[Z06] Sky is not falling but READ THIS THREAD if you are on stock valves/guides
09-03-2011, 01:35 PM
#241
Le Mans Master
He would blame driver and any mod whatsoever on failures.
09-03-2011, 02:23 PM
#242
There are still many documented failures due to bad mods, a bad tune, driver error, etc. etc. Those failures are contributing to the "overall failure rate" of the engine since there is no real way to know if it was entirely the engines fault or otherwise. The lowest failure rate of these engines are of the stock, non beat to death, properly cared for variety. I'm a believer in the high miles theory implied by Jimman. The cars that get driven the most seem to have less issues. The cars that sit around for years with only a few thousand miles seem to have or be prone to more issues. Just my observation.
09-03-2011, 02:41 PM
#243
Team Owner
Just for giggles and grins, can anybody on this thread actually name all the people who have reported having this problem? I'll be surprised if any of you can name more than ten people who have. Anyone want to take that challenge? And lets say I'm wrong and you can name 20 or 30 who have had this problem.
What we really have going on in this thread that is worrying people are "tuners" who are reporting that they are seeing an alarming number. Ok, let's ask those tuners to name names.
I just got an e-mail this morning from one of my sisters who is an intelligent and credible lady. She was passing along a bit of advice that if a "police officer" in an unmarked car tries to pull you over, you can dial "112" on your cell phone and get straight through to the highway patrol. Guess what? That is not true.
How much credibility are we giving to the tuners who are making claims that they are seeing more of these problems. How many more? How were the cars used or abused? Can they name names?
Please somebody, do a count and tell us how many we actually know about that we can document?
What we really have going on in this thread that is worrying people are "tuners" who are reporting that they are seeing an alarming number. Ok, let's ask those tuners to name names.
I just got an e-mail this morning from one of my sisters who is an intelligent and credible lady. She was passing along a bit of advice that if a "police officer" in an unmarked car tries to pull you over, you can dial "112" on your cell phone and get straight through to the highway patrol. Guess what? That is not true.
How much credibility are we giving to the tuners who are making claims that they are seeing more of these problems. How many more? How were the cars used or abused? Can they name names?
Please somebody, do a count and tell us how many we actually know about that we can document?
09-03-2011, 02:48 PM
#244
You could be absolutely right. One can get a "lemon" in anything from wives to kids, to inlaws, to cars.I could end up going from a perfectly good running LS7 to a lemon LS9, and that is a risk that at this point I feel might be worth taking.
The reason why is because I am not considering the ZR1 on the sole basis of this particular issue.
In other words, if this issue were non existent........I'd still want a ZR1.
The fact that these issues which we have seen in the LS7 have been so thoroughly discussed and simply seem not to relent, abate or go away, makes it just a little bit easier for me to justify the expense.
I'd end up buying one even if all this talk about LS7 reliability wasn't out there.
When the needle bearing issue first showed up, it had been around awhile before they commented on it. And this valve issue has been around for awhile too. Now we are finally hearing that they "have seen excessive valve guide wear".
We'll have to wait a bit longer for them to elaborate further, we are told.
I know what you mean. The other manufacturers really aren't offering anything I'm interested in, in a sports car... Not say that won't change at some point, but as of now I am satisfied. If I decide to move on in the future I'll lose some money, but it won't be so catastrophic that I won't be able to over come it. After all I owned a race car at one point. That alone should of had me living under a bridge.
Good luck.
Last edited by '06 Quicksilver Z06; 09-03-2011 at 02:51 PM.
09-03-2011, 03:37 PM
#245
Instructor
Member Since: Sep 2007
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Just for giggles and grins, can anybody on this thread actually name all the people who have reported having this problem? I'll be surprised if any of you can name more than ten people who have. Anyone want to take that challenge? And lets say I'm wrong and you can name 20 or 30 who have had this problem.
What we really have going on in this thread that is worrying people are "tuners" who are reporting that they are seeing an alarming number. Ok, let's ask those tuners to name names.
I just got an e-mail this morning from one of my sisters who is an intelligent and credible lady. She was passing along a bit of advice that if a "police officer" in an unmarked car tries to pull you over, you can dial "112" on your cell phone and get straight through to the highway patrol. Guess what? That is not true.
How much credibility are we giving to the tuners who are making claims that they are seeing more of these problems. How many more? How were the cars used or abused? Can they name names?
Please somebody, do a count and tell us how many we actually know about that we can document?
What we really have going on in this thread that is worrying people are "tuners" who are reporting that they are seeing an alarming number. Ok, let's ask those tuners to name names.
I just got an e-mail this morning from one of my sisters who is an intelligent and credible lady. She was passing along a bit of advice that if a "police officer" in an unmarked car tries to pull you over, you can dial "112" on your cell phone and get straight through to the highway patrol. Guess what? That is not true.
How much credibility are we giving to the tuners who are making claims that they are seeing more of these problems. How many more? How were the cars used or abused? Can they name names?
Please somebody, do a count and tell us how many we actually know about that we can document?
I have personally seen, along with RoHo, excessive valve guide wear on a LS7 with only 30K mi, at a very reputable tuner in So Cal.
I only have 13K on mine, which gets run hard when it comes out of the garage. This morning I pulled the valve springs and checked the guides on the left bank and am happy to report no issues. Only took a few hours and reminded me how much fun it is to wrench on these.
The LS7 is an amazing engine and like any high strung performance/race engine requires some attention. You can't expect to run 20 to 30 HPDEs and then expect to get the life out of it that Jimman has.
I am planning on a forging the bottom end soon, along with cam and headers and will address the heads at that time. Does it need all that, probably not, but I want to do it. There will always be those who choose to be proactive and those who wait and see. I say enjoy your car either way.
09-03-2011, 05:40 PM
#246
_"SCOTT"_
Bottom line is ZR1s are freakin' cool to own in many ways.
09-03-2011, 05:53 PM
#247
_"SCOTT"_
A continuation of my last post...
There's a risk in owning any car of this caliber whether it be an LS7 or an LS9. there just "seems " to be an ongoing reoccurring problem with the LS7s. Some of this may be justified, but there are about 30,000 units on the road to date since late 2005 which has a lot to do with the influx of data to date.
I don't think the ZR1s have enough time/miles on them to determine if there's any inherent problems. GM has all the info you need on this but getting this info from them is about as likely as one of us winning a foot race against a Z06 or ZR1.
There's a risk in owning any car of this caliber whether it be an LS7 or an LS9. there just "seems " to be an ongoing reoccurring problem with the LS7s. Some of this may be justified, but there are about 30,000 units on the road to date since late 2005 which has a lot to do with the influx of data to date.
I don't think the ZR1s have enough time/miles on them to determine if there's any inherent problems. GM has all the info you need on this but getting this info from them is about as likely as one of us winning a foot race against a Z06 or ZR1.
09-03-2011, 06:34 PM
#248
And you know what....in most cases I still do. So you need not be disappointed.
There are plenty of failures in LS7s which could be traced to precisely that. I make absolutely no apologies and never will, for blaming some of these junk mods and "toons" for some of these LS7 failures.
But right now, and even in the past, it's the bone stock issues, the issues in bone stock, non abused cars, the valve guide wear, etc., which are coming closer and closer to the forefront and are what I'm looking at.
I couldn't care less about a car modded for power, or with suspension mods which would overwhelm the stock oiling system, failing on the street or the race track. It's the stock failures, and the valve and valve guide issues in the stock ones, which most concern me. And in this engine, well there have been more descriptions of each than I'd like to see.
When Jason from Katech, says "we are seeing excessive valve guide wear", I put a lot more stock into that than some guy who got a mail order "toon" and installed his own "headahs" and went out and popped his LS7 and then trying to blame GM.
Not "gloom and doom". I still think that overall, these stock failures are rare.
I was always objective, even going so far as to count up the number of bone stock failures reported in here back in 2009.
The numbers back then, supported my position.
However the information available, and accumulating over the years since that post and others, has gotten to the point to where I have to re evaluate my previous position.
If the trend had worked out the other way, and solidified my prior position, I would have kept it.
However the trend has worked this particular way and eroded that position. These reports of showroom stock and very near showroom stock failures aren't abating. On the contrary, they seem to be almost picking up over the years since my original report/thread. If it were all
, then the reports of these issues would be letting up and it would be rare for you to see one. They aren't.
At the time of that posting there had been 25,623 C6 Z06s built to date. At the end of 2011MY, we only have 27,045 Z06s built, only another 1,422 cars. But since the time of that post back in 2009, we are still seeing stock and very near stock reports of failures in here. So why are they still continuing?
How often do you hear of crank pulley issues or DBS? Very little since '05, '06. The reason why is because GM fixed the issue.
But these engine issues reports are still going, and going strong. Not necessarily outright failures mind you. But issues very possibly heralding imminent failure.
Thus if I am to be fair and objective, I have no choice but to tell you what I see looking at the evidence put on these forums.
And right now, it's getting harder and harder to hold the belief that "nothing is amiss" in the face of worn valve guides on cars with few miles on them, stock engines cars not modded for power, dropping valves.
There are plenty of failures in LS7s which could be traced to precisely that. I make absolutely no apologies and never will, for blaming some of these junk mods and "toons" for some of these LS7 failures.
But right now, and even in the past, it's the bone stock issues, the issues in bone stock, non abused cars, the valve guide wear, etc., which are coming closer and closer to the forefront and are what I'm looking at.
I couldn't care less about a car modded for power, or with suspension mods which would overwhelm the stock oiling system, failing on the street or the race track. It's the stock failures, and the valve and valve guide issues in the stock ones, which most concern me. And in this engine, well there have been more descriptions of each than I'd like to see.
When Jason from Katech, says "we are seeing excessive valve guide wear", I put a lot more stock into that than some guy who got a mail order "toon" and installed his own "headahs" and went out and popped his LS7 and then trying to blame GM.
I was always objective, even going so far as to count up the number of bone stock failures reported in here back in 2009.
The numbers back then, supported my position.
However the information available, and accumulating over the years since that post and others, has gotten to the point to where I have to re evaluate my previous position.
If the trend had worked out the other way, and solidified my prior position, I would have kept it.
However the trend has worked this particular way and eroded that position. These reports of showroom stock and very near showroom stock failures aren't abating. On the contrary, they seem to be almost picking up over the years since my original report/thread. If it were all
, then the reports of these issues would be letting up and it would be rare for you to see one. They aren't.At the time of that posting there had been 25,623 C6 Z06s built to date. At the end of 2011MY, we only have 27,045 Z06s built, only another 1,422 cars. But since the time of that post back in 2009, we are still seeing stock and very near stock reports of failures in here. So why are they still continuing?
How often do you hear of crank pulley issues or DBS? Very little since '05, '06. The reason why is because GM fixed the issue.
But these engine issues reports are still going, and going strong. Not necessarily outright failures mind you. But issues very possibly heralding imminent failure.
Thus if I am to be fair and objective, I have no choice but to tell you what I see looking at the evidence put on these forums.
And right now, it's getting harder and harder to hold the belief that "nothing is amiss" in the face of worn valve guides on cars with few miles on them, stock engines cars not modded for power, dropping valves.
Last edited by '06 Quicksilver Z06; 09-04-2011 at 03:57 AM.
09-03-2011, 08:00 PM
#249
Team Owner
That is something that perplexes me about the concerns voiced here. GM definitely has the data, and they have made no changes. That makes me think it's not that big of a problem. I doubt if they like replacing engines any more than we do.
09-03-2011, 08:04 PM
#250
Le Mans Master
Member Since: Dec 2004
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St. Jude Donor '06-'08-'10-'11-'12-'13 '14-'15-'16-'17-'18-'19
And you know what....in most cases I still do. So you need not be disappointed.
There are plenty of failures in LS7s which could be traced to precisely that. I make absolutely no apologies and never will, for blaming some of these junk mods and "toons" for some of these LS7 failures.
But right now, and even in the past, it's the bone stock issues, the issues in bone stock, non abused cars, the valve guide wear, etc., which are coming closer and closer to the forefront and are what I'm looking at.
I couldn't care less about a car modded for power, or with suspension mods which would overwhelm the stock oiling system, failing on the street or the race track. It's the stock failures, and the valve and valve guide issues in the stock ones, which most concern me. And in this engine, well there have been more descriptions of each than I'd like to see.
When Jason from Katech, says "we are seeing excessive valve guide wear", I put a lot more stock into that than some guy who got a mail order "toon" and installed his own "headahs" and went out and popped his LS7 and then trying to blame GM.
Not "gloom and doom". I still think that overall, these stock failures are rare.
I was always objective, even going so far as to count up the number of bone stock failures reported in here back in 2009.
The numbers back then, supported my position.
However the information available, and accumulating over the years since that post and others, has gotten to the point to where I have to re evaluate my previous position.
If the trend had worked out the other way, and solidified my prior position, I would have kept it.
However the trend has worked the other way and eroded that position. These reports of showroom stock and very near showroom stock failures aren't abating. On the contrary, they seem to be almost picking up over the years since my original report/thread. If it were all, then the reports of these issues would be letting up and it would be rare for you to see one. They aren't.
At the time of that posting there had been 25,623 C6 Z06s built to date. At the end of 2011MY, we only have 27,045 Z06s built, only another 1,422 cars. But since the time of that post back in 2009, we are still seeing stock and very near stock reports of failures in here. So why are they still continuing?
How often do you hear of crank pulley issues or DBS? Very little since '05, '06. The reason why is because GM fixed the issue.
But these engine issues reports are still going, and going strong. Not necessarily outright failures mind you. But issues very possibly heralding imminent failure.
Thus if I am to be fair and objective, I have no choice but to tell you what I see looking at the evidence put on these forums.
And right now, it's getting harder and harder to hold the belief that "nothing is amiss" in the face of worn valve guides on cars with few miles on them, stock engines cars not modded for power, dropping valves.
There are plenty of failures in LS7s which could be traced to precisely that. I make absolutely no apologies and never will, for blaming some of these junk mods and "toons" for some of these LS7 failures.
But right now, and even in the past, it's the bone stock issues, the issues in bone stock, non abused cars, the valve guide wear, etc., which are coming closer and closer to the forefront and are what I'm looking at.
I couldn't care less about a car modded for power, or with suspension mods which would overwhelm the stock oiling system, failing on the street or the race track. It's the stock failures, and the valve and valve guide issues in the stock ones, which most concern me. And in this engine, well there have been more descriptions of each than I'd like to see.
When Jason from Katech, says "we are seeing excessive valve guide wear", I put a lot more stock into that than some guy who got a mail order "toon" and installed his own "headahs" and went out and popped his LS7 and then trying to blame GM.
Not "gloom and doom". I still think that overall, these stock failures are rare.
I was always objective, even going so far as to count up the number of bone stock failures reported in here back in 2009.
The numbers back then, supported my position.
However the information available, and accumulating over the years since that post and others, has gotten to the point to where I have to re evaluate my previous position.
If the trend had worked out the other way, and solidified my prior position, I would have kept it.
However the trend has worked the other way and eroded that position. These reports of showroom stock and very near showroom stock failures aren't abating. On the contrary, they seem to be almost picking up over the years since my original report/thread. If it were all
, then the reports of these issues would be letting up and it would be rare for you to see one. They aren't.At the time of that posting there had been 25,623 C6 Z06s built to date. At the end of 2011MY, we only have 27,045 Z06s built, only another 1,422 cars. But since the time of that post back in 2009, we are still seeing stock and very near stock reports of failures in here. So why are they still continuing?
How often do you hear of crank pulley issues or DBS? Very little since '05, '06. The reason why is because GM fixed the issue.
But these engine issues reports are still going, and going strong. Not necessarily outright failures mind you. But issues very possibly heralding imminent failure.
Thus if I am to be fair and objective, I have no choice but to tell you what I see looking at the evidence put on these forums.
And right now, it's getting harder and harder to hold the belief that "nothing is amiss" in the face of worn valve guides on cars with few miles on them, stock engines cars not modded for power, dropping valves.
One thing I am doing is changing my oil change regimen. While I only do about 2500-3000 miles a year, I am now doing oil changes twice a year. Purely for peace of mind. Waste of oil? Maybe, but it eases my fears a little.
09-03-2011, 08:14 PM
#251
Le Mans Master
I agree you have to take these forums with a grain of salt.
I have personally seen, along with RoHo, excessive valve guide wear on a LS7 with only 30K mi, at a very reputable tuner in So Cal.
I only have 13K on mine, which gets run hard when it comes out of the garage. This morning I pulled the valve springs and checked the guides on the left bank and am happy to report no issues. Only took a few hours and reminded me how much fun it is to wrench on these.
The LS7 is an amazing engine and like any high strung performance/race engine requires some attention. You can't expect to run 20 to 30 HPDEs and then expect to get the life out of it that Jimman has.
I am planning on a forging the bottom end soon, along with cam and headers and will address the heads at that time. Does it need all that, probably not, but I want to do it. There will always be those who choose to be proactive and those who wait and see. I say enjoy your car either way.
I have personally seen, along with RoHo, excessive valve guide wear on a LS7 with only 30K mi, at a very reputable tuner in So Cal.
I only have 13K on mine, which gets run hard when it comes out of the garage. This morning I pulled the valve springs and checked the guides on the left bank and am happy to report no issues. Only took a few hours and reminded me how much fun it is to wrench on these.
The LS7 is an amazing engine and like any high strung performance/race engine requires some attention. You can't expect to run 20 to 30 HPDEs and then expect to get the life out of it that Jimman has.
I am planning on a forging the bottom end soon, along with cam and headers and will address the heads at that time. Does it need all that, probably not, but I want to do it. There will always be those who choose to be proactive and those who wait and see. I say enjoy your car either way.
...........................
I took my car out early today before it got too hot and drove it. It runs so smooth it's hard to imagine it might be grinding itself to ruin. 23.4k miles and counting.
09-03-2011, 08:16 PM
#252
Say what you want about Quicksilver, but he has always called them as he sees them. And I, for one, am seeing the same thing. It is a concern, and one I am keeping an eye on. While I don't abuse the car, I am also one to do a WOT run when I can. They are short lived because I am not on a race track, but they are WOT.
One thing I am doing is changing my oil change regimen. While I only do about 2500-3000 miles a year, I am now doing oil changes twice a year. Purely for peace of mind. Waste of oil? Maybe, but it eases my fears a little.
One thing I am doing is changing my oil change regimen. While I only do about 2500-3000 miles a year, I am now doing oil changes twice a year. Purely for peace of mind. Waste of oil? Maybe, but it eases my fears a little.
If it was going the other way, i.e. in favor of this being much ado about nothing, then you know me, I would have said that it was going the other way. I'd like nothing more than for it to be going the other way.
But it's not.
It's going the wrong way. 10 reports of bone stock failure on this forum, from 2005-July/2009, and 11 additional reports of bone stock failure found in here from August 2009 up until now. Thats not the direction you want to head in.
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c6-z...post1578600360
Last edited by '06 Quicksilver Z06; 09-04-2011 at 04:00 AM.
09-03-2011, 09:05 PM
#253
Everyone I know of that has had the exhaust valve guides checked for wear has found them to be worn including mine at 35K miles.
Just for giggles and grins, can anybody on this thread actually name all the people who have reported having this problem? I'll be surprised if any of you can name more than ten people who have. Anyone want to take that challenge? And lets say I'm wrong and you can name 20 or 30 who have had this problem.
What we really have going on in this thread that is worrying people are "tuners" who are reporting that they are seeing an alarming number. Ok, let's ask those tuners to name names.
I just got an e-mail this morning from one of my sisters who is an intelligent and credible lady. She was passing along a bit of advice that if a "police officer" in an unmarked car tries to pull you over, you can dial "112" on your cell phone and get straight through to the highway patrol. Guess what? That is not true.
How much credibility are we giving to the tuners who are making claims that they are seeing more of these problems. How many more? How were the cars used or abused? Can they name names?
Please somebody, do a count and tell us how many we actually know about that we can document?
What we really have going on in this thread that is worrying people are "tuners" who are reporting that they are seeing an alarming number. Ok, let's ask those tuners to name names.
I just got an e-mail this morning from one of my sisters who is an intelligent and credible lady. She was passing along a bit of advice that if a "police officer" in an unmarked car tries to pull you over, you can dial "112" on your cell phone and get straight through to the highway patrol. Guess what? That is not true.
How much credibility are we giving to the tuners who are making claims that they are seeing more of these problems. How many more? How were the cars used or abused? Can they name names?
Please somebody, do a count and tell us how many we actually know about that we can document?
09-03-2011, 10:05 PM
#254
Le Mans Master
Can someone take a picture and post the valve guide wear problem so regular guys like me can understand this issue a little better? We should have asked one of the engineers at Carlisle about the problem.
09-03-2011, 10:18 PM
#255
Burning Brakes
Here's a picture of the valve guide and a badly worn removed valve guide.
09-03-2011, 10:33 PM
#257
Burning Brakes
Plus a handful of alleged reports coming in from shops and members and people who know people who reported problems?
Ok, now that we've put this into perspective 
.............18 confirmed reports on CF! 0.06655574%!!! The sky is falling!!!!
Okay, seriously, I'm really just trying to make light of the fact that, by the numbers, "statistically", that's actually NOT THAT BAD!!!
How many 2.2L head gaskets popped in the old Cavaliers/Sunfires? How many 3.4L V6 intake gaskets have popped in every GM sedan and mini-van that ran those engines?!? I'd be willing to bet the percentage would be a disturbing number
. "They all go" (or so it seems).On that happy note, I'm going to rest easier tonight, knowing I probably have a higher likelyhood of being hit by a bus
.
Last edited by Cap'n Pete; 09-03-2011 at 10:36 PM.
09-03-2011, 10:41 PM
#258
So let me get this straight, that's a "Corvette Forum Official Report: 0.06655574% failure rate." ???
Plus a handful of alleged reports coming in from shops and members and people who know people who reported problems? Ok, now that we've put this into perspective .............
18 confirmed reports on CF! 0.06655574%!!! The sky is falling!!!!
Okay, seriously, I'm really just trying to make light of the fact that, by the numbers, "statistically", that's actually NOT THAT BAD!!!
How many 2.2L head gaskets popped in the old Cavaliers/Sunfires? How many 3.4L V6 intake gaskets have popped in every GM sedan and mini-van that ran those engines?!? I'd be willing to bet the percentage would be a disturbing number. "They all go" (or so it seems).
On that happy note, I'm going to rest easier tonight, knowing I probably have a higher likelyhood of being hit by a bus .
Plus a handful of alleged reports coming in from shops and members and people who know people who reported problems?
Ok, now that we've put this into perspective .............18 confirmed reports on CF! 0.06655574%!!! The sky is falling!!!!
Okay, seriously, I'm really just trying to make light of the fact that, by the numbers, "statistically", that's actually NOT THAT BAD!!!
How many 2.2L head gaskets popped in the old Cavaliers/Sunfires? How many 3.4L V6 intake gaskets have popped in every GM sedan and mini-van that ran those engines?!? I'd be willing to bet the percentage would be a disturbing number
. "They all go" (or so it seems).On that happy note, I'm going to rest easier tonight, knowing I probably have a higher likelyhood of being hit by a bus
.Not every member of CF has a C6 Z06, right?
Of the 27,045 in existence, only a small percentage of that 27,045, are actually owned by CF members.
Yet out of that few, we have had 18 reports of completely stock failures within the comparatively few Z06s we have in here.
Since not every Z06 ever built is represented on this forum, you can't divide 18/27,045 and arrive at a failure rate for CF.
The only thing you can say, is that of the total number to have failed stock, only 0.06% of them belonged to CF members.
In actuality, there are probably way fewer than 1,000 Z06s (and of course by extension, Z06 owners), out of that 27,045, represented on this forum. Indeed, saying that there are 1,000 active C6 Z06 owners on this forum, would be a generous estimate.
A good estimate would probably be into the hundreds. And regular posters, active members, in the C6 Z06 section, less still.
So 18 in here, is IMO too many. If you don't think so well then compare that number, 18, to the number of bone stock engine failure reports you see on other models across this forum. That 18 is going to probably win by a long shot. I know it will among C6 models.
Actually, it's 21. http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c6-z...etproof-7.html Probably the highest number of bone stock failures over that time frame, described on this board for any represented engine in here.
Last edited by '06 Quicksilver Z06; 09-04-2011 at 04:01 AM.
09-03-2011, 10:43 PM
#259
Burning Brakes
09-04-2011, 08:21 AM
#260
Team Owner
Well I think the number of Corvette forum members who have owned a Z06 might be higher than 1,000. See right now at this moment, there might only be a few hundred active Z owners but what about past members or members who stopped commenting here? If you are going to count Zs from 5-6 years ago, you have to count the past members from that time. So I would say, the total number of Zowners who have graced this forum since 06 is much higher than 1,000. But being conservative let's say it's 1,000 like you suggested. About 20 stock failures reported here comes out to be a 2% failure rate of the engine. So 1 out of every 50 built will drop a valve. So total failures of the 27,000 built with that failure rate comes out to be about 500! 500 blown Z06s out there. Hmmm I think the bus theory just went out the window lol
Last edited by jschindler; 09-04-2011 at 08:33 AM.