[ZR1] Zr1's on dealer lots
10-11-2008, 07:45 AM
#62
Burning Brakes
Attitudes are poor right now. I think more people wanted this car (ZR1) and thought they were going to get one. Until a combination of dealers deciding to increase the price & the economy as we know it today has slowed sales considerably. Can be very disappointing for people on both sides of the fence.
However, I completely understand the free market system and while there are people capable and willing to pay 25 or 50 over, the dealers would be foolish not to take the money, especially when they are having to give away most everything else on their lots.
Last edited by GlennSullivan; 10-11-2008 at 08:08 AM.
10-11-2008, 01:33 PM
#63
Pro
Regardless. You look at GM's stock price today ($7.50). Count dealers going out of business. Credit, what credit? People can't afford their homes let alone a car.
Originally, pre production, many speculated about whether the ZR1 would fetch this price or that price and clearly those who have an impulse control problem, can't manage their money and will soon have the car for sale, Ego's bigger than their cerebral cortex, and finally that rare bunch (which you see relatively few of buying Corvettes) those with enough money they are insulated from whatever occurs, paid significant premiums (which, like a shark feeding, creates a frenzy, especially in highly competitive areas like New York and Los Angeles).
Well, September separates the wheat from the shaft. Business will not be the same for the forseeable future (read years). All dealers will be glad to sell these cars at MSRP going forward (not necessarily at this moment today, but without a doubt by the end of the year).
This is not unique to Corvette, Ferrari sales people are doing the same thing just as real estate "experts" did before the world crashed on home owners.
Too many people have and are living on credit paying basically their interest while trying to maintain unrealistic lifestyles. Even if a reader is not such a person, your life cannot help but be affected. Those who offer credit cannot tell the difference between those who can and can't meet their obligations since underlying assets are in question.
I go through all this because those of us who are old enough and have experienced economic hardships, have (at least) a responsibility to warn those who have not. If you don't get it by now, you will have to wait until your credit card company voids your cards and you start living on "cash".
Go to cash and stay there for awhile.
At worst you lose relative to inflation. However, when the time comes, you are in the best position to buy and re deploy yourself. Buying a car is the last thing anyone needs to do at the moment and paying a premium is clearly (with all due respect to those who already have paid for their cars) , at the very least, as suspension of reality.
"illusion" has just collided with "reality".
It looks like a Socialistic President is going to be elected, seemingly because more of us want to be rescued than work for a living.
This means a re-distribution of wealth , not good for those who are ambitious and upward mobile.
Even if I am full of it, what do you have to lose being careful right now? Want to buy a ZR1just wait a month or two. There will be dealers calling you to relieve themselves of their inventory.
Best
Originally, pre production, many speculated about whether the ZR1 would fetch this price or that price and clearly those who have an impulse control problem, can't manage their money and will soon have the car for sale, Ego's bigger than their cerebral cortex, and finally that rare bunch (which you see relatively few of buying Corvettes) those with enough money they are insulated from whatever occurs, paid significant premiums (which, like a shark feeding, creates a frenzy, especially in highly competitive areas like New York and Los Angeles).
Well, September separates the wheat from the shaft. Business will not be the same for the forseeable future (read years). All dealers will be glad to sell these cars at MSRP going forward (not necessarily at this moment today, but without a doubt by the end of the year).
This is not unique to Corvette, Ferrari sales people are doing the same thing just as real estate "experts" did before the world crashed on home owners.
Too many people have and are living on credit paying basically their interest while trying to maintain unrealistic lifestyles. Even if a reader is not such a person, your life cannot help but be affected. Those who offer credit cannot tell the difference between those who can and can't meet their obligations since underlying assets are in question.
I go through all this because those of us who are old enough and have experienced economic hardships, have (at least) a responsibility to warn those who have not. If you don't get it by now, you will have to wait until your credit card company voids your cards and you start living on "cash".
Go to cash and stay there for awhile.
At worst you lose relative to inflation. However, when the time comes, you are in the best position to buy and re deploy yourself. Buying a car is the last thing anyone needs to do at the moment and paying a premium is clearly (with all due respect to those who already have paid for their cars) , at the very least, as suspension of reality.
"illusion" has just collided with "reality".
It looks like a Socialistic President is going to be elected, seemingly because more of us want to be rescued than work for a living.
This means a re-distribution of wealth , not good for those who are ambitious and upward mobile.
Even if I am full of it, what do you have to lose being careful right now? Want to buy a ZR1just wait a month or two. There will be dealers calling you to relieve themselves of their inventory.
Best
10-11-2008, 04:46 PM
#64
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Either that or he's spending too much time on the Blvd.
10-11-2008, 05:57 PM
#65
Burning Brakes
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I'm very (very) happy for the people who have purchased the ZR1 and at the same time I am also disapointed at the high dealer markups that prevent me from considering the car until they go away.
However, I completely understand the free market system and while there are people capable and willing to pay 25 or 50 over, the dealers would be foolish not to take the money, especially when they are having to give away most everything else on their lots.
However, I completely understand the free market system and while there are people capable and willing to pay 25 or 50 over, the dealers would be foolish not to take the money, especially when they are having to give away most everything else on their lots.
I agree with your statement 110% and I might add that I think everyone is disappointed with the high mark-ups, as I am certain, includes everyone that has already purchased one! 
The only person offering more for the car than was necessary is Mr Ressler 
, but for a good cause. 
10-11-2008, 06:40 PM
#66
Burning Brakes
i went onto the dealer i got my 07Z06 from for a 6 mos. telling them id buy one for sticker had the cash with me to buy it,, the dealer had it for 20k then 10k over then 5 then 2 and finally a call on dec 24 06 and i got it for 2k under!!! same thing im doing with the ZR1..... patience is a virtue it also saves BIG$$$$$
10-13-2008, 09:48 PM
#68
I can't disagree with your opinion but I will offer mine as well here. I believe that once we get past these first few months of introductory roll-out for the ZR1 and the high rollers are paying the big premiums to buy now, the remaining market for ZR1s will largely be current Z06 owners or even current coupe/vert owners who can afford more. I certainly fall into that category. I have owned as DDs for the past 8 years an 01Z and now 06Z (both bought early in the MY at MSRP) and I am looking forward to moving up to the ZR1 in a year or so. And I will be paying cash. I will be damned if I am going to pay market adjustment for a car that has no chance of maintaining that value. You only have to look at past GM history to know where the market price of this car is going. Someone else several months ago rather crudely stated that GM would *****-out (his words not mine) the ZR1 just like every other supposedly limited production car they have ever built collapsing the long term value. With economic conditions as they are now, I am beginning to think that $5k to $7k discount off MSRP for the ZR1 will be possible sometime in the future. There is simply too much differential $$ between the current market price of the Z06 and the ZR1 to be justified for the long term. JMHO. 
Last edited by 08msmZ06; 10-13-2008 at 10:02 PM.
10-13-2008, 10:18 PM
#69
Burning Brakes
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There was the same hysteria for the C6 Z when it first came out, and dealers in my area were getting $25K markups. I was patient and had my C5 Z to drive and enjoy while I waited for the market demand to drop. This past May I got a very good deal on a brand new 2LZ C6Z, and I couldn't be happier now. In two years time I'll be ready to move on, and by then the ZR1 will be priced right where it should have been all along: $85 - $90K.
10-14-2008, 08:47 AM
#71
Melting Slicks
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$85K is about right. Remember, this is NOT a new suspension layout, totally new body style, new frame, new interior, new dashboard, etc, etc.
They took the existing model, 'freshened' a couple of bolt-on pieces, added some kick-butt go-fast mechanical parts, bought the best brakes you can bolt on... and that's the package.
Claiming that amalgam is now worth ~ 3X more than the base model was always ridiculous, and when you add in the outrageous dealer premiums... well, it is insulting to me, frankly, although, PT Barnum's adage is in full bloom, for a short while.
Of course, I could be wrong and premiums could persist for months and years, and this could be a 'collector's item, etc.
America is great - choice is wonderful!
10-14-2008, 10:04 AM
#72
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Anti Enthusiast...right
10-14-2008, 02:18 PM
#73
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And it would get worse if the socialist wins. They are now saying they will increase taxes on those making over $250,00 per year. But a few months ago during the vp's acceptance speach, he said they would increase the taxes on only the top 5%, which starts at $128,000 per year as I recall. Nothing to say if they win, it will change to increase the tax on anyone who can afford a corvette.
I heard Biden say it was patriotic to pay more taxes and last night I heard a tape of Obama saying something to the effect he thought it was a good idea to spread the wealth around. I'm obviously way too old, as I remember when taking money from someone to whom it belonges and giving it to someone to whom it doesn't belong was call theft.
Back to dealers and the free market system.
10-14-2008, 03:03 PM
#74
Le Mans Master
Spot on, as usual. I would just add a continuation of the re-distribtion of wealth. For the few that might not know, for the last few years, the top 50% of taxpayers pay 97% of the taxes leaving the bottom 50% of taxpayers to pay 3% of the taxes. Or said another way, the top 50% of the tax payers pay over 32 times what the bottom half pay. And FWIW, the point between the two halves is a little under $28,400 as I recall.
And it would get worse if the socialist wins. They are now saying they will increase taxes on those making over $250,00 per year. But a few months ago during the vp's acceptance speach, he said they would increase the taxes on only the top 5%, which starts at $128,000 per year as I recall. Nothing to say if they win, it will change to increase the tax on anyone who can afford a corvette.
I heard Biden say it was patriotic to pay more taxes and last night I heard a tape of Obama saying something to the effect he thought it was a good idea to spread the wealth around. I'm obviously way too old, as I remember when taking money from someone to whom it belonges and giving it to someone to whom it doesn't belong was call theft.
Back to dealers and the free market system.
And it would get worse if the socialist wins. They are now saying they will increase taxes on those making over $250,00 per year. But a few months ago during the vp's acceptance speach, he said they would increase the taxes on only the top 5%, which starts at $128,000 per year as I recall. Nothing to say if they win, it will change to increase the tax on anyone who can afford a corvette.
I heard Biden say it was patriotic to pay more taxes and last night I heard a tape of Obama saying something to the effect he thought it was a good idea to spread the wealth around. I'm obviously way too old, as I remember when taking money from someone to whom it belonges and giving it to someone to whom it doesn't belong was call theft.
Back to dealers and the free market system.
10-14-2008, 10:04 PM
#75
Drifting
"illusion" has just collided with "reality".
It looks like a Socialistic President is going to be elected, seemingly because more of us want to be rescued than work for a living.
This means a re-distribution of wealth , not good for those who are ambitious and upward mobile.
Best
It looks like a Socialistic President is going to be elected, seemingly because more of us want to be rescued than work for a living.
This means a re-distribution of wealth , not good for those who are ambitious and upward mobile.
Best
My sentiments exactly!
