Nightmare: private party purchase
05-14-2010, 07:16 PM
#42
Who gave you the information on temp tags? Twice I have purchased vehicles and with a bill of sale and proof of insurance walked into the tag office, paid $10.00 and got a 30 day temp tag. Unless things have changed in the past 12 months that's the way it works.
05-14-2010, 07:21 PM
#43
Race Director
Like others have said...BILL of sale is all you need and proof of insurance and in some states pay your property tax if getting a new tag...
Title should not be needed up front...
Title should not be needed up front...
05-14-2010, 07:22 PM
#44
Instructor
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Heres the Law
320.131 Temporary tags.--
(1) The department is authorized and empowered to design, issue, and regulate the use of temporary tags to be designated "temporary tags" for use in the following cases:
(a) Where a dealer license plate may not be lawfully used.
(b) For a casual or private sale, including the sale of a marine boat trailer by a marine boat trailer dealer. A "casual or private sale" means any sale other than that by a licensed dealer.
(c) For certified common carriers or driveaway companies who transport motor vehicles, mobile homes, or recreational vehicles from one place to another for persons other than themselves.
(d) For banks, credit unions, and other financial institutions which are not required to be licensed under the provisions of s. 320.27, s. 320.77, or s. 320.771, but need temporary tags for the purpose of demonstrating repossessions for sale.
(e) Where a motor vehicle is sold in this state to a resident of another state for registration therein and the motor vehicle is not required to be registered under the provisions of s. 320.38.
(f) Where a motor vehicle is required to be weighed or emission tested prior to registration or have a vehicle identification number verified. A temporary tag issued for any of these purposes shall be valid for 10 days.
(g) Where an out-of-state resident, subject to registration in this state, must secure ownership documentation from the home state.
(h) For a rental car company which possesses a motor vehicle dealer license and which may use temporary tags on vehicles offered for lease by such company in accordance with the provisions of rules established by the department. However, the original issuance date of a temporary tag shall be the date which determines the applicable license plate fee.
(i) In the resolution of a consumer complaint where there is a need to issue more than two temporary tags, the department may do so.
(j) While a personalized prestige or specialty license plate is being manufactured for use upon the motor vehicle. A temporary tag issued for this purpose shall be valid for 90 days.
(k) In any case where a permanent license plate cannot legally be issued to an applicant and a temporary license plate is not specifically authorized under the provisions of this section, the department shall have the discretion to issue or authorize agents or Florida licensed dealers to issue temporary license plates to applicants demonstrating a need for such temporary use.
(l) For use by licensed dealers to transport motor vehicles and recreational vehicles from the dealer's licensed location to an off-premise sales location and return. Temporary tags used for such purposes shall be issued to the licensed dealer who owns the vehicles.
(m) For a retail sale by a licensed independent motor vehicle dealer when an application for the transfer of a registration license plate is being processed. This paragraph is repealed June 30, 2010.
Further, the department is authorized to disallow the purchase of temporary tags by licensed dealers, common carriers, or financial institutions in those cases where abuse has occurred.
(2) The department is authorized to sell temporary tags, in addition to those listed above, to their agents and where need is demonstrated by a consumer complainant. The fee shall be $2 each. One dollar from each tag sold shall be deposited into the Brain and Spinal Cord Injury Rehabilitation Trust Fund, with the remaining proceeds being deposited into the Highway Safety Operating Trust Fund. Agents of the department shall sell temporary tags for $2 each and shall charge the service charge authorized by s. 320.04 per transaction, regardless of the quantity sold. Requests for purchase of temporary tags to the department or its agents shall be made, where applicable, on letterhead stationery and notarized. Except as specifically provided otherwise, a temporary tag shall be valid for 30 days, and no more than two shall be issued to the same person for the same vehicle.
(3) Any person or corporation who unlawfully issues or uses a temporary tag or violates this section or any rule adopted by the department to implement this section is guilty of a misdemeanor of the second degree punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083 in addition to other administrative action by the department, except that using a temporary tag that has been expired for a period of 7 days or less is a noncriminal infraction, and is a nonmoving violation punishable as provided for in chapter 318.
(4)(a) Temporary tags shall be conspicuously displayed in the rear license plate bracket or, on vehicles requiring front display of license plates, on the front of the vehicle in the location where the metal license plate would normally be displayed.
(b) The department shall designate specifications for the media upon which the temporary tag is printed. Such media shall be either nonpermeable or subject to weatherproofing so that it maintains its structural integrity, including graphic and data adhesion, in all weather conditions after being placed on a vehicle.
(5) Any person who knowingly and willfully abuses or misuses temporary tag issuance to avoid registering a vehicle requiring registration pursuant to this chapter or chapter 319 commits a misdemeanor of the first degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083.
(6) Any person who knowingly and willfully issues a temporary tag or causes another to issue a temporary tag to a fictitious person or entity to avoid disclosure of the true owner of a vehicle commits a felony of the third degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082, s. 775.083, or s. 775.084.
(7) Any person authorized by this section to purchase and issue a temporary tag shall maintain records as required by this chapter or departmental rules, and such records shall be open to inspection by the department or its agents during reasonable business hours. Any person who knowingly and willfully fails to comply with this subsection commits a misdemeanor of the second degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083.
(8) The department shall administer an electronic system for licensed motor vehicle dealers to use for issuing temporary tags. If a dealer fails to comply with the department's requirements for issuing temporary tags using the electronic system, the department may deny, suspend, or revoke a license under s. 320.27(9)(b)16. upon proof that the licensee has failed to comply with the department's requirements. The department may adopt rules to administer this section.
(9)(a) The department shall implement a secure print-on-demand electronic temporary tag registration, record retention, and issue system required for use by every department-authorized issuer of temporary tags by the end of the 2007-2008 fiscal year. Such system shall enable the department to issue, on demand, a temporary tag number in response to a request from the issuer by way of a secure electronic exchange of data and then enable the issuer to print the temporary tag 1that has all required information. A motor vehicle dealer licensed under this chapter 2may charge a fee to comply with this subsection.
(b) To ensure the continuation of operations for issuers if a system outage occurs, the department shall allow the limited use of a backup manual issuance method during an outage which requires recordkeeping of information as determined by the department and which requires the timely electronic reporting of this information to the department.
(c) The department may adopt rules necessary to 3administer this subsection. Such rules may include exemptions from the requirements of this subsection as feasibly required to 3administer the program, as well as exemptions for issuers who do not require a dealer license under this chapter because of the type or size of vehicle being sold.
(1) The department is authorized and empowered to design, issue, and regulate the use of temporary tags to be designated "temporary tags" for use in the following cases:
(a) Where a dealer license plate may not be lawfully used.
(b) For a casual or private sale, including the sale of a marine boat trailer by a marine boat trailer dealer. A "casual or private sale" means any sale other than that by a licensed dealer.
(c) For certified common carriers or driveaway companies who transport motor vehicles, mobile homes, or recreational vehicles from one place to another for persons other than themselves.
(d) For banks, credit unions, and other financial institutions which are not required to be licensed under the provisions of s. 320.27, s. 320.77, or s. 320.771, but need temporary tags for the purpose of demonstrating repossessions for sale.
(e) Where a motor vehicle is sold in this state to a resident of another state for registration therein and the motor vehicle is not required to be registered under the provisions of s. 320.38.
(f) Where a motor vehicle is required to be weighed or emission tested prior to registration or have a vehicle identification number verified. A temporary tag issued for any of these purposes shall be valid for 10 days.
(g) Where an out-of-state resident, subject to registration in this state, must secure ownership documentation from the home state.
(h) For a rental car company which possesses a motor vehicle dealer license and which may use temporary tags on vehicles offered for lease by such company in accordance with the provisions of rules established by the department. However, the original issuance date of a temporary tag shall be the date which determines the applicable license plate fee.
(i) In the resolution of a consumer complaint where there is a need to issue more than two temporary tags, the department may do so.
(j) While a personalized prestige or specialty license plate is being manufactured for use upon the motor vehicle. A temporary tag issued for this purpose shall be valid for 90 days.
(k) In any case where a permanent license plate cannot legally be issued to an applicant and a temporary license plate is not specifically authorized under the provisions of this section, the department shall have the discretion to issue or authorize agents or Florida licensed dealers to issue temporary license plates to applicants demonstrating a need for such temporary use.
(l) For use by licensed dealers to transport motor vehicles and recreational vehicles from the dealer's licensed location to an off-premise sales location and return. Temporary tags used for such purposes shall be issued to the licensed dealer who owns the vehicles.
(m) For a retail sale by a licensed independent motor vehicle dealer when an application for the transfer of a registration license plate is being processed. This paragraph is repealed June 30, 2010.
Further, the department is authorized to disallow the purchase of temporary tags by licensed dealers, common carriers, or financial institutions in those cases where abuse has occurred.
(2) The department is authorized to sell temporary tags, in addition to those listed above, to their agents and where need is demonstrated by a consumer complainant. The fee shall be $2 each. One dollar from each tag sold shall be deposited into the Brain and Spinal Cord Injury Rehabilitation Trust Fund, with the remaining proceeds being deposited into the Highway Safety Operating Trust Fund. Agents of the department shall sell temporary tags for $2 each and shall charge the service charge authorized by s. 320.04 per transaction, regardless of the quantity sold. Requests for purchase of temporary tags to the department or its agents shall be made, where applicable, on letterhead stationery and notarized. Except as specifically provided otherwise, a temporary tag shall be valid for 30 days, and no more than two shall be issued to the same person for the same vehicle.
(3) Any person or corporation who unlawfully issues or uses a temporary tag or violates this section or any rule adopted by the department to implement this section is guilty of a misdemeanor of the second degree punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083 in addition to other administrative action by the department, except that using a temporary tag that has been expired for a period of 7 days or less is a noncriminal infraction, and is a nonmoving violation punishable as provided for in chapter 318.
(4)(a) Temporary tags shall be conspicuously displayed in the rear license plate bracket or, on vehicles requiring front display of license plates, on the front of the vehicle in the location where the metal license plate would normally be displayed.
(b) The department shall designate specifications for the media upon which the temporary tag is printed. Such media shall be either nonpermeable or subject to weatherproofing so that it maintains its structural integrity, including graphic and data adhesion, in all weather conditions after being placed on a vehicle.
(5) Any person who knowingly and willfully abuses or misuses temporary tag issuance to avoid registering a vehicle requiring registration pursuant to this chapter or chapter 319 commits a misdemeanor of the first degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083.
(6) Any person who knowingly and willfully issues a temporary tag or causes another to issue a temporary tag to a fictitious person or entity to avoid disclosure of the true owner of a vehicle commits a felony of the third degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082, s. 775.083, or s. 775.084.
(7) Any person authorized by this section to purchase and issue a temporary tag shall maintain records as required by this chapter or departmental rules, and such records shall be open to inspection by the department or its agents during reasonable business hours. Any person who knowingly and willfully fails to comply with this subsection commits a misdemeanor of the second degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083.
(8) The department shall administer an electronic system for licensed motor vehicle dealers to use for issuing temporary tags. If a dealer fails to comply with the department's requirements for issuing temporary tags using the electronic system, the department may deny, suspend, or revoke a license under s. 320.27(9)(b)16. upon proof that the licensee has failed to comply with the department's requirements. The department may adopt rules to administer this section.
(9)(a) The department shall implement a secure print-on-demand electronic temporary tag registration, record retention, and issue system required for use by every department-authorized issuer of temporary tags by the end of the 2007-2008 fiscal year. Such system shall enable the department to issue, on demand, a temporary tag number in response to a request from the issuer by way of a secure electronic exchange of data and then enable the issuer to print the temporary tag 1that has all required information. A motor vehicle dealer licensed under this chapter 2may charge a fee to comply with this subsection.
(b) To ensure the continuation of operations for issuers if a system outage occurs, the department shall allow the limited use of a backup manual issuance method during an outage which requires recordkeeping of information as determined by the department and which requires the timely electronic reporting of this information to the department.
(c) The department may adopt rules necessary to 3administer this subsection. Such rules may include exemptions from the requirements of this subsection as feasibly required to 3administer the program, as well as exemptions for issuers who do not require a dealer license under this chapter because of the type or size of vehicle being sold.
05-14-2010, 07:24 PM
#45
Wow, this thread is nuts. You could have just went to the DMV and would have gotten an easy answer. Most likely "bring us proof of insurance and xxx document (no title needed) and we'll give you a temp tag"
I've bought and sold many vehicles through private party purchases and it's as easy as that in just about every state.
Dealers do not have any advantage over private parties in selling cars. Temp tag registration works about the same for both, with the exception that dealers typically have temp tags on hand and can mail the registration papers to the dmv later.
In most states, you can drive around without a tag as long as you have the bill of sale, proof in insurance, and a good excuse (I just bought it). They're not going to impound your car unless it has been reported as stolen.
I've bought and sold many vehicles through private party purchases and it's as easy as that in just about every state.
Dealers do not have any advantage over private parties in selling cars. Temp tag registration works about the same for both, with the exception that dealers typically have temp tags on hand and can mail the registration papers to the dmv later.
In most states, you can drive around without a tag as long as you have the bill of sale, proof in insurance, and a good excuse (I just bought it). They're not going to impound your car unless it has been reported as stolen.
05-14-2010, 08:46 PM
#46
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When I bought my Corvette 2 months ago from an individual in NJ, the title was with his bank. I gave him the check, picked the car up, got it insured and drove straight to VA on his license plates. I also took his registration card with me and had the bill of sale in the glove box. It took 3 weeks for the title to be released and for him to mail it to me. Was this illegal? Maybe, but I knew I wasn't doing anything immoral. Was it risky to buy a such a car? Probably but I didn't research such a scenario and it's all in the past now anyway 
05-14-2010, 09:36 PM
#47
Burning Brakes
Last time I sold a car that was financed I called my bank and told them i would be wire transferring the funds in that day to overnight the title to me once the wire transfer was complete.
Went to the buyers bank with his check, had them wire transfer the money and I had the title in hand 2 days later. I did let him keep my plates on the car for about a week while he got it titled into his name though.
Went to the buyers bank with his check, had them wire transfer the money and I had the title in hand 2 days later. I did let him keep my plates on the car for about a week while he got it titled into his name though.
05-14-2010, 09:39 PM
#48
Team Owner
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St. Jude Donor '15
"In honor of jpee"
Wow, this thread is nuts. You could have just went to the DMV and would have gotten an easy answer. Most likely "bring us proof of insurance and xxx document (no title needed) and we'll give you a temp tag"
I've bought and sold many vehicles through private party purchases and it's as easy as that in just about every state.
Dealers do not have any advantage over private parties in selling cars. Temp tag registration works about the same for both, with the exception that dealers typically have temp tags on hand and can mail the registration papers to the dmv later.
In most states, you can drive around without a tag as long as you have the bill of sale, proof in insurance, and a good excuse (I just bought it). They're not going to impound your car unless it has been reported as stolen.
I've bought and sold many vehicles through private party purchases and it's as easy as that in just about every state.
Dealers do not have any advantage over private parties in selling cars. Temp tag registration works about the same for both, with the exception that dealers typically have temp tags on hand and can mail the registration papers to the dmv later.
In most states, you can drive around without a tag as long as you have the bill of sale, proof in insurance, and a good excuse (I just bought it). They're not going to impound your car unless it has been reported as stolen.
05-15-2010, 07:46 AM
#49
Drifting
Thread Starter
Wow guys! This has been a strong response. After talking to MANY tag agencies I found one that would do it! I have a temp tag!!
1. I finnaly got a form 99% of the people in my bank were not familiar with.
2. Many Tag agencies told me they could not issue temp tags. One said they could only do it if the seller was out of state or if I was not a resident. ??
3. Even when I went in to the place that did it, they almost didnt do it based on an extra box that was checked on the generic form!
I spent days on the phone back and forth with the banks(mine and his) I dealt with missinformed employees, lies, the blame game, and the transfer games!
It was very challenging to say the least but it has to be better than paying a $3k or so premium to a dealer.
If anyone is planning on buying a car from a private seller in Florida be prepared.
1. I finnaly got a form 99% of the people in my bank were not familiar with.
2. Many Tag agencies told me they could not issue temp tags. One said they could only do it if the seller was out of state or if I was not a resident. ??
3. Even when I went in to the place that did it, they almost didnt do it based on an extra box that was checked on the generic form!
I spent days on the phone back and forth with the banks(mine and his) I dealt with missinformed employees, lies, the blame game, and the transfer games!
It was very challenging to say the least but it has to be better than paying a $3k or so premium to a dealer.
If anyone is planning on buying a car from a private seller in Florida be prepared.
05-15-2010, 09:18 AM
#50
Drifting
It might be good to check something if it has not already been checked. At one point, I read the "money had been deposited". The question I have is, did the money get credited to the lien against the car?
If it did, you should be getting a title. Aweek or ten days should be plenty of time. There may even be a legal requirement on the timing.
If it did not get applied to the car loan, there could be trouble.
If the lien has been cleared and the bank isn't getting the title to you in a reasonable time, it might be appropriate to ask an attorney to contact the bank. I once had a real estate deal about to go bad because a bank did not get the needed paperwork to the title company. He explained some things to the bank about what would happen if they caused the real estate deal to fail, and the paperwork showed up that day. Things may be different in FL than in MO, but the bank responded to my attorney a whole lot better than to me.
If it did, you should be getting a title. Aweek or ten days should be plenty of time. There may even be a legal requirement on the timing.
If it did not get applied to the car loan, there could be trouble.
If the lien has been cleared and the bank isn't getting the title to you in a reasonable time, it might be appropriate to ask an attorney to contact the bank. I once had a real estate deal about to go bad because a bank did not get the needed paperwork to the title company. He explained some things to the bank about what would happen if they caused the real estate deal to fail, and the paperwork showed up that day. Things may be different in FL than in MO, but the bank responded to my attorney a whole lot better than to me.
05-15-2010, 09:23 AM
#51
Drifting
I just bought from a dealer in another state, and still had a couple of hurtles to contend with. My previous car was bought from an individual in another state, and it was easier to complete than this recent dealer made purchase.
05-15-2010, 09:29 AM
#52
Drifting
When buying a car with a lienholder from a private party, I would go with him to the lienholders office/bank and hand my check to them, simple. The least I would do is mail them my check directly. I would never hand the check to the seller, ever. If he has to deposit it, then wait for the check to clear befoire its any good its pointless.
The sell should have had you write the check directly to the lienholder and you would have not been wasting all this time and aggravation.
Also prior to buying a car I would educate myself on the proper procedure for my state.
The sell should have had you write the check directly to the lienholder and you would have not been wasting all this time and aggravation.
Also prior to buying a car I would educate myself on the proper procedure for my state.
05-15-2010, 09:58 AM
#53
Le Mans Master
My story for your future buying experience: Back in 06 I purchased a 98 Vert. from a seller who still had a lean on it.
I had a Cashier's check cut at my bank, accompanied the seller to his bank that held the title,they called my bank to verify the validity of my funds.Paid his lean off then and there,gave his bank my info.received copies verifying his lean was paid and received the title in 5 days.
I had a Cashier's check cut at my bank, accompanied the seller to his bank that held the title,they called my bank to verify the validity of my funds.Paid his lean off then and there,gave his bank my info.received copies verifying his lean was paid and received the title in 5 days.
05-15-2010, 02:14 PM
#54
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Just because you may be able to drive w/o plates in one state may mean nothing to the LEO in the next one.
Before buying private party with a pending lien do your research. I bought a Vette in Md with a lien on it. Fortunately Md is tag friendly for private parties. They allow legal use of existing plates for up to 10 days if the Md seller puts it in writing. Of course the buyer is obligated to return those plates to the seller or MVA in Md within 24 hrs after they expire during that 10-day period. Refer to TR 13-501.
If you buy or sell a car in FL, give the local 'tax collector' a call first to hear what seller & buyer options are for a temp tag.
If you give the seller the funds up-front to pay off his lien you better make sure that's where the funds go. What if he uses those funds to go to Vegas to invest in gambling? How long will you then be waiting for that lien release? It could turn into a nightmare dealing with all the parties out of state. My transaction went smoothly but it still took several weeks. The lien holder wants to make sure the funds have cleared before issuing a lien release. A wire transfer can expedite the process. Again, do your research ahead of time.
Last edited by cor28vettes; 05-15-2010 at 02:17 PM. Reason: TR-501 added
05-15-2010, 08:09 PM
#55
Drifting
My story for your future buying experience: Back in 06 I purchased a 98 Vert. from a seller who still had a lean on it.
I had a Cashier's check cut at my bank, accompanied the seller to his bank that held the title,they called my bank to verify the validity of my funds.Paid his lean off then and there,gave his bank my info.received copies verifying his lean was paid and received the title in 5 days.
I had a Cashier's check cut at my bank, accompanied the seller to his bank that held the title,they called my bank to verify the validity of my funds.Paid his lean off then and there,gave his bank my info.received copies verifying his lean was paid and received the title in 5 days.
Similar experience, except the seller called ahead and the bank had the title ready when I showed up. No waiting, the seller signed it and handed it to me.
05-15-2010, 09:21 PM
#56
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Very simple process
Private party sales on the forum should be very simple when there is a lien involved. The buyer should wire the purchase funds directly to the lien holder. At that time the title will be released immediately. All funds paid above the pay off amount (due to seller) are then given to the seller from his own bank in the form of a certified bank check. Very safe for both parties involved. No personal checks should be involved, and no money should be given to the seller unless the seller is holding the title. If this advice is not followed, then let the games begin. 
In this case, the OP gave the seller a check and took the car without a title.
I would take the title home without the car before I would take the car home without a title. What if the seller spent the money and didn't pay off the car? What if the seller owed federal taxes and that is why he had to sell his vette? Imagine this, the seller deposits your check and the federal government liens his bank account immediately for the unpaid taxes! 
The money would be gone forever! Now that's a nightmare!
In this case, the OP gave the seller a check and took the car without a title.
I would take the title home without the car before I would take the car home without a title. What if the seller spent the money and didn't pay off the car? What if the seller owed federal taxes and that is why he had to sell his vette? Imagine this, the seller deposits your check and the federal government liens his bank account immediately for the unpaid taxes! The money would be gone forever! Now that's a nightmare!
05-15-2010, 10:53 PM
#57
Instructor
Unless the seller can hand you the title on the spot never issue a check to that individual only. Have the check made payable to the individual AND the lein holder and check with the lending institution that the amount your paying is enough to cover the loan payoff. This may not do anything to speed up the title release from the lending institution but at least your money is protected from a possible scam or stolen property scheme.
05-15-2010, 10:59 PM
#58
He had the car financed. I gave him a check(im financing) an he gave me the car. He deposited the check the very next AM. Now the banks are playing games to do the paperwork and release the lein. Money has cleared.
No lien release= no title= no tag , no registration NO cruising.
The trouble here is that I cant even get a temp tag because only dealers can offer them.
No lien release= no title= no tag , no registration NO cruising.
The trouble here is that I cant even get a temp tag because only dealers can offer them.
05-15-2010, 11:19 PM
#59
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Not everyone has their cars paid for and the banks aren't going to turn the title loose until they have the money in their hand. The title may be stored who knows where especially if it's a big bank with lots of branches. It will probably take a few days especially if you depend on snail mail unless one of them does the leg work and chases it down.
05-16-2010, 12:28 AM
#60
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If you give the seller the funds up-front to pay off his lien you better make sure that's where the funds go. What if he uses those funds to go to Vegas to invest in gambling? How long will you then be waiting for that lien release? It could turn into a nightmare dealing with all the parties out of state.
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/show....php?t=2582794
