freddyvette

Stock heads make more power with a cam than he's seeing here, so while they might not make 600whp, should definitely be making more.

Indepth

I didn't quote the OP. I was quoting someone else who has AHP heads. I agree that the OP's car is making way less power than it should be. I'm with Unreal - likely something mechanical as even AHP's lackluster heads are able to produce more power than that.

American Heritage

Some are just to much...
Stock throats? Stock Bowls? Stock Boss's? Really???



Lots of 525-615rwhp z06's out there running our heads.

Maybe start by doing actual diagnostics like a compression test, ect.... Just saying....

https://www.americanheritageperformance.com/

Indepth

Yes. Really. I have video from the porter to prove this, measurements were taken and dyno before/afters were done. It's ok, I'm sure my posts will be deleted by the mods in a few anyways; we all know how heavily censored these forums are in favor of our beloved vendors.

Oh, I'll add this to the mix too (and I'm sure AHP will bawk at this as well) the guides were out of spec in 10K miles too. Guides on LS7 heads need inspected every 10K minimum and replaced as needed.

Look for a few posts on Instagram for the videos, I'll tag you guys.

freddyvette

Sorry, but 550 with a stock intake is just about where you should be. Didn't think I'd look, did you? LOL

I picked up 35 whp with an MSD and about 15 more with a proper lifter and pushrod setup

Indepth

You do realize that people mod their car further without posting to forums that are not nearly as heavily trafficked as they once were, right?

I put down 565 on a dynojet with a Ported FAST102, Stock TB, and Halltech MF103 w/beehive later on the following year. That's pitiful for the additional mods added, and no, it wasn't the tuner.

Between this thread and the "Z06 replacement" thread you're really making yourself look like a real genius on these forums these days, aren't you?

Oh, and you're still side stepping the fact that you can't even read who I actually quoted in this thread. Hint: Not the OP.

freddyvette

Funny you're automatically dismissing your tuner as the issue. I swapped my MSD intake while it was sitting on the Dyno to see those instant gains. WOT is fuel, fuel timing, air, and spark timing. More of each = more power. You seem to be learning HP Tuners so you should know this better than I do!

I don't care what you've done to your car since you made 550. You're claiming that your AHP heads were the reason you weren't making power. That simply isn't the case. 550 is amazing for stock intake system. Especially on a Mustang dyno.

Where are your logs showing vacuum at manifold during WOT? I'd like to see them before I agree to dismiss the tuner as being the problem instead of there being an air restriction.

The real genius here is making bone headed assumptions about the quality of your tuner and blaming the heads when it sounds like it was installation issues or poor research. C'mon Mr. genius Engineer.

Why does it matter who you're quoting? The discussion I'm having with you is that you're blaming the head work when you have little to no information proving this is the problem.

And please don't think I'm motivated to defend AHP at all. I don't have their heads, and I don't recommend them to my friends. I'm just waging a campaign against misinformation which you seem to like spreading.

I'm sure Mr. Simcoe was able to hog out your heads even more to the point where your rocker bolts shun through the intake ports. Big whoop. Doesn't mean the OP has a problem with his heads.

What about the Z06 replacement thread? Shitty German car gets stomped on in the road course and drag strip. Sure, add huge wings to any car and you can say you're faster than a factory production vehicle from 12 years ago. Feel free to reply to this on that thread, and stop derailing.

Indepth

Boy, you sure do have a lot of time on your hands to do nothing but sift through users posts months and years back and cherry pick information don't you?

Lets take this step by step since you seem to like to extrapolate information and acting upon conjecture.

I'm automatically dismissing the tuner because of the fact that we've both reviewed the logs and spent extensive amounts of time on the car's tune both on the dyno and on the street. This isn't simple case of "my tuner shoved me out the door and said it's fine" or "tuner is saying its 'x' part". I'm glad you understand the basics of WOT tuning, truly a feat to behold. Clearly, if you understood this then you'd understand that an increase in airflow in the front of the intake tract will do nothing if the airflow is restricted later on down the tract.

If you don't care what's been done to the car then why are we having this discussion? The whole reason I know the heads were garbage (beyond inspecting them and measuring their supposed work) is the fact that after additional modifications using the same dyno and same tuner we gained little to no power.

My logs showed vacuum at the manifold during WOT dropped to 92kPa at higher RPMs, clearly indicating a restriction somewhere in the intake tract. Additional logging after the manifold and throttle body swap from the ported FAST102 and stock TB to a MAMO MSD and NW102 (still with AHP heads) showed 96kPa at WOT with ambient at 99-100. Now, after properly working the heads with the MAMO MSD and NW102 TB I'm at 100-103kPa. Not that I need your approval to rule things out.

The real thing here is you flying off the handle knowing nothing about what I have or have not done to pinpoint the issue. Did an engineer verbally undress you in front of your boss one time or something? Move along...


It matters because you began this entire ordeal trying to go after the fact that I was referencing the OP with my comment on the AHP heads not performing when that's not the case. Be careful to make assumptions that I have 'little to no information proving this is the problem' when you haven't asked. Fact is I do, I have countless logs and many hours on the street and dyno tweaking things.


I could care less who you are or are not for in this joke of a LS7 head landscape we live in. You spout off like a moron on these threads incessantly and have little to say of value.


And here we strike out yet again, unfortunately Gavin didn't touch my heads. However, he did view the pictures of my heads prior to being re-worked and saw their **** poor work product. Your assumptions shine through once again, but please do go on telling me what I did or didn't do. Again, your confusion shows here, my comment on the heads was directed to someone that replied in this thread NOT the OP. If you read carefully, I state that I agree with others in this thread saying there's likely a mechanical issue here as those numbers are way low.

My point on that topic is simple, you make yourself look like an arrogant fool in that thread. Someone that is clearly out for nothing more than an online spat where no one else in that thread really cared. But, go on, even here, it is entertaining.

freddyvette

Replies in RED

Indepth

Claims I provide no data supporting my claims.

Provides data illustrating exactly what I said - restriction. (FYI, mister 'engineer' 6.8kPa = 1psi - which on an NA 427ci is fair amount of power lost.)

Then moves on to claiming I can't say it was the heads (even though there was a blatant kPa increase with no other changes).

I love the internet.

bobandc

As the OP of this thread I'm really looking for solutions to my problem. I'd politely ask that you take the arguments and bashing elsewhere. If the HP/Torque that my dyno's show is what you expect from the parts I chose please say so without the negative commentary. I hesitated to post my problem here for the very path this thread has taken however the car has sat for over a week and I want to drive it

I went the path that I did not to maximize dyno numbers but to find a good mix between drivability, performance, customer service, cost and reliability. Unfortunately I missed the mark on one or two of these. I'd like the car to be a daily driver in the summer and after my research I selected the parts based upon my needs. While I am concerned about the dyno results my worry is that I have a problem that should be addressed now at lower cost vs later at much higher cost. Suggestions on solutions is appreciated, bashing is not.

It sounds like the next step is to contact my tuner, confirm a few questions and get the car re-tuned. If a new tune doesn't solve the concern then either drive it or pull the engine and inspect it. Sound right?

Sincerely,
bob

Indepth

Hey Bob,

Your dyno looks way too low for what it should be - regardless of what heads you have on your car.

As others any myself have stated it seems like a mechanical issue OR your tuner is desperately in need of some remedial tuning courses. If you're confident your tuner is not to blame here then I'd start having another shop (likely NOT the one that built your car in the first place) take a look at it as something is likely not right. Have them do an overall inspection first before you go to the extreme of removing the motor entirely.

For what it's worth, your recent heads from AHP are much better than what I and members of 2-3 years ago got from AHP. They're now CNC'd instead of 'hand ported' which are a slight improvement over the stock castings. The older versions of AHP heads and their 'hand porting' are the big problem examples.

I hope you can get to the root of your issue. I know how frustrating it is to do research and put your best foot forward only to have lackluster results.

freddyvette

Yeah, nope, no other changes, aside from the fact that you had to remove the entire top end, reinstall the heads, intake manifold, gaskets, etc. So let's dismiss the fact that you could have had issues on the initial installation. Sure.

My engineering background allows me to use google to calculate things as well. Your total vacuum generated from 96kpa at the manifold against a 99kpa atmosphere is 3 kpa which is 0.435113 psi. That's so negligible, and you're making it out like their cookie cutter AHP CNC program flows like garbage. You're just plain wrong. Then you claim hogging them out more not only removed the restriction but increased the flow to above atmospheric pressures.

So where are your dyno sheets my dude?? How many hundreds of more horsepower are you making now that you have 4kpa less vacuum? Not only that but you claim to be at 103 kpa manifold pressure when that's higher than barometric pressure. jeez you must have some new type of N/A boost mod!

freddyvette

Bob, as I said before, I would not return to that tuner. Your setup should be making way more power than it is. The glaring issue is the air fuel ratio which is persistently high from your previous tune and your new tune with the same tuner. That sends up red flags in regards to competency. For the AHP 116 cam you should be looking at around 530 rwhp on a dynojet and a bit less on a mustang dyno.

bobandc

Thanks for your comments. I am looking into that today. Any questions I should ask of the tuner to qualify them?

freddyvette

Show them all your dyno sheets (mark the final afr numbers on the scale to bring them to light) and ask them what they think the problem is.

bobandc

Talked to another tuner and their suggestion was to spend an hour or so on an inspection to see if there were others issues causing the problem. Their example was a potential fuel pump issue. This seems to make sense, Agreed?

freddyvette

I'm not saying it's impossible, but your stock fuel pump should be more than enough for the power levels you are at. If the fuel pump was taking a ****, it wouldn't be able to maintain fuel pressure, and that already high 13:1 AFR would shoot up by quite a bit.

73DBG

Yup 100% agree.....take it to a different shop.

rabrooks

FYI, my 09 z06 dynoed at 445 hp. With halltech beehive cai LG LTH, and hi flow cats it tuned out to 488hp. Cant remember the torque. This was at sea level