Mild 2 Wild Getting Blamed for Computor Failures
10-18-2013, 04:24 PM
#21
Le Mans Master
Thank you for your response Hameister. I did have the M2W connected to the correct screw as per instructions. I had no idea that it could cause issues grounding to this screw if the unit were to fail. If I had, I wouldn't have put it on my car. However, since the first time it went in, this didn't even come up as an issue, I really feel that the dealer has no idea what is going on and this looks like an easy out for them. They called GM and GM told them that 6 other corvettes had had this exact issue and told them it was caused by static electricty and to rerun some wires. When they did, after they replaced the bad parts, the car ran fine for 14 miles and they told me to come get it. When I did, I got about a quarter of a mile from the dealer and the same thing happened as before, times 10. Warnings and lights I had never even seen before came on. This is why I feel like the orginal problem wasn't with the M2W. I think the orginal problem shorted out the M2W the second time around along with the other componets again. I may be totally off base, but I really feel like this is what is going on. I am looking for a wiring diagram if anyone has one.
10-18-2013, 04:26 PM
#22
They haven't said that they weren't going to cover it, but that is the feeling I'm getting when talking to them. I am actually friends with the salesman that sold the car to me and I asked her if they were going to try and get out of the warranty work because they want to blame the M2W and she said that they haven't mentioned it. I really hope that this doesn't become the issue. When I talked to the service manager, first he was saying that it was grounded directly to the BCM and that 3 fuses were missing. When I argued that it wasn't wired directly to the BCM and that the M2W only replaced one fuse, and if that were the case, then it had happened at the dealer. Then he put me on hold and came back and stated that I was correct. That the box was covering up the two other fuses. And that the screw it was grounded to was just a screw to hold the fuse box on, but the M2W was still the problem. I am clueless as to how electronics work, so I am at his mercy as far as defending myself.
10-18-2013, 04:34 PM
#24
They did and put in a new fuse in place of the M2W. They said they could talk to the car now, so it had to be the issue. However, the first time they had it which was last week, they could talk to the car, so if the M2W was the culprit, wouldn't it have been the issue last week too? They said they could plug the M2W back in and everything went south again. When they put the new fuse back in, they could talk with the car again. But the failed componets still have to be replaced. I really think that whatever is shorting out my car also shorted out the M2W the second time around and that's why they couldn't talk to my car the second time, but could the first. But, what I think will have no bearing on the outcome I'm sure.
10-18-2013, 04:48 PM
#25
Race Director
Only point I stress is instead of giving yourself an ulcer over what might happen, why not see what does happen?
Might just be a lot to do about nothing.
*OTOH IF they DO decide to jerk you around, report back linking to this thread. There's a time for war & frankly you don't need to go into battle, yet.
10-18-2013, 05:06 PM
#26
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St. Jude Donor '13-'14-'15-'16-'17-'18-'19-'20-'21-'22-'23-'24
As far as I know the mild to wild is nothing more than a remote controlled switch. It is either on or off allowing current to flow through the relocated fuse. I would not think this would cause the problems you are experiencing. Fort Morgan Al is the resident electronic expert and I'll see if I can link him up with this post.
10-18-2013, 05:12 PM
#27
As far as I know the mild to wild is nothing more than a remote controlled switch. It is either on or off allowing current to flow through the relocated fuse. I would not think this would cause the problems you are experiencing. Fort Morgan Al is the resident electronic expert and I'll see if I can link him up with this post.
10-18-2013, 05:18 PM
#28
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10-18-2013, 05:20 PM
#29
I'd probably be suspicious too, my friend.
Only point I stress is instead of giving yourself an ulcer over what might happen, why not see what does happen?
I've M2W & Dashtronics installed on my Z06, leave 'em in when car's serviced. Even my country hick dealer would know better than even try this kind of stunt, nevermind I was an EE. Most people are clueless when it comes to our car's systems, you're hardly an exception. I repeat: see what they say -- probably Monday and try not letting this ruin your weekend.
Might just be a lot to do about nothing.
*OTOH IF they DO decide to jerk you around, report back linking to this thread. There's a time for war & frankly you don't need to go into battle, yet.
Only point I stress is instead of giving yourself an ulcer over what might happen, why not see what does happen?
I've M2W & Dashtronics installed on my Z06, leave 'em in when car's serviced. Even my country hick dealer would know better than even try this kind of stunt, nevermind I was an EE. Most people are clueless when it comes to our car's systems, you're hardly an exception. I repeat: see what they say -- probably Monday and try not letting this ruin your weekend.
Might just be a lot to do about nothing.
*OTOH IF they DO decide to jerk you around, report back linking to this thread. There's a time for war & frankly you don't need to go into battle, yet.
Last edited by pscott; 10-18-2013 at 07:42 PM.
10-18-2013, 05:21 PM
#30
10-18-2013, 05:53 PM
#31
Team Owner
mtw is nothing more than a relay operated by a radio signal. its unlikely that it created a static charge that would mess with your electronics.
Some things I would be checking are communications between the control modules, loose terminals, and ground connections for starters. With electronics, you typically want a ground in one location to prevent potential ground issues. It should be tight. A loose wire will cause havoc.
As mentioned, to work on nearly anything anymore, its a two discipline event, a wrench turner and a computer guy. not every wrench turned has the drive and ambition, or training to be the computer guy.
Some things I would be checking are communications between the control modules, loose terminals, and ground connections for starters. With electronics, you typically want a ground in one location to prevent potential ground issues. It should be tight. A loose wire will cause havoc.
As mentioned, to work on nearly anything anymore, its a two discipline event, a wrench turner and a computer guy. not every wrench turned has the drive and ambition, or training to be the computer guy.
/ Hoping for a positive outcome
10-18-2013, 07:52 PM
#34
[QUOTE=flange;1585209822]
Some things I would be checking are communications between the control modules, loose terminals, and ground connections for starters. With electronics, you typically want a ground in one location to prevent potential ground issues. It should be tight. A loose wire will cause havoc.QUOTE]
Hopefully the dealer has done all the basics....and I believe they have. Several people have been trying to figure it out. I am going to wait until I find out how things are going to go before I worry about it any more. But if any of you have heard of this before or have had something similar, please let me know. I'm sure it will be Monday at the earliest before I hear anything.
Some things I would be checking are communications between the control modules, loose terminals, and ground connections for starters. With electronics, you typically want a ground in one location to prevent potential ground issues. It should be tight. A loose wire will cause havoc.QUOTE]
Hopefully the dealer has done all the basics....and I believe they have. Several people have been trying to figure it out. I am going to wait until I find out how things are going to go before I worry about it any more. But if any of you have heard of this before or have had something similar, please let me know. I'm sure it will be Monday at the earliest before I hear anything.
10-18-2013, 08:02 PM
#35
I had a similar problem recently with my 2005 C6.
I didn't have TPMS front sensor issues, but the engine died on the highway.
It turned out to be a defective Powertrain Control Module.
After replacing the module (actually it was replaced twice because the first replacement module GM sent was defective) the car has run as before the issue. No NPP in '05, so no Mild2Wild.
I didn't have TPMS front sensor issues, but the engine died on the highway.
It turned out to be a defective Powertrain Control Module.
After replacing the module (actually it was replaced twice because the first replacement module GM sent was defective) the car has run as before the issue. No NPP in '05, so no Mild2Wild.
10-18-2013, 08:22 PM
#36
Safety Car
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I had a similar problem recently with my 2005 C6.
I didn't have TPMS front sensor issues, but the engine died on the highway.
It turned out to be a defective Powertrain Control Module.
After replacing the module (actually it was replaced twice because the first replacement module GM sent was defective) the car has run as before the issue. No NPP in '05, so no Mild2Wild.
I didn't have TPMS front sensor issues, but the engine died on the highway.
It turned out to be a defective Powertrain Control Module.
After replacing the module (actually it was replaced twice because the first replacement module GM sent was defective) the car has run as before the issue. No NPP in '05, so no Mild2Wild.
10-18-2013, 08:24 PM
#37
Drifting
Since I can't remember who originally introduced the Mild to Wild controller, I'm waiting to see what Peter C. @ www.topflightrepro.com has to add to this thread.
10-19-2013, 08:39 AM
#38
Le Mans Master
Got the pipe and it's in. Yep. name comes from the name that used to come up on caller ID when I would call anyone with my cellphone. But, as Paul Simon said, you can call me Al. As far as "resident electronic expert", there are others who know a lot more than I do but I guess they aren't as opinionated.
OK, to the issue. First I don't have a bi-mode exhaust or M2W but I do have the schematic for how the Z06 bi-mode works which is, I assume, the same as the NPP. In my manual set it is page 9-757. I believe that Den is correct that M2W is just a remote control relay that provides power to the Exhaust Tail Pipe Flow Valve Control Module. When the ETPFVCM has power it works normally and when it doesn't it can't provide power to the solenoid and the solenoid won't provide vacuum to close the valves. When the ETPFVCM is functioning normally it communicates with the ECM (PCM) through the data bus. When not powered it should not affect the data communications to other modules on the data bus. BUT - if the ETPFVCM fails it COULD cause an issue on the data bus which COULD cause a lot of different seemingly unrelated issues. A shorted data bus could also make it appear that the BCM was bad. So MAYBE the ETPFVCM is intermittently shorting the data bus and the second time it pulled enough power to blow the fuse in the M2W and is now a solid short. Maybe?
Question, does the NPP work normally now without the M2W? Or are they saying the second BCM is bad and they haven't replaced it yet. If the latter, I would try disconnecting the ETPFVCM and see if the BCM looks good again. In any case, I don't see how the M2W can be the root cause since it only supplies power to the ETPFVCM that would be there all the time normally unless it is somehow involved in destroying the ETPFVCM by quickly "sparking" it with power and no power and then power...
On the other hand, maybe the M2W has nothing to do with an intermittent, is just coincidentally involved, and is a red herring. Just my first thoughts. Feel free to PM me.
10-19-2013, 09:36 AM
#39
If the W2M is wired correctly, has a fuse (not over sized ) and the W2M has a short then the fuse will blow. It will affect nothing else. If I ground a wire out on a circuit the fuse blows or the wire melts if the wire is undersized or the correctly sized fuse "melts"
What the dealer said makes no sense if you are fused correctly.
As far as the ground placement goes, as long as it is grounded the cuircut uses this path. If it is not grounded it has no path and does nothing. If the ground is tied into a source that is not the same as the incomming source then yes you could have a problem. If the source and ground are tied to the same source then nothing happens due to the lack of potential.
Hope this helps.
What the dealer said makes no sense if you are fused correctly.
As far as the ground placement goes, as long as it is grounded the cuircut uses this path. If it is not grounded it has no path and does nothing. If the ground is tied into a source that is not the same as the incomming source then yes you could have a problem. If the source and ground are tied to the same source then nothing happens due to the lack of potential.
Hope this helps.
