). I congratulate you guys for stepping up with some impressive cars but, in my opinion, the LPE build is on another level compared to the APS kit.
Best of luck with the cars and I hope we can meet up at the track sometime.
Just to clarify - we're talking about 2 totally different events here on 2 totally separate dates. I had posted some early test data (4/2007) from a private 1/4 test in Memphis. You're referring to a later magazine test with Car and Driver. One was at a cold drag strip with drag radials and the other was at a dusty air force base with Michelin PS2s. The magazine guys had a lot of rules in place and the dyno test was right before the standing mile so the numbers were conservative, the conditions different and the setup was done with a very specific goal in mind.
To clear up a few things:
- I'm sharing the numbers for a good friend of mine and to represent the hard work from the guys at LPE.
- Noone asked me to do it, I just thought the guys should get some recognition for the car.
- Sharing dyno sheets is the perogative of the owner or the shop.
- The temperature at the drag strip was 41 degrees the morning before we ran the 1/4 (it warmed to 50's but the track stayed COLD)
- I mentioned that the car ran 6psi-9psi for the first 3 gears and ramped in 4th gear to hit 158mph. It was very low boost until 4th gear where it rolled in to 15+psi.
I'm not here to misrepresent anything or to take anything away from you, only to share some results that we're previously unmentioned (it was only a shakedown trip and all subsequent efforts were in the standing mile). I congratulate you guys for stepping up with some impressive cars but, in my opinion, the LPE build is on another level compared to the APS kit.
Best of luck with the cars and I hope we can meet up at the track sometime.
08-26-2008, 06:33 PM
#7
Melting Slicks
As for meeting up at the track... name a time and place.
08-26-2008, 08:13 PM
#9
Melting Slicks
08-27-2008, 02:21 AM
#10
Racer
Thread Starter
I'll be looking forward to running some new numbers and will post up after our next outing with the LPE Z06TT. Regarding standing mile competition, are you considering doing the safety modifications necessary to run? One problem with cars at this level is the strict requirements to run in official events. NORM's car has a nice custom 6 point bar, 5 point harnesses and fire extinguisher but it's nowhere near legal to run in the 8's/9's or to compete in Maxton Mile/Texas Mile/Sandhills. It seems that private track or airstrip rentals are the only way to really test the cars which makes it tough (and expensive) to compete.
Best of luck and I'll be watching for updates on your beast.
08-27-2008, 09:22 AM
#11
Premium Supporting Vendor
Again, congrats on the awesome build and your numbers speak for themselves.
I'll be looking forward to running some new numbers and will post up after our next outing with the LPE Z06TT. Regarding standing mile competition, are you considering doing the safety modifications necessary to run? One problem with cars at this level is the strict requirements to run in official events. NORM's car has a nice custom 6 point bar, 5 point harnesses and fire extinguisher but it's nowhere near legal to run in the 8's/9's or to compete in Maxton Mile/Texas Mile/Sandhills. It seems that private track or airstrip rentals are the only way to really test the cars which makes it tough (and expensive) to compete.
Best of luck and I'll be watching for updates on your beast.
I'll be looking forward to running some new numbers and will post up after our next outing with the LPE Z06TT. Regarding standing mile competition, are you considering doing the safety modifications necessary to run? One problem with cars at this level is the strict requirements to run in official events. NORM's car has a nice custom 6 point bar, 5 point harnesses and fire extinguisher but it's nowhere near legal to run in the 8's/9's or to compete in Maxton Mile/Texas Mile/Sandhills. It seems that private track or airstrip rentals are the only way to really test the cars which makes it tough (and expensive) to compete.
Best of luck and I'll be watching for updates on your beast.
This APS guy sounds pretty confident, you should run him in the 6-speed NA car that is set up for the qtr mile.
Twin Turbos/ Auto vs. All Motor/ 6-speed, I bet it would be closer than most might think.
Sounds like he might be in for a standing mile challenge, my $$ are bet on the LPE car
J.P.
08-27-2008, 10:40 AM
#13
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Again, congrats on the awesome build and your numbers speak for themselves.
I'll be looking forward to running some new numbers and will post up after our next outing with the LPE Z06TT. Regarding standing mile competition, are you considering doing the safety modifications necessary to run? One problem with cars at this level is the strict requirements to run in official events. NORM's car has a nice custom 6 point bar, 5 point harnesses and fire extinguisher but it's nowhere near legal to run in the 8's/9's or to compete in Maxton Mile/Texas Mile/Sandhills. It seems that private track or airstrip rentals are the only way to really test the cars which makes it tough (and expensive) to compete.
Best of luck and I'll be watching for updates on your beast.
I'll be looking forward to running some new numbers and will post up after our next outing with the LPE Z06TT. Regarding standing mile competition, are you considering doing the safety modifications necessary to run? One problem with cars at this level is the strict requirements to run in official events. NORM's car has a nice custom 6 point bar, 5 point harnesses and fire extinguisher but it's nowhere near legal to run in the 8's/9's or to compete in Maxton Mile/Texas Mile/Sandhills. It seems that private track or airstrip rentals are the only way to really test the cars which makes it tough (and expensive) to compete.
Best of luck and I'll be watching for updates on your beast.
It's going to suck having a 10 point cage in the car, however we are going to have Katech do the cage and they said they will do their best to make the cages less intrusive then your typical 10 point cage.
08-27-2008, 10:43 AM
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Hell probably invite a few of the up and coming builds in addition to a few of the ones that have already been built and have a competition to see who truely has the fastest C6 in the country!
08-27-2008, 10:45 AM
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08-27-2008, 10:49 AM
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I'll be looking forward to running some new numbers and will post up after our next outing with the LPE Z06TT. Regarding standing mile competition, are you considering doing the safety modifications necessary to run? One problem with cars at this level is the strict requirements to run in official events. NORM's car has a nice custom 6 point bar, 5 point harnesses and fire extinguisher but it's nowhere near legal to run in the 8's/9's or to compete in Maxton Mile/Texas Mile/Sandhills.
Are we still talking about the Yellow C6 on LPE's site or two different cars or what? Maybe I am not reading things correctly but I am a bit confused...
Jeff
08-27-2008, 12:19 PM
#17
Racer
Thread Starter
Jeff,
Fair enough. LPE built the car, Norm owns the car and I'm a good friend of Norm's that has been lucky enough to drive in several of the events we've attended over the years. So, it is likely that "I'll be..." at our "Our next..." event with Norm and "Norm's car...".
Regardless, we're all talking about the yellow Twin Turbo LPE C6Z06. My old friend John was referring to an LPE naturally aspirated viper and he's right, that car might surprise you.
Scott
Fair enough. LPE built the car, Norm owns the car and I'm a good friend of Norm's that has been lucky enough to drive in several of the events we've attended over the years. So, it is likely that "I'll be..." at our "Our next..." event with Norm and "Norm's car...".
Regardless, we're all talking about the yellow Twin Turbo LPE C6Z06. My old friend John was referring to an LPE naturally aspirated viper and he's right, that car might surprise you.
Scott
Last edited by BIG GUN; 08-27-2008 at 12:59 PM.
08-27-2008, 12:42 PM
#18
Racer
Thread Starter
I don't have a dyno sheet but I do know that past a certain power level the LPE guys had difficulty getting clean pulls. IMO, the true power of this build will show on the track, not on the dyno.
08-27-2008, 02:08 PM
#20
Melting Slicks
I really enjoy when people try to race my car with their "friends" car. I also find it amusing how everyone has a 7 second car at home in the garage.
The way I look at it is like this. If you ever want to challenge me or my car, it better be with your own car, otherwise I'll just call up John Force or some other pro racer and see how much it will cost to have him come out and race whatever you want to bring for the day.
Lets get real, The LPE car is an awesome car there is no doubt about it, my car is an awesome car and there is no doubt about that. For the Mile, the LPE car was definately engineered better for that, for the 1/4 mile, my car was engineered better.
The whole reason this thread exists is because I went out and ran the fastest "PROVEN" and "VERIFIED" ET and MPH in any C6Z06 Bar NONE!
I believe there will be many people that have spent tons of money on cars at other shops who would have thier feelings hurt if they pulled up beside me at a drag strip. I'm not saying they didn't get what they paid for, because there is definately value in some of the names that go on cars.
I personally considered doing a LPE build as well as some other companies, and $ for $ felt like I would get more for my money with IPS. I also knew I would get more personal attention since they were in the same town as me.
LPE does and has build great cars, but lets be real, someone is always faster. There are at least 2 builds going on now that I know of that will be at least as fast if not faster than what I have. Norm's car has it's place on the Mile strip, leave the 1/4 mile to those of us who were built for it.