[ZR1] What am I doing wrong?
12-01-2012, 10:19 AM
#22
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stalling the car has NOTHING to do with a lack of torque, it's all about gearing. Can anyone confirm if there is a difference between the final drive of the zr1 and z06 or their gearbox ratios, or both?
Also, the z06 clutch feels stiffer because the zr1 has a twin plate clutch. The twin plate does not require as heavy a pressure plate given the load is shared between two friction plates. I'm sure the carrier bearings are quite different between the two cars also.
Also, the z06 clutch feels stiffer because the zr1 has a twin plate clutch. The twin plate does not require as heavy a pressure plate given the load is shared between two friction plates. I'm sure the carrier bearings are quite different between the two cars also.
12-01-2012, 10:25 AM
#23
Safety Car
Thread Starter
The car felt slow is all Im saying. Do I need to be in second? Where is the sweet spot in the rpm band? For instance, hitting the gas hard while in 3rd and 3,500 rpm in my Z is when you really feel like the car is going to take off and fly away with you in it...
12-01-2012, 10:25 AM
#24
Burning Brakes
I moved on from the Z06 to the Zr1. When I test drove it, I was not underwhelmed, but it was not much faster the way I test drove it. After I took it home and got familiar with it's power delivery I really can tell a difference. It also takes exponential power to notice the difference. What I mean is the jump from LS3 to LS7 70hp is much more noticeable than LS7 to LS9 which is 135hp.
Also, did you test drive the same ZR or was it two different ones. I ask because there have been a very low number of ZR's with supercharger needing replacement. Did you see boost going up to at least +12lbs?
Joe
Also, did you test drive the same ZR or was it two different ones. I ask because there have been a very low number of ZR's with supercharger needing replacement. Did you see boost going up to at least +12lbs?
Joe
12-01-2012, 10:57 AM
#25
Le Mans Master
It is a confirmed 3+ tenths quicker in the 1/4 bone stock on stock tires (street trim) and almost a whopping .5 seconds when you harness the power with a drag radial, that is an *** kicking, if you can't feel that, then you either don't want to feel it or you don't know how to drive the ZR1. 
12-01-2012, 11:03 AM
#26
Le Mans Master
Car stalls off idle because the supercharger bypass valve. Basically until you come out of boost you are making less power than a LS3.
Better tires than whats on your Z06 is also making the ZR1 feel slower. It hooks and doesn't violently toss the rear around.
Better tires than whats on your Z06 is also making the ZR1 feel slower. It hooks and doesn't violently toss the rear around.
12-01-2012, 11:32 AM
#27
Melting Slicks
If you cant tell the difference in a 4th gear pull from 60 mph to 100 MPH between your Z06 and the ZR1, you're: a)lieing b) not in a ZR1 c) dead
12-01-2012, 12:04 PM
#28
Le Mans Master
I've now test driven a ZR1 two times and both times, I left feeling not only underwhelmed by the car but IMPRESSED with the power of my stock '06 Z06. I purposely drive my Z06 to the dealership and then back for immediate comparison sake. What am I doing wrong? I'm hitting 6,000 plus in first and shifting of course at that point to second. One thing Im not doing is going over 100mph, because of the law and such, but I just leave the dealership so let down by the power. And the clutch is a whole other story. It's so soft and easy, I don't know how I feel about that. The Z06 is firm, with enough torque to get the car moving by just letting out the pedal slowly from a stop. The ZR1, not so much. I stalled it. I haven't stalled a car in over 2 years. I was expecting the torque from the motor to engage the car and get it rolling. It didn't. I had to give it gas each time to get her in first. Again, on the way home, this was a sigh of relief to be back in my Z. And the stock shifter, after a year with the MGW just felt like a mushy piece of garbage. Felt like I was shifting with a banana. Now I know some of these qualms can be rectified others are unique but I wanted to post this in the ZR1 forum, because I KNOW the LS9 is a better motor and the ZR1 a better car. I'm going to try one more time to get that seat of the pants, holy sh*t I think I'm going to take off and start flying feeling lol But I need some help. Everything I hear from everyone in a ZR1 is how much more awesome it is from the Z06 and how much of a "step up" it is. Like going from a base coupe to a Z06. But from my experiences, the difference is much much smaller than that.
12-01-2012, 12:11 PM
#29
Le Mans Master
As for the comparisons. I came from an '09 Z (which was a great car) and to me, there is no comparison. The ZR1 puts me back in the seat like no car I've ever driven. The low-end torque is amazing and in the upper RPMs, it pulls like, well, it's almost scary how the car accelerates. I'm thinking there was something wrong with the car you drove.
12-01-2012, 01:17 PM
#30
Instructor
Did the dealer pull the car around and let it sit idling for a while as you talked about the car and looked at it allowing it to get heat soaked? The zr1 puts the power down a little better depending on which tires are on but you should be able to tell the difference very easily. Off idle the ls9 isn't making any tq since you are making zero boost and you are in a lower compression 6.2 compared to the 427. At idle is absolutely the only place the ls7 is making more power. I alway consider the ls7 more raw is from the lack of sound deadening in the car. I view the z06 as race bred street bruiser where the zr1 is a super car. I love both.
12-01-2012, 01:24 PM
#31
lifeislikeaboxofchocolats
Drive the ZR1 for a week then go back to the Z06....you will have a different opinion
12-01-2012, 01:34 PM
#32
Safety Car
Thread Starter
Ok seems like I'm just not behind the wheel of it long enough. Financially I can't afford one, well, responsibly couldn't afford one. Appreciate the replies. It's certainly an awesome motor. I want to put an LS9 in my Z06 but everyone keeps telling me how impractical it is. They don't know the deal I'd be getting on the motor/accessories. I need to think this over. Do I cam my Z06 or swap in an LS9? After that test drive, it was clear: cam the Z06! But now this thread has me second guessing. It's be much cheaper to swap in an LS9 than trade up to a ZR1 by about $20,000 last time I added some numbers.
12-01-2012, 02:05 PM
#34
Safety Car
Thread Starter
12-01-2012, 02:19 PM
#35
Race Director
Hey Louis
If you ever find yourself over this way in Daytona let me know - I'll let you do a REAL test drive!!
The cars are different. When the C6 first came out C5 owners were saying the same thing. The C5Z06 had about the same power as the LS2, but the C5 guys thought the C6 just didn't feel as fast or powerful, but it's just simply because the C6 did everything the C5 did, but smoother and easier, with much more refinement and less drama.
I've been driving for a loooooooooooong time, and I've never owned a car that didn't have a manual transmission, but when I got my ZR1 I stalled it a couple times!!
The early ZR1, or the newer one with the PDE package, has a lot higher overall final gear ratio in first than the Z06 does.
Also, the throttle response of all the C6 Vettes is not real peppy - there's a slow response from mashing the accelerator pedal to when the power comes on. You can tune throttle tip-in so the power comes on quicker, but I didn't want to void the warranty with a tune, so I installed a Sprint Throttle Booster and now have a nice quick throttle-up when mashing the go pedal!!
Additionally, when driving on the street, you just can't push either of these cars up into the performance area where you can really feel the difference. Unless you're doing something totally and insanely illegal, when driving on the street both of the cars (or even a base Vette) are so far under their max performance capability that it's hard to really feel a SOTP difference.
Bob
If you ever find yourself over this way in Daytona let me know - I'll let you do a REAL test drive!!
The cars are different. When the C6 first came out C5 owners were saying the same thing. The C5Z06 had about the same power as the LS2, but the C5 guys thought the C6 just didn't feel as fast or powerful, but it's just simply because the C6 did everything the C5 did, but smoother and easier, with much more refinement and less drama.
I've been driving for a loooooooooooong time, and I've never owned a car that didn't have a manual transmission, but when I got my ZR1 I stalled it a couple times!!
The early ZR1, or the newer one with the PDE package, has a lot higher overall final gear ratio in first than the Z06 does.
Also, the throttle response of all the C6 Vettes is not real peppy - there's a slow response from mashing the accelerator pedal to when the power comes on. You can tune throttle tip-in so the power comes on quicker, but I didn't want to void the warranty with a tune, so I installed a Sprint Throttle Booster and now have a nice quick throttle-up when mashing the go pedal!!
Additionally, when driving on the street, you just can't push either of these cars up into the performance area where you can really feel the difference. Unless you're doing something totally and insanely illegal, when driving on the street both of the cars (or even a base Vette) are so far under their max performance capability that it's hard to really feel a SOTP difference.
Bob
12-01-2012, 02:27 PM
#36
Race Director
If you equip your Z with an LS9, you'll still have just that..."an LS9 equipped Z"..Z's are awesome cars as like most here I went from a Z to a ZR. My vote would be just to simply put a sc on your Z....prob less headachs as well...I was getting about 660 at the rear wheels with my Z with absolutely no driveability loss with the following;
-AA S/C kit
-B&B Fusions
-Tune
-AA S/C kit
-B&B Fusions
-Tune
12-01-2012, 03:45 PM
#37
Racer
I also went from a Z06 to the ZR1 this summer. A friend of mine & myself track our Z06s. When I went to the ZR1, I noticed a difference. On a track day, my friend drove the ZR1 to a gas station, & he also notice a difference. I wish I could figure out your experience between the two cars. Don't get me wrong, I loved the Z06, just didn't want the hassle with the valve problems, even though I had an extended warranty.
12-01-2012, 03:53 PM
#38
Melting Slicks
The two cars of both a blast to drive, but they are two very different animals. The Z06 works on higher RPM, while the ZR1 work on forced induction and less RPM. Of course a higher RPM car may give the perception of more speed, but trust me, the power difference is there. Another thing is the tires are much better on the ZR1 so the ride is smoother. One thing I love every time the exhaust flaps open a 3000 RPM and the boost gauge starts climbing, the car sounds like a jet taking off. The torque on the ZR1 is amazing as it pulls harder in each gear, while the Z06 pulls harder in first and second and starts to tail off in the other gears.
12-01-2012, 04:01 PM
#39
Race Director
All I know is that I ran my all-stock ZR1 at the Texas Mile (the end of October) and it was totally amazing:
power that didn't stop in the first 5 gears from about 2000 rpm right up to 6400 rpm (redline is 6500 rpm).
I have never driven anything this powerful or exhilarating, and being able to open it up all the way
on the T-Mile runway can't be topped (IMO).
With a flywheel rating of 638 hp and 604 ft-lbs TQ, you will definitely feel a difference in the right conditions,
despite the extra 150 lbs +/- (?) of weight. I also agree with the others--on the street, it's really hard to tell
before you run out of room...
power that didn't stop in the first 5 gears from about 2000 rpm right up to 6400 rpm (redline is 6500 rpm).
I have never driven anything this powerful or exhilarating, and being able to open it up all the way
on the T-Mile runway can't be topped (IMO).
With a flywheel rating of 638 hp and 604 ft-lbs TQ, you will definitely feel a difference in the right conditions,
despite the extra 150 lbs +/- (?) of weight. I also agree with the others--on the street, it's really hard to tell
before you run out of room...
Last edited by Gary '09 C6; 12-01-2012 at 10:14 PM. Reason: formatting
12-01-2012, 04:03 PM
#40
Race Director
The two cars of both a blast to drive, but they are two very different animals. The Z06 works on higher RPM, while the ZR1 work on forced induction and less RPM. Of course a higher RPM car may give the perception of more speed, but trust me, the power difference is there. Another thing is the tires are much better on the ZR1 so the ride is smoother. One thing I love every time the exhaust flaps open a 3000 RPM and the boost gauge starts climbing, the car sounds like a jet taking off. The torque on the ZR1 is amazing as it pulls harder in each gear, while the Z06 pulls harder in first and second and starts to tail off in the other gears.
an excellent description, b-t-w--thx.