Alaska SS

So, educate me on the ERL block. What's the difference in strength? From what I can see they convert the 4 bolt head to a six bolt. That'll help from lifting the head and blowing a head gasket but what else do they do that actually makes the aluminum block able to withstand that kind.of cylinder pressure? Can you give me a ballpark on cost? Thanks for the education and info.

usmcpony

LSX is stronger but weighs 120 lbs heavier than aluminum. ERL uses stock aluminum blocks. Puts thicker sleeves and converts to a 6 bolt. Depends on what options you choose.

Alaska SS

Any idea what sleeves they use? I'm replacing the entire rotating assembly so might as well do that why the motor is out.

usmcpony

I thought they used their own sleeves but im not exactly sure.

0ERL PERFORMANCE

Check out this video link about our sleeving systems. You can give us a call next week so we can discuss further:
http://youtu.be/ONWWlMIfu8o
Happy New Year!

Unreal

The replace sleeves with thicker and stronger sleeves.

I would just do a LSX block for that power level.

Alaska SS

I'm with you but I have an awesome set of heads on the car already and don't want to totally start over. There's a big difference between a $10k rebuild and a $25k build...at least there is in my wallet. LOL

I plan on leaving the car around 800 on the blower, 1000 on nitrous and just adding a bigger jet if we really need to get jiggy with it. I don't want to over build the motor but I don't want to underbuild it either just to save a buck.

That's why I'm looking for actual breakage stories. A lot of speculation on limits but I haven't heard of any blocks coming apart yet. I know I'm pushing the limits but wonder what the proven limits really are and if anyone has been there yet? I see a couple folks making 1000+ with new rotating assemblies and stock block but no stories of real death and destruction. LOL

Undy

On your sleeved LS7 stock stroke assembled short block, do you R&R the factory TI rods? If so, what all do you do to them? Thanks in advance for your reply.

Unreal

Heads swap right over. Same with all the accesories and all the parts. It isn't restarting anything.

A nice ~1500rwhp LSX setup will cost you ~$8500ish. You can sell your stock shortblock for $4000 or so making the end cost for the swap ~$4500. That is exactly what I did. Now have 13k miles of racing and daily driving at between 1000-1200rwhp with zero issues with the motor.

Seen plenty of stock ls7 block crack and die. Anywhere from 700-1000rwhp. Some last awhile, but any detonation at all and they split the #7 liner.

The extra $2k on a block is pennies compared to the $10-12k you need to put into the drivetrain just to hold 1000+, and the $2500 in fuel system, etc. It is a solid $30-40k in parts to put a 1000rwhp vette together.

Vito.A

Jason from Katech posted an issue with a stock block failing in one of his builds. The engine was in the 600hp range on the road race circuit. The issue is the sleeves are thin and crack easily. They replaced the OEM block with an RHS. I saw at the PRI show that Dart now has a revised LS block.

The OEM crank and rods will not hold up long term at that HP level. I would invest in a Callies Magnum crank and Oliver Billet rods, the extra heavy versions for blown application. You'll also need a quality 2618 forged piston verses the 4032 alloy.

I would opt for Brodix heads and Inconel stainless valves. They seem to hold up well for high HP applications.

You should also review your components for the rest of the drive train.

Michael_D

Building an engine is like building a house in many ways.... Good foundation that's solid and square and you have no problems when going up. Crap foundation that's not square or level, and you fight it the entire way to hanging doors and cabinets. Then if you have an earthquake, it'll all come down around your ears. The block is your foundation. It needs to be designed to hold the load you throw at it, and machined correctly. If it's machined correctly, everything goes together sooooooo much more smoothly...

You have several options. But at 1300 hp, using the OE block, without any improvements, is one option that really needs to be off the table. I would not consider that option anything but, well....stupid.

An LSX block is certainally one option, if weight is not a concern, and saving some money is. At this power level, that woudl be your least expensive option.

R.E.D. does good work on LS blocks. I know they install Darton products, and not sure what others.

ERL also does good work. I've had my hands on a couple LS blocks they re-worked, and couldn't have asked for better. I'm pretty sure you can get Darton dry sleeves, but not sure about Darton MID sleeves, as they have their own super deck option.

The Darton dry liner is a ductal iron alloy, whereas the OE liner is just pot metal. The OE sleeve is brittle and will not withstand detonation as well as the ductile iron alloy. I don't think I'd trust the Darton dry liner for 1300 hp though. Maybe 1000, but more than that would be pushing your luck.

The MID sleeve is a completely different animal. More than I care to get into, as it also included some trick machine work. It would be my choice for this power level over the other. RED's website has some details on it. http://www.raceenginedevelopment.com...-installation/

At 1300hp, I'd lean toward ERL's super deck option or the MID sleeve. I'd probably go with O-ring head seals, 1/2" studs, billet main caps, bushed and keyed 905 lifter bores. You'd be golden for about 1800 hp, should you decide to run more boost down the road.

A couple other options worth consideration, would be an RHS solid deck block, and if money is not a big concern....LSM Engineering would be at the top of my list. Their billet aluminum blocks are a work of art that handle well over 2000 hp. Actually, if you’re looking seriously at having block work done, you should call LSM and see what they can do with the OE LS block. I've had them work over and lighten tall deck BBC blocks before and their work is spectacular. They have a ceramic / Nicasil liner that's good for damn near anything you can throw at it too. http://www.lsmeng.com/Billet-Blocks.html

usmcpony

usmcpony

croatbob

Lsx iron stuffed with forged bits, mast heads, f1x or twins. Get ready to bank roll heart ache lol