Who would buy a Ferrari if they had more HORSEPOWER? (PIC's/Video)
02-21-2011, 07:16 PM
#61
Burning Brakes
Little misinformation there. That would be for the F1 transmission clutch pump and everything, not the manual, plus that price is a few grand too high. If you want a 360, get one that has been recently serviced and get a manual, you won't have any high service charges except for oil changes ($250 bucks) for years. It is this misinformation that is misleading a lot of people, their loss I guess.
In the spring you should post a sound track of your 430 going thru the gears
02-21-2011, 07:23 PM
#62
Team Owner
Was an F1 and price was from a Ferrari dealer- Your right- manual is more fun to drive too. Last 3 cars were AMG's and i think i just got board with the auto- I think their new dual clutch is much better and faster.
In the spring you should post a sound track of your 430 going thru the gears
In the spring you should post a sound track of your 430 going thru the gears
I am going to get some good videos this year but I do have this ONE from last year, not the best but better than nothing.
02-21-2011, 07:30 PM
#63
Burning Brakes
02-21-2011, 07:39 PM
#65
Race Director
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A lot of people here are missing the point. People that buy Enzo's don't care about a $20k tune up. Just the the Bugatti owners don't care that the tires are $20k and after 3 sets of tires you have to replace the $70k rims. When you are that rich it really doesn't matter. The ZR1 is a great bang for the buck but GM did use a SC. Ferrari's don't use the larger displacement or FI to get their HP numbers. The reason service costs are so expensive are because of the extreme engineering and there are very few qualified people to work on them. And people on here gripe about a "Corvette Tax". 
02-21-2011, 07:41 PM
#66
Drifting
I'd trade my '07 coupe for a '49 166MM Barchetta even if the wimpy 150HP 12-banger were missing.
http://www.google.com/images?q=1949+...w=1076&bih=506
http://www.google.com/images?q=1949+...w=1076&bih=506
02-21-2011, 09:03 PM
#71
Team Owner
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When the Enzo was introduced, that car became my all time favorite dream car and still is. I will never be able to afford one, but if I could HP would mean very little.
02-21-2011, 09:10 PM
#72
Drifting
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02-21-2011, 09:38 PM
#73
The Consigliere
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Of the numerous long arms that I own, one of my favorites is my Beretta EELL (double E, double L) Gold Pigeon Superposed with full side plates, beautiful engraving and hand rubbed oil finish.
It is possible, but unlikely that during my lifetime I will manage to shoot that gun loose (and since it's the gun I shoot competitive sporting clays with, it sees a lot of rounds through it). It is more likely (tho not guaranteed by any means) that if passed down to one of my children after I die that they might manage to shoot it loose, thus necessitating its first rebuild.
THAT folks is world class engineering.
I love Ferraris. Love how they look - inside and out. Love how they sound. Love how they perform. Like many, I've thought to myself about a low mile used one. . . but then the ridiculous maintenance reality pops into my mind and that's the last of that fantasy for a while.
I simply don't have the patience for a machine that requires frequent, and persistent, major (read costly) service just in order for it to operate, let alone perform above 7/10ths of its design parameters or otherwise be pushed hard. Those service intervals fall at mileage intervals whether you've putt-putted the thing to and from work or leaned on it harder from time to time.
In this world of ever-increasing performance, durability and global competition, I wonder how long it will be before the notion of world class engineering will require Ferrari to build cars with more rational maintenance interval capabilities. As the speed of competition continues to increase, I have to believe such change will come to that market, notwithstanding the well-heeled stature (indeed perhaps because of it) of that client base.
It is possible, but unlikely that during my lifetime I will manage to shoot that gun loose (and since it's the gun I shoot competitive sporting clays with, it sees a lot of rounds through it). It is more likely (tho not guaranteed by any means) that if passed down to one of my children after I die that they might manage to shoot it loose, thus necessitating its first rebuild.
THAT folks is world class engineering.
I love Ferraris. Love how they look - inside and out. Love how they sound. Love how they perform. Like many, I've thought to myself about a low mile used one. . . but then the ridiculous maintenance reality pops into my mind and that's the last of that fantasy for a while.
I simply don't have the patience for a machine that requires frequent, and persistent, major (read costly) service just in order for it to operate, let alone perform above 7/10ths of its design parameters or otherwise be pushed hard. Those service intervals fall at mileage intervals whether you've putt-putted the thing to and from work or leaned on it harder from time to time.
In this world of ever-increasing performance, durability and global competition, I wonder how long it will be before the notion of world class engineering will require Ferrari to build cars with more rational maintenance interval capabilities. As the speed of competition continues to increase, I have to believe such change will come to that market, notwithstanding the well-heeled stature (indeed perhaps because of it) of that client base.
02-21-2011, 10:07 PM
#74
Burning Brakes
I simply don't have the patience for a machine that requires frequent, and persistent, major (read costly) service just in order for it to operate, let alone perform above 7/10ths of its design parameters or otherwise be pushed hard. Those service intervals fall at mileage intervals whether you've putt-putted the thing to and from work or leaned on it harder from time to time.
02-21-2011, 11:51 PM
#75
Drifting
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I do not consider any of the exotics due to the maintenance cost. I could afford one but choose to get three Corvettes, a Viper and a MX-5. I did have a S2000 and a RX-7 but got rid of them because of room limitations so I could add 5 motorcycles.
Annual maintenance cost on all 10 toys is under $500 because I do all of the services. Hooray for push rod motors.
Annual maintenance cost on all 10 toys is under $500 because I do all of the services. Hooray for push rod motors.
02-22-2011, 12:56 AM
#76
Team Owner
I do not consider any of the exotics due to the maintenance cost. I could afford one but choose to get three Corvettes, a Viper and a MX-5. I did have a S2000 and a RX-7 but got rid of them because of room limitations so I could add 5 motorcycles.
Annual maintenance cost on all 10 toys is under $500 because I do all of the services. Hooray for push rod motors.
Annual maintenance cost on all 10 toys is under $500 because I do all of the services. Hooray for push rod motors.
, and then you die and your kids will waste your money on cocaine and hookers
02-22-2011, 01:11 AM
#77
Instructor
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Well then you will miss out on owning one of the greatest cars ever, no biggie, I am just so glad I don't think like you as I have been cruising and loving my F-cars for two years now and my costs have been less than $1000. And when it comes time for it's "so called" big service, I will pay it and enjoy the car for another couple of years etc. Your thinking is just like saying I should go to Paris, I can afford the flight but it is so expensive when you get there. Hey, stay in your little town, drive your Hondas and Mazdas and your 3 Corvettes , and then you die and your kids will waste your money on cocaine and hookers
, and then you die and your kids will waste your money on cocaine and hookers I guess that whole thing about Ferrari's being about class doesn't transcend to their drivers.
02-22-2011, 01:16 AM
#78
Team Owner
02-22-2011, 01:25 AM
#79
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02-22-2011, 01:46 AM
#80
Le Mans Master
most people don't buy a Ferrari because of horsepower, lap times, 1/4 mile times, etc.....if that's your concern Racer is correct in that you would probably be disappointed....To me owning a Ferrari is a dream that I will probably make reality in a year or two with a used F430.....I couldn't care less what the horsepower is or how fast it gets to 60....It's a Ferrari and there is nothing else that sounds or looks like it.....
Make no mistake, I like Ferraris. I spent several years selling them brokering a few and inspecting them for potential buyers. I have thousands of miles behind the wheel of any number of the different models (though I admit that most of this was during the pre 348 era)
I never really wanted to own one. Oh, there were a couple of times when something would come up that seemed to good to pass up, but they weren't the right car for me.
Why, well, in a nutshell, they really weren't built to drive in this country. The steering is heavy, the maintenance cost is atrocious, and other than the cachet that goes along with the name, they really aren't fun to drive.
Other than the occasional good buy on an old 308/328 series, I submit that most people who buy a modern (Modern-Era) Ferrari actually have enough money to buy just about any other vehicle they want. In my mind, that's really important.
If you want an idea of what i'm getting at, subscribe to Michael Sheehans' Ferrari sales newsletter http://www.ferraris-online.com/ or at least review some of the offerings. Don't get all caught up in the colors, low mileage, etc. Take note of the $10,000 "major" Services. Consider the attractive price on a used one vis-a-vis the original MSRP.
Case in point: Some years ago I assisted a close friend who had just sold his basket-case 250GTE in buying a rather nice '78 308 GTS. It wasn't perfect, but it ran well and had no real issues. We had a wonderful trip back to Seattle from San Jose and other than a small leak in the fuel delivery hose, the car performed flawlessly. It was great fun on I-5, it caused me to have a gout attack in my left foot while trying to drive it through San Francisco traffic.
A year or two later, my friend asked me to join him in taking the 308 to Monterey for the Historic races (featuring Ferrari) and to the earlier National Ferrari meeting. He wanted the car to look nice and so had the wheels refinished, bought a set of new tires, had a complete major service and, $9000 later, we were ready to go. And we did. Another great trip, so long as we stuck to the freeways.
the little Ferrari really looked good and was relatively rare in appearance with its gleaming silver paint. Unfortunately the car got little attention among the hundreds of other Ferraris in Monterey that week. When it came to pride of place parking in any event that week, we were usually relegated to the back lots, the dirt lots and other out-of the way spots, along with the Testarossas and 456's and 348s. Although the analogy may no longer apply, it was like showing up for the Porsche Parade in a clapped out 914 or a 924 with plaid seats.
I know i'm rambling on here, but the point I guess i'm trying to make is there are any number of reasons for buying a Ferrari, but recognize there are Ferraris and there are Ferraris. If you want to buy one as an investment, the Enzo-era cars are the ones to look for - provided you have a million or more to spend. Even a relatively common 365 GTB/4 Daytona will easily set you back the price of a couple of brand new ZR-1 Corvettes. This is not to mention what it will likely cost you to maintain it. Garage Queens often require more attention than the well driven examples. Things like belt changes are based as much on age as mileage.
Please understand I am not trying to discourage anyone from buying a Ferrari. They are magnificent cars, but just make sure you factor in the cost of ownership before you set off on that journey.
As for me: well maybe i'm simply getting too old, but give me a 901-series Porsche 911 ('65-'89) or a C6 Corvette and I'll be perfectly content to deal with the occasional oil change and major services that cost less than $1000 and just drive any where I want to go with little or no complications.
As for Ferraris, well, to paraphrase Ferris Bueller, "If you have the means, I highly recommend it" Just understand the cost of acquisition is just the entrance to a potentially expensive experience.