Watched the top gear episode and couldn't help but laugh. WHile most exotics that have engine covers that allow the engine to be visible GM decides to show a plastic cover. Not sure which one of the three said it but he said the ZR1 cover displays a piece of plastic made by 2 Fat guys in Kentucky. I couldn't help but cry laughing.
Watched the top gear episode and couldn't help but laugh. WHile most exotics that have engine covers that allow the engine to be visible GM decides to show a plastic cover. Not sure which one of the three said it but he said the ZR1 cover displays a piece of plastic made by 2 Fat guys in Kentucky. I couldn't help but cry laughing.
GM you should be ashamed of yourselves.
Yeah, I'd be so embarrassed. To make a car that cost less than half+ of any Euro exotic and: 1.) spanks them in every performance area 2.) is far more reliable 3.) has parts that last more than 15,000 miles (ie. - Ferrari) 4.) and is comfortable to drive.
If anyone should be ashamed, it's Ferrari. Even Lambo is starting to make reliable cars (Gallardo)(Give, it's due to Audi). I'm done drinking the Ferrari cool-aid. Their cars just don't look that good anymore.... At least not good enough to put up with all the BS + Cost of ownership. Now years ago, Ferrari's looked sooooo good you didn't care about spending 10 g's on a clutch after 15,000 miles. Not anymore.... They're no longer supermodels IMHO.
Last edited by Onerareviper; 11-17-2008 at 08:38 PM.
Yeah, I'd be so embarrassed. To make a car that cost less than half+ of any Euro exotic and: 1.) spanks them in every performance area 2.) is far more reliable 3.) has parts that last more than 15,000 miles (ie. - Ferrari) 4.) and is comfortable to drive.
If anyone should be ashamed, it's Ferrari. Even Lambo is starting to make reliable cars (Gallardo)(Give, it's due to Audi). I'm done drinking the Ferrari cool-aid. Their cars just don't look that good anymore.... At least not good enough to put up with all the BS + Cost of ownership. Now years ago, Ferrari's look sooooo good you didn't car about spending 10 g's on a clutch after 15,000 miles. Not anymore.... They're no longer supermodels IMHO.
Yeah, but there aren't 8,000 mass produced ferraris sitting on dealer lots either. To many of us, the plastic cover on the ZR1 detracts from the looks of what is a superb automobile.
I agree. No pee-a-boo hood. Jazz up the engine with some polished aluminum. Get rid of the coil covers (that some uninformed folks call "valve covers") Put the coil packs in a different location, and display the engine for what it is....... a great piece of engineering, not a hugh chunk if plastic.
Yeah, but there aren't 8,000 mass produced ferraris sitting on dealer lots either. To many of us, the plastic cover on the ZR1 detracts from the looks of what is a superb automobile.
Have you actually seen a real car in person? That plastic see through looks good, pal.
Watched the top gear episode and couldn't help but laugh. WHile most exotics that have engine covers that allow the engine to be visible GM decides to show a plastic cover. Not sure which one of the three said it but he said the ZR1 cover displays a piece of plastic made by 2 Fat guys in Kentucky. I couldn't help but cry laughing.
GM you should be ashamed of yourselves.
Top Gear should be the ones who are ashamed of themselves for not knowing that what they think is a plastic cover is actually a metal intercooler.
__________________
_Jason Harding
Director of Aftermarket Operations, Katech Performance
That was a good episode of Top Gear. Nice cinematography and editing.
I could deal with the clear hood portal if they gave us something more interesting to look at. Here is what my previous supercharged LS6 looked like, imagine seeing something similar under that hood window.
Tony
__________________ Co-Founder, LS1TECH.com & PlanetLSX.com
1969 Camaro SS Convertible | 1970 Chevelle SS 454 | 2006 Viper Coupe | 2009 Corvette Z06 | 2009 Cadillac CTS-V | 2010 Camaro SS | 2011 Camaro SS Convertible
Online Garage: www.fquick.com/NineBall
every car built seams to always have at least one brain fart and the zr1's brain fart is the plastic cover on the hood. the car is awesome besides the engine sunroof. and yes i have seen it in person and the lid sucks....
Jeremy Clarckson loved the ZR1. He might not have put in those words, but he thought it was amazing. The quote about the plastic roof (if it looks ridiculous or not, I'll leave that up to you) and the fat blokes in Kentucky is just their kind of insulting humor. At the end of the Epi Jeremy shouted "Well done fat bloke of Kentucky". He even stated he loved the gearbox and wondered why Ferrari didn't do it properly like Chevy has done. That is saying a lot coming from somebody like Clarckson...
Anyway, if you look carefully at the Top Gear tests of the C6, Z06 and now the ZR1, you just see he likes the new Corvettes, he just doesn't want to admit it :-)
Ah ... It's a great show, and it was a great episode ... Beautifully shot!
A ZR1 is a fast "hot rod", not a piece of art.
The see through hood does nothing for it and as evidenced by debate may actually detract from its overall appearance.
I own both a Ferrari and a C6Z. There is no comparision. A Ferrari 430 is not as fast as a ZR1 but its torque and power curves are perfect for the street and its workmanship unmatched. After owninig late model Ferrari's, I can tell you they are reliable and cost about $2,000 a year to service.
Take a look at Europeans and then Americans. You will quickly see how we "earned" the "fat" title. Best
Your right, there is no comparison... I do agree that a Ferrari is rolling art.
As appeared in:
Sports Car Market—December 2006 issue
Sheehan Speaks
by Michael Sheehan
Answering daily phone calls and emails provides a never–ending supply of topics on which to pontificate. The “real–world” cost to drive a late model Ferrari is one of the more frequent questions I’m asked.
I recently sold an unusually well–documented 1998 550 Maranello, S/N 111317, with 36,200 miles to a client in the jet aircraft industry, and comparisons between Ferrari and jet costs inspired this column. Like a private jet that requires three to four hours of maintenance for every hour of flight time, Ferraris are not cheap to own.
FIRST TWO YEARS ALMOST FREE
550 Ferrari S/N 111317 was sold new on March 19, 1998, at $225,000, to a wealthy Santa Monica real estate investor and used for weekend retreats to his ranch in Ojai, a 150–plus–mile round trip. Thanks to an unlimited mileage warranty, the first two years were relatively expense free.
The first bite came in August 2000, five months after the warranty expired. At 13,637 miles, the owner brought the car in for a 15,000–mile service, two rear tires, and an oil, filter, and coolant change for $2,665.70. Two months later, in October, at 17,220 miles, noisy cam belts and bearings were replaced at no cost (thanks to a warranty extension by Ferrari). The windshield washer reservoir was also replaced for $529.25. A month later, in November, at 17,618 miles, the front spoiler and three wheels were refinished because of road–rash, at $1,285. Total for the first year out of warranty, and about 4,000 miles: $4,479.95, or $1.12 per mile.
As 2001 rolled around, in January, at 18,124 miles, two ball joints and sway bar bushings were replaced at $253.47, a standard procedure for a heavy, high performance, front–engined car with power steering. Three months later, in April, at 18,998 miles, a coolant leak, new front tires, another repaint of the wheels, and a detail added $2,718 to the ongoing maintenance bill.
A few days later, at 19,002 miles, the check engine light came on and an O2 sensor was replaced at $261.31. A month later, in late May, at 19,329 miles, the dash pod had to come out for an instrument panel repair, at $1,290.18. Five months and 1,289 miles later, in early October, at 20,618 miles, an annual oil and filter service and new rear tires added $2,386.60 to the expense column.
$8,988 FOR SECOND YEAR OUT OF WARRANTY
In December 2001, a service at 21,358 miles for dash lights, rattles, and a radiator R & R for coolant leaks closed the year out at $2,078.82. Total for the second year out of warranty, and another 3,740 miles: $8,988.38, or $2.40 a mile.
In January 2002, at 21,966 miles, the owner had the battery replaced, new suspension bushings installed, and a wheel alignment for $1,228.35. In March, at 22,956 miles, the license plate frame was replaced for $124.99, and in May, at 23,802 miles, the power steering pump was replaced and the fluids serviced, at $500.95.
Cheaper than a jet, but more than a Jetta
Four months and 2,657 miles later, in September, at 25,607 miles, the steering box, power steering rack, and rear shocks were replaced, and the wheels were aligned for $8,641.69. The year ended at 26,236 miles, with a compression and leakdown problem discovered in late December at the 30,000–mile service. New cam belts, engine mounts, and a valve job followed, with all 24 valves and valve guides replaced at $7,954.66. Fortunately for the owner, Ferrari supplied the valves and guides under an extended warranty. Another year, another 4,878 miles, adding up to $18,450.64, or $3.78 a mile.
TOYOTA MONEY: 37 CENTS PER MILE
The Ferrari gods were smiling in 2003, with only 672 miles added and one service for hood shocks, in March, at 26,908 miles. Cost of ownership was only $249.38. Little use means no visits to ever–vigilant Ferrari mechanics, who point out problems that need to be resolved. This year cost Toyota money—just 37 cents per mile. Of course, there weren’t many miles driven either.
In 2004, 550 S/N 111317 saw little use, but frequent visits to the service center, beginning in January, at 31,688 miles, for a seat control switch and wiper blades at $1,366.43
A week later, in early February, at 31,860 miles, sway bar bushings were replaced at $208.63. In late February, at 32,035 miles, the handbrake shoes and rear brake rotors were replaced and four new tires were fitted, at $3,365.79. In early March, at 32,122 miles, a coolant leak added $903.21 to the annual cost. Another year, another 5,214 miles, another $5,844.06. The cost per mile, $1.12.
In late December 2004, Ferrari 550 S/N 111317 moved on to her second owner, for $90,000, and no service bills were added to the year. A real estate investor and self–confessed “Porsche guy,” the second owner had always wanted a Ferrari and bought the 550 simply because he knew the car through the original owner.
Only weeks into Ferrari ownership, in January 2005, at 32,945 miles, a 30,000–mile service was again done, under the “while–your’re–at–it” theory, because of oil leaks. The front shocks were also replaced, at $6,196.57. Only weeks later, the second owner also had the nose repainted, and his 550 “personalized” with the front fenders modified for fender shields and the calipers redone in yellow, at $7,759.70.
NOT FOR THE TIMID: $10.27 PER MILE
A month later, in March, the steering wheel was recovered for $450, and in April the windows were tinted and a “clear bra” installed for $935. Only weeks, later the owner continued to personalize his 550 with a Tubi Exhaust for $3,155.94. In August, at 34,235 miles, the oil hoses and other minor items were replaced, at $3,194.44. Total mileage for the second owner: 2,113 miles and $21,691.65. Most of this work was pure pride–of–ownership personalization, but the financially timid need not apply, as the cost per mile, at $10.27 per mile, was approaching that of an M1 tank.
As 2006 rolled in, our second owner next had a new clutch installed, in January, at 35,625 miles, for $4,852.59. After sitting for six months, the second owner decided that he really was a “Porsche guy” at heart. The 550 was too big for his tastes and so, in August, 550 Ferrari S/N 111317 was picked up from his home and dropped off for an a/c service, at 36,196 miles, for $519.40. Cost of ownership for the second owner, for 2006: 1,961 miles at $5,371.99, or $2.73 per mile.
In August 2006, our subject 550 was again sold for $90,000, with 36,196 miles, to the third owner, the president of a corporate jet maintenance and sales company. During the pre–purchase, an oil leak was found, and while the estimate was $3,000, the final bill was $1,582.58. The third owner appreciated the subtle lines and wanted a user–friendly Ferrari that could be driven daily in New York weather and traffic.
A long–time Ferrari owner, he appreciated that virtually all of the depreciation was reflected in the purchase price and that at 36,000 miles, adding mileage wouldn’t kill the value. His last toy was a new Porsche Turbo at $160,000, and while it had been nice to order a car exactly as he wanted, the depreciation wasn’t worth the thrill when he sold it after three years for $95,000.
The warranty on 550 S/N 111317 ran out in March, 2000, at about 13,500 miles. Our subject 550 went to the third owner in September 2006 at 36,200 miles, so the total miles out of warranty was 22,700 miles, with a total spent of $65,760.50, or $2.90 a mile, right at $11,000 a year.
Ferrari ownership is both a lifestyle and a socio–economic statement, just as owning a polo pony is a different venture than keeping a draught horse. As one former owner of S/N 111317 put it, “I spend more than that on crap on eBay every year.” No other statement quite sums up the difference between those who lust for a Ferrari from those who can pay the price of ownership.
MICHAEL SHEEHAN has been a Ferrari dealer for 30 years as well as a race car driver and exotic car broker.
Your right, there is no comparison... I do agree that a Ferrari is rolling art.
As appeared in:
Sports Car Market—December 2006 issue
Sheehan Speaks
by Michael Sheehan
Answering daily phone calls and emails provides a never–ending supply of topics on which to pontificate. The “real–world” cost to drive a late model Ferrari is one of the more frequent questions I’m asked.
I recently sold an unusually well–documented 1998 550 Maranello, S/N 111317, with 36,200 miles to a client in the jet aircraft industry, and comparisons between Ferrari and jet costs inspired this column. Like a private jet that requires three to four hours of maintenance for every hour of flight time, Ferraris are not cheap to own.
FIRST TWO YEARS ALMOST FREE
550 Ferrari S/N 111317 was sold new on March 19, 1998, at $225,000, to a wealthy Santa Monica real estate investor and used for weekend retreats to his ranch in Ojai, a 150–plus–mile round trip. Thanks to an unlimited mileage warranty, the first two years were relatively expense free.
The first bite came in August 2000, five months after the warranty expired. At 13,637 miles, the owner brought the car in for a 15,000–mile service, two rear tires, and an oil, filter, and coolant change for $2,665.70. Two months later, in October, at 17,220 miles, noisy cam belts and bearings were replaced at no cost (thanks to a warranty extension by Ferrari). The windshield washer reservoir was also replaced for $529.25. A month later, in November, at 17,618 miles, the front spoiler and three wheels were refinished because of road–rash, at $1,285. Total for the first year out of warranty, and about 4,000 miles: $4,479.95, or $1.12 per mile.
As 2001 rolled around, in January, at 18,124 miles, two ball joints and sway bar bushings were replaced at $253.47, a standard procedure for a heavy, high performance, front–engined car with power steering. Three months later, in April, at 18,998 miles, a coolant leak, new front tires, another repaint of the wheels, and a detail added $2,718 to the ongoing maintenance bill.
A few days later, at 19,002 miles, the check engine light came on and an O2 sensor was replaced at $261.31. A month later, in late May, at 19,329 miles, the dash pod had to come out for an instrument panel repair, at $1,290.18. Five months and 1,289 miles later, in early October, at 20,618 miles, an annual oil and filter service and new rear tires added $2,386.60 to the expense column.
$8,988 FOR SECOND YEAR OUT OF WARRANTY
In December 2001, a service at 21,358 miles for dash lights, rattles, and a radiator R & R for coolant leaks closed the year out at $2,078.82. Total for the second year out of warranty, and another 3,740 miles: $8,988.38, or $2.40 a mile.
In January 2002, at 21,966 miles, the owner had the battery replaced, new suspension bushings installed, and a wheel alignment for $1,228.35. In March, at 22,956 miles, the license plate frame was replaced for $124.99, and in May, at 23,802 miles, the power steering pump was replaced and the fluids serviced, at $500.95.
Cheaper than a jet, but more than a Jetta
Four months and 2,657 miles later, in September, at 25,607 miles, the steering box, power steering rack, and rear shocks were replaced, and the wheels were aligned for $8,641.69. The year ended at 26,236 miles, with a compression and leakdown problem discovered in late December at the 30,000–mile service. New cam belts, engine mounts, and a valve job followed, with all 24 valves and valve guides replaced at $7,954.66. Fortunately for the owner, Ferrari supplied the valves and guides under an extended warranty. Another year, another 4,878 miles, adding up to $18,450.64, or $3.78 a mile.
TOYOTA MONEY: 37 CENTS PER MILE
The Ferrari gods were smiling in 2003, with only 672 miles added and one service for hood shocks, in March, at 26,908 miles. Cost of ownership was only $249.38. Little use means no visits to ever–vigilant Ferrari mechanics, who point out problems that need to be resolved. This year cost Toyota money—just 37 cents per mile. Of course, there weren’t many miles driven either.
In 2004, 550 S/N 111317 saw little use, but frequent visits to the service center, beginning in January, at 31,688 miles, for a seat control switch and wiper blades at $1,366.43
A week later, in early February, at 31,860 miles, sway bar bushings were replaced at $208.63. In late February, at 32,035 miles, the handbrake shoes and rear brake rotors were replaced and four new tires were fitted, at $3,365.79. In early March, at 32,122 miles, a coolant leak added $903.21 to the annual cost. Another year, another 5,214 miles, another $5,844.06. The cost per mile, $1.12.
In late December 2004, Ferrari 550 S/N 111317 moved on to her second owner, for $90,000, and no service bills were added to the year. A real estate investor and self–confessed “Porsche guy,” the second owner had always wanted a Ferrari and bought the 550 simply because he knew the car through the original owner.
Only weeks into Ferrari ownership, in January 2005, at 32,945 miles, a 30,000–mile service was again done, under the “while–your’re–at–it” theory, because of oil leaks. The front shocks were also replaced, at $6,196.57. Only weeks later, the second owner also had the nose repainted, and his 550 “personalized” with the front fenders modified for fender shields and the calipers redone in yellow, at $7,759.70.
NOT FOR THE TIMID: $10.27 PER MILE
A month later, in March, the steering wheel was recovered for $450, and in April the windows were tinted and a “clear bra” installed for $935. Only weeks, later the owner continued to personalize his 550 with a Tubi Exhaust for $3,155.94. In August, at 34,235 miles, the oil hoses and other minor items were replaced, at $3,194.44. Total mileage for the second owner: 2,113 miles and $21,691.65. Most of this work was pure pride–of–ownership personalization, but the financially timid need not apply, as the cost per mile, at $10.27 per mile, was approaching that of an M1 tank.
As 2006 rolled in, our second owner next had a new clutch installed, in January, at 35,625 miles, for $4,852.59. After sitting for six months, the second owner decided that he really was a “Porsche guy” at heart. The 550 was too big for his tastes and so, in August, 550 Ferrari S/N 111317 was picked up from his home and dropped off for an a/c service, at 36,196 miles, for $519.40. Cost of ownership for the second owner, for 2006: 1,961 miles at $5,371.99, or $2.73 per mile.
In August 2006, our subject 550 was again sold for $90,000, with 36,196 miles, to the third owner, the president of a corporate jet maintenance and sales company. During the pre–purchase, an oil leak was found, and while the estimate was $3,000, the final bill was $1,582.58. The third owner appreciated the subtle lines and wanted a user–friendly Ferrari that could be driven daily in New York weather and traffic.
A long–time Ferrari owner, he appreciated that virtually all of the depreciation was reflected in the purchase price and that at 36,000 miles, adding mileage wouldn’t kill the value. His last toy was a new Porsche Turbo at $160,000, and while it had been nice to order a car exactly as he wanted, the depreciation wasn’t worth the thrill when he sold it after three years for $95,000.
The warranty on 550 S/N 111317 ran out in March, 2000, at about 13,500 miles. Our subject 550 went to the third owner in September 2006 at 36,200 miles, so the total miles out of warranty was 22,700 miles, with a total spent of $65,760.50, or $2.90 a mile, right at $11,000 a year.
Ferrari ownership is both a lifestyle and a socio–economic statement, just as owning a polo pony is a different venture than keeping a draught horse. As one former owner of S/N 111317 put it, “I spend more than that on crap on eBay every year.” No other statement quite sums up the difference between those who lust for a Ferrari from those who can pay the price of ownership.
MICHAEL SHEEHAN has been a Ferrari dealer for 30 years as well as a race car driver and exotic car broker.
I own a number of cars and agree that for those who have the money it really does not matter what it costs, whatever "it" is.
My personal experience with the last two Ferrari's I have owned.
I sold a 1999 360 in December 2006 for $110,000. It was in perfect condition with under 10,000 miles. It was warrantied for 3 years and during that time I spent around $5,000 maintaining it.
I bought a new F 430 at the same time. It has a 4 year warranty. I have had it serviced costing around $1,700 to date.
My 2006 C6Z is warrantied. I have only spent around $200 to date. It has had a roof that came off, rear end failure, and some electrical problems. To each his own.
Cost only matters when you have to look in your wallet. Best
As much as it might sound like I'm hating on the Z I'm not. I'm sure GM has heard the echoes of all the corvette faithful crying about the cheap looking window. I just think at 100+k they could have added ANYTHING nicer to look at. Why not just make the window carbon fibre? I would much rather look at CF shining in the sunlight. How about polishing or chroming something.. It just looks like the color of concrete and imo should reflect the Z capabilities. The window does it no justice at all.
I own a number of cars and agree that for those who have the money it really does not matter what it costs, whatever "it" is.
My personal experience with the last two Ferrari's I have owned.
I sold a 1999 360 in December 2006 for $110,000. It was in perfect condition with under 10,000 miles. It was warrantied for 3 years and during that time I spent around $5,000 maintaining it.
I bought a new F 430 at the same time. It has a 4 year warranty. I have had it serviced costing around $1,700 to date.
My 2006 C6Z is warrantied. I have only spent around $200 to date. It has had a roof that came off, rear end failure, and some electrical problems. To each his own.
Cost only matters when you have to look in your wallet. Best
But why? If these cars are the second coming personified, why ever trade in ANY Ferrari? And for that matter if you have the money, why do you only put 10,000 miles on a Ferrari or any other person for that matter before they're itching to sell it? Not that you're the type but I've never understood why people who claim to be wealthy buy Ferraris and then baby the crap out of the car to the point that it's sickening.
They're meant to be driven, regardless of the mileage racked up on it, it's still a Ferrari. If the car is such a work of art and made of the highest quality, then why can't it rack up major miles without owners biting their nails over doing so?
I've noticed over at FerrariChat where owners of "higher end" Ferraris bash on Ferrari 308 owners because their Ferraris are the kind that are "useless". But at least those 308 owners are driving the cars. And I love the old Ferraris because you can actually work on those in your own garage.
I'm sorry, I love Ferrari as much as the next car guy but I'd like it more if so many people weren't kissing the car brand's ass so much along with the appeal to snobbery attitude people have for the car. And yes I'm a Corvette fanatic but I wouldn't want people acting that way towards a Corvette either.
Onerareviper: your post hit the nail right on the head, sir.
Last edited by 1985 Corvette; 11-17-2008 at 04:26 PM.
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