Vette @ 71

Tunes and un-tunes might leave a record within the brain central..

Bill Dearborn

The dealer doesn't make the decision when the tune comes into question. If the car is under the factory warranty GM makes that decision. If the car is under GMPP or some other third party warranty their rep makes the decision. What helps is to have dealer personnel on your side since they do most of the interfacing with the GM and other warranty Reps. If they present a good story you get covered when maybe you shouldn't have or you get more coverage than the plan calls for but if they have no inclination to work with a butt head they don't say anything and the rep draws his or her own conclusions from the deafening silence.

Bill

propain

Then bring it in as is and take your chances. Changing the ECU in an effort to trick the Warranty company and hiding the fact that is was tuned when it failed is fraud.

propain

A friend on mine had some problems with his newly purchased Z06. He spun the main bearing. He brought it to a shop in an effort to flash the ECU back to stock since the car was tuned. The shop claimed if he re-flashed it wouldn't be detected. The warranty inspection team knew it was tuned and denied his initial warranty claim. He appealed the decision and GM replaced his LS7 because the tune couldn't be blamed for the failure.

If you tuned your ECU you WILL be detected. I don't care what anyone says in this thread. They will know. Like I said, bring it in as is and take your chances. Otherwise you are risking fraud if they warranty company wants to pursue it.

RobsVette04

You sure do have a lot of opinions on "fraud", but I am assuming you aren't a lawyer or even a warranty claims specialist.

Let the man do as he pleases, and suffer any consequences that may come with those choices.

propain

He is free to do as he pleases. What gave you the impression I was telling him what to do or that I had some type of power over his decision?

I'm sorry if you don't like my opinion but anyone with a shred of intelligence can tell what some are proposing to do is fraud. This is a discussion forum. If you don't like open discussions I think you should find somewhere else to spend your time.

Also you know what they say about ***umptions right?

Bill Dearborn

If somebody is hiding something there must be a reason why they are hiding it. In the case of hiding a tune when they take the car in for warranty repairs there can only be one reason. It doesn't take a lawyer to know when something is fraudulent. Plenty of people who aren't lawyers commit fraud and know they are committing it. However, it does take a lawyer to defend you if are caught and charges are pressed. Is it worth $20K to take a chance on spending time in prison/probation and getting a criminal record that will last the rest of your life?

Bill

meanjoe

Here we go again

'06 Quicksilver Z06

I think that the post #4 in the following thread illustrates well your point above in your second paragraph, that a tune will be detected.

https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...ket-tunes.html

Furthermore, the question as to if the OP has a "warranty" or an "auto service contract" perhaps should be considered.

We throw the term "extended warranty" around in here a lot, and some of these "extended warranties" are actually "auto service contracts".

Worthy of note here is that an "auto service contract", is not the same as a "warranty".

https://www.consumer.ftc.gov/article...and-warranties

If his "contract", specifically stipulates no aftermarket calibrations in order for the contract to remain in effect, well then a good lawyer can tell him better whether or not what some of us are referring to as the "warranty company" would be required to demonstrate that the tune caused the failure.

If they actually came out and said in no uncertain terms; "no aftermarket calibrations allowed in order for this contract to remain in effect", or verbiage indicating that, and the OP "agreed/signed on" for that, well then again it would seem to me that it would put him a disadvantage either way.

At any rate though, how hard they look, i.e. are they even going to check for a tune, and how much effort are they going to put forth in checking, and finally does it even matter to them if it was tuned (it probably does), are going to be the key factors in whether or not he is able to get this mishap covered under his warranty of contract whichever one he has.

propain

Well said.

crAzy

Yep my 3rd party warranty is basically a service contract. Any performance modifications to the car will void any repair to the engine. They do state a cold air intake and a catback exhaust are the only exceptions. I even verified with them many times if I was allowed to have a cai and a catback exhaust before going with them. It also states it in their contract. They def have paid off though. Both window regulator replacements, ac and condenser replacement and fuel tank sending unit replacement. Now the final thing I will get done is get the heads checked and hopefully they will replace them if they are out of spec.

reasonable suspicion

Prison? Probation? Lol lol lol

Evolution

Valium man, it might help.

IF the tune leaned the motor out then sure, it should be his problem. I agree totally with that scenario. Problem is, we all know there is a problem with this motor design. Some have no problems, some drop valves. That's just a known fact. I'd do what I could to protect myself, and not worry about a dealer loss.

And if you're arguing helping yourself, then you obviously haven't been denied warranty work due to mods that have nothing to do with a problem the car has. Either that or you don't care about spending money on warranty work the dealer should provide. The C5 BCM problem comes to mind. When they were throwing suspension/active handling codes all the time and people were getting denied work due to induction, headers etc... But, to each their own. OP asked for comments, and comments he has to ponder on.

'06 Quicksilver Z06

The bottom line here is how does one know if the tune was or was not a contributing factor in this failure.

How does one know?

Whose burden is it to prove that it was the tune?

Well, if it's a "warranty" well then people are going to point to Mag Moss like they usually do on these forums and say that "it has to be proven that the mod caused the failure in order for you to be denied warranty coverage."

However it's already been pointed out that many of these "extended warranties" aren't "warranties" at all but service contracts.

A good lawyer can tell him if Mag Moss extends to service contracts.

If it's discovered that it was tuned, well then it's going to come down to what his "warranty" or more likely, his "service contract" says and what it lists in black and white as exclusions or things which would be in violation of his agreement.

In short, you're lookin at this matter in terms of what you perceive to be "right" or "just". Thus your position "if the tune didn't cause the problem, then his issue should be covered."

However this will possibly come down to what is "legal" as opposed to anything else.

If they have a legal recourse to deny him a warranty repair, based upon language in his "extended warranty" allowing them to do so, well then they just might excercise that right whether any of us see it as "fair" or not.

As already pointed out, any attempt at deceiving them and hiding the fact that it was tuned, in an effort to obtain what one considers to be "fair", is likely to fail for reasons already mentioned in this thread.

propain

Its called being a man. It might help.

You make choices in life with knowledge of consequences. If you buy an expensive car and tune it you are making that choice. A small gain in power for your warranty. You can attempt to make a fraudulent claim and possibly get away with it or you can man up and do it the right way. The moment you start playing games you lose credibility. You are attempting to cover something up or insult others intelligence with a feeble attempt to cover your tampering. If its my company, I slam the door on you. Come to me with it tuned and say "prove the tune caused this" will definitely go much further.

Yes, much to ponder. If you cant afford to play and pay. Then you shouldn't.

Its not the dealers loss anyhow. Its GMs loss or the loss of the warranty company. As a business owner people trying to "protect themselves" from their own bad choices with fraudulent claims when they know they are in the wrong make me sick.

RobsVette04

Exactly, this made me laugh also.

You guys need to talk to a lawyer, as nothing stated in this forum conversation so far would warrant any type of prison term or probation.

Maybe he wants to tune the car back to stock. Maybe he put a stock tune on it to avoid any other damage. There is nothing to prove, not even this conversation, why the owner of the car might actually re-tune the car.

I can appreciate people being cautious, but by no means will there be jail or probation.

propain

No of course there wont be jail or probation. But they can simply slam the door on him. Whatever his reason past, present or future once you tune you will void the warranty.

Dirty Howie

I agree !!!!!!!!

This is why I kept my motor stock till the warranty ran out on my 2008. And is also why I am keeping the motor stock in my current 2006 until its warranty is up.


DH

propain

Yup!

I did the same with my Z06. I wouldn't touch it until the Warranty was finished. I wanted to tune it so badly and start playing. But with the issues surrounding the LS7 it wasn't worth the risk.

'06 Quicksilver Z06

But from the standpoint of the company agreeing to service his car in the event of a mechanical mishap, what would it matter to them "why" he tuned it, if his "warranty agreement" expressly states that an aftermarket calibration is grounds for them to deny coverage for a repair.

If they discover that it was tuned, and their contract says that tunes will result in a violation of the terms of the agreement, then they aren't going to care one way or the other "why" it was tuned.

They'll see that they have a way out of covering his mishap, and quite possibly take it.

Someone is going to eat a $20K repair bill for this car. Either them or the the OP.

If there is any way possible that they can let that be the OP, well then you can bet that they'll keep his premium that he has already paid for the coverage, and let him get the car back on the road somehow, but out of his own pocket.

If he were bringing it in to have his radio or his windshield wipers fixed, it might be different, because on repairs like that, they probably aren't going to look for tunes.

But something this big, I would not be surprised if they made every effort and exercise every legal right that they had to get out of paying for this mishap.

Or they just might look the other way.

But just thinking out loud here, there is that possibility that if he takes the suggestions of some in here, and tries to return it to stock and that effort at deceit is discovered, then that could backfire and **** them off and cause them to deny him coverage where had he otherwise been honest and left things be, made no attempt to deceive them and just owned up to the tune in the first place, they might have given him some relief.