My bone stock LS3 at drag strip tonight...
11-24-2007, 07:42 AM
#21
Race Director
That 12.40 is very respectable! With being out of practice like that, most people probably would've had a hard time even getting into the 12s. Now that there are a few months of cool weather ahead, you should try to get out to the track a few more times, and I'm sure you'll knock a few more tenths off that time. I still truly believe a bone stock LS3 can run 11s, as long as you can figure out a way to drive around the TM. Perhaps a tiny bit more wheelspin off the line can fool the computer enough so that it doesn't intrude as much?
11-24-2007, 08:15 AM
#22
Team Owner
Thread Starter
That 12.40 is very respectable! With being out of practice like that, most people probably would've had a hard time even getting into the 12s. Now that there are a few months of cool weather ahead, you should try to get out to the track a few more times, and I'm sure you'll knock a few more tenths off that time. I still truly believe a bone stock LS3 can run 11s, as long as you can figure out a way to drive around the TM. Perhaps a tiny bit more wheelspin off the line can fool the computer enough so that it doesn't intrude as much?
By the way, I did have one run that felt really awesome - the only run that did. Unfortunately, like a real rookie dumb-***, I rolled out of the staging lights before it went green, and the time reflected the rollout. I've never done THAT before
11-24-2007, 08:22 AM
#23
Le Mans Master
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How refreshing.... real data on a pure stocker...
This is great info and seems to be right what I was expecting...
As you said... 117 is good for a low 12's.. Your 12.4 run shows you were very close to your goal..
Congrats for getting out there and posting... nothing to be ashamed of here... those are very descent times.
Similar to you, I have not been to the track in some time... For me its been about 14 years... We are the same age... grandkids and all...
The strip is not a priority anymore... but I still wonder what I would do... Thanks for running some for us old timers
This is great info and seems to be right what I was expecting...
As you said... 117 is good for a low 12's.. Your 12.4 run shows you were very close to your goal..
Congrats for getting out there and posting... nothing to be ashamed of here... those are very descent times.
Similar to you, I have not been to the track in some time... For me its been about 14 years... We are the same age... grandkids and all...
The strip is not a priority anymore... but I still wonder what I would do... Thanks for running some for us old timers
I'm actually ashamed to post my times. I could not launch to save my life. But I'm a believer in sharing the bad with the good, and I think there is some information to be had from my runs. My only excuse is that I have not drag raced in two years, and only twice in the last four years. So much for my excuses. Oh, temperature was 54 degrees - great weather conditions and runs at HRP in Baytown, Texas. My car is a Z51 coupe, six speed manual, NPP. And yes, I even put the factory tires back on it today - so it truly is BONE STOCK.
With horrible 60' times, I muddled in the 12.7s over several runs. Finally, I did manage a 12.409 - but that is a testament to how strong the LS3 is. That was on a 2.098 60' time, and a trap speed of 114.7.
I made a total of seven runs, but basically aborted two they were so bad. For the record, I had a best trap speed of 117.03 - most were in the high 115's and 116. I'm not sure why my last run (the 12.4) was so slow- possible heat soaking. There was hardly anyone at the track, and I was basically "hot lapping" the whole night. Every single run I went around and was no more than 8 or 10 cars back. Most runs the coolant temperature was around 212 at the starting line.
I will point out one thing. I made all runs with traction control off, and a few with traction control and active handling off. The car was hesitating on most of the shifts. I never had this happen on my LS2s (I had two of them - neither did this). And I've never experienced this on the street. I think this does indicate that TM is more present on the LS3 when the traction is good.
I had hoped to run 12.3 or so with my talent - historically, my 60' times are consistently between 1.95 and 2.0. As you can see, if I could have run in the 1.9s, I think I could easily have gotten the car in the 12.2-12.3 range - which is what I hoped for.
Sorry to dissapoint with such a **** poor effort!
With horrible 60' times, I muddled in the 12.7s over several runs. Finally, I did manage a 12.409 - but that is a testament to how strong the LS3 is. That was on a 2.098 60' time, and a trap speed of 114.7.
I made a total of seven runs, but basically aborted two they were so bad. For the record, I had a best trap speed of 117.03 - most were in the high 115's and 116. I'm not sure why my last run (the 12.4) was so slow- possible heat soaking. There was hardly anyone at the track, and I was basically "hot lapping" the whole night. Every single run I went around and was no more than 8 or 10 cars back. Most runs the coolant temperature was around 212 at the starting line.
I will point out one thing. I made all runs with traction control off, and a few with traction control and active handling off. The car was hesitating on most of the shifts. I never had this happen on my LS2s (I had two of them - neither did this). And I've never experienced this on the street. I think this does indicate that TM is more present on the LS3 when the traction is good.
I had hoped to run 12.3 or so with my talent - historically, my 60' times are consistently between 1.95 and 2.0. As you can see, if I could have run in the 1.9s, I think I could easily have gotten the car in the 12.2-12.3 range - which is what I hoped for.
Sorry to dissapoint with such a **** poor effort!
11-24-2007, 08:41 AM
#24
Le Mans Master
The other thing to consider is the tree (no one seems to mention the lights). If you run on a bracket tree, your reaction time means nothing, the timer starts when you roll out. With Bracket lights you can pay more attention to the launch than the lights. This puts your thoughts on the launch instead of the lights until you learn the car.
I checked my slips this morning. The best I got from my bone stock A6 with street tires was a 1.8 60 foot. Also I found avoiding the water box was a good idea since you don't need to heat those run flats up.
Another thing to remember is the track prep and temp. Me and a bunch of friends rented the track a few weeks ago and in the cost was track prep on both lanes. I can tell you track prep makes a big difference on your 60' with those run flats so does the track temperature. The day for us was perfect, about 60 degrees air and the track hit 100 by mid morning.
Keep at it, it is still fun, no matter what the numbers.
I checked my slips this morning. The best I got from my bone stock A6 with street tires was a 1.8 60 foot. Also I found avoiding the water box was a good idea since you don't need to heat those run flats up.
Another thing to remember is the track prep and temp. Me and a bunch of friends rented the track a few weeks ago and in the cost was track prep on both lanes. I can tell you track prep makes a big difference on your 60' with those run flats so does the track temperature. The day for us was perfect, about 60 degrees air and the track hit 100 by mid morning.
Keep at it, it is still fun, no matter what the numbers.
11-24-2007, 09:33 AM
#25
Burning Brakes
From a fellow Texas FJR & Vette owner, great time and MPH Jim...! I went out to HRP last friday night (16th) with a few friends with similar weather, a little less humidity than last night. One buddy brought is bone stock '06 GTS Viper he just picked up from out of state. He's been racing standard tranny cars for many years. Best E/T of the night was a 12.4x and his best MPH was 118. Yep, the C6 LS3's are damn strong.
Granted his 60' was **** poor (2.1~2.2) as he just rolled out without getting too aggressive but that just shows you how close the C6's are to the Gen II Vipers...
Granted his 60' was **** poor (2.1~2.2) as he just rolled out without getting too aggressive but that just shows you how close the C6's are to the Gen II Vipers...
11-24-2007, 09:41 AM
#26
Team Owner
Thread Starter
From a fellow Texas FJR & Vette owner, great time and MPH Jim...! I went out to HRP last friday night (16th) with a few friends with similar weather, a little less humidity than last night. One buddy brought is bone stock '06 GTS Viper he just picked up from out of state. He's been racing standard tranny cars for many years. Best E/T of the night was a 12.4x and his best MPH was 118. Yep, the C6 LS3's are damn strong.
Granted his 60' was **** poor (2.1~2.2) as he just rolled out without getting too aggressive but that just shows you how close the C6's are to the Gen II Vipers...
Granted his 60' was **** poor (2.1~2.2) as he just rolled out without getting too aggressive but that just shows you how close the C6's are to the Gen II Vipers...
11-24-2007, 10:24 AM
#27
Melting Slicks
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Pretty good runs IMO.
The track conditions had to be horrible because of all of the rain lately (seepage) and I'm betting those guys have not prepped the track since their last event.
The track conditions had to be horrible because of all of the rain lately (seepage) and I'm betting those guys have not prepped the track since their last event.
11-24-2007, 11:05 AM
#28
Safety Car
Good runs! On a slick track these cars are very hard to launch. Unfortunately, when your low DA is because of low temps (air and track) it doesn't help. Wait till a day race in Spring when the sun warms the track, you'll drop at least a tenth in the 60'. Then you'll be in the low, low 12's.
11-24-2007, 11:11 AM
#29
Melting Slicks
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I wouldnt be too disappointed, you basically kept the car within the claimed numbers (in this case 12's). I am sure when the pro's test cars they dont get it right every run. I would take all of your runs, pick the best one and then try to beat it. 
11-24-2007, 11:32 AM
#31
Le Mans Master
Hmmm.....very interesting. Makes me wish we had a 1/4 mile track here. I wonder if we will be running into these deals where we have some cars that are just plain faster than others, or more importantly some that are a little slower than others.
In the 1/8 mile, my first time out in my LS3 was .2 quicker and 3mph faster than my LS2 EVER was on it's fastest time ever. The bog you speak of smells of TM that I used to get on my LS2 but see none of on this LS3 with everything turned off. I hot lapped 5 times back to back and every single time beat my best LS2 run of all time with the exception of the last time where I just missed it.
Even more so, traction was so poor I had to let out of the gas and get back in it on EVERY single run. So I beat my LS2's times by .2, MPH by 4and all with having to let out of the gas and getting back in it. I feel that had I heated the tires (I drove around every time) I could beat my LS2 by at least .4 ....and that's in the 1/8th...and with a best of 2.1 on the 60'
So, how did the runs feel SOTP? With mine, it never once felt sluggish to me on any pass. Pulled hard as crap each run which was an improvement over the LS2 and the time slips showed it.
In the 1/8 mile, my first time out in my LS3 was .2 quicker and 3mph faster than my LS2 EVER was on it's fastest time ever. The bog you speak of smells of TM that I used to get on my LS2 but see none of on this LS3 with everything turned off. I hot lapped 5 times back to back and every single time beat my best LS2 run of all time with the exception of the last time where I just missed it.
Even more so, traction was so poor I had to let out of the gas and get back in it on EVERY single run. So I beat my LS2's times by .2, MPH by 4and all with having to let out of the gas and getting back in it. I feel that had I heated the tires (I drove around every time) I could beat my LS2 by at least .4 ....and that's in the 1/8th...and with a best of 2.1 on the 60'
So, how did the runs feel SOTP? With mine, it never once felt sluggish to me on any pass. Pulled hard as crap each run which was an improvement over the LS2 and the time slips showed it.
11-24-2007, 12:43 PM
#32
Melting Slicks
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Thanks for posting . The 117 is indicative of of lower et's on the way. Imagine a perfect launch and maybe a 12.1 at 118.5. Since I have an 08, z51, mn6, nnp as well I can use your times to judge how quick my car is without risking embarressing myself.
11-24-2007, 02:05 PM
#33
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I had hoped to run 12.3 or so with my talent - historically, my 60' times are consistently between 1.95 and 2.0. As you can see, if I could have run in the 1.9s, I think I could easily have gotten the car in the 12.2-12.3 range - which is what I hoped for.
Sorry to dissapoint with such a **** poor effort!
Sorry to dissapoint with such a **** poor effort!
Question, when you ran the 12.4, did U have both TC and AH off? Or, did U run with just AH? Thanks.
11-24-2007, 02:16 PM
#35
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Your too hard on yourself bud..... just wait till it gets a little warmer... tires hook up better when the pavement is warmer.... there will be other days....good write up.....
11-24-2007, 02:30 PM
#36
Burning Brakes
Those times seem good and like all the above say better weather will bring better times. I'm an old SCCA road racer so I too like the twisties better.
BTW did you have fun? that's all that matters
BTW did you have fun? that's all that matters
11-24-2007, 03:15 PM
#38
The trap speed of 117+ mph is impressive !!
The time is a really traction matter, and as a result it can be very difficult to achieve awesome ETs. I have had dozens of trips down the track in my 425 RWHP '86 Cutlass with drag radials or slicks as regular street tires are simply hopeless for decent ETs
The time is a really traction matter, and as a result it can be very difficult to achieve awesome ETs. I have had dozens of trips down the track in my 425 RWHP '86 Cutlass with drag radials or slicks as regular street tires are simply hopeless for decent ETs
11-24-2007, 03:51 PM
#40
Team Owner
Thread Starter
Let me try to address all of the questions above....
The car felt fine- I'm not blaming TM. The bottom line is that the driver was not able to launch well, and I do NOT think TM was an issue there. Most runs I spun too much. The TM I mentioned was only on the shifts, and oddly enough I mostly noticed it on the 3-4 shift - which would not have a big effect on the times.
TC & AH - see first post. I had TC off on all runs, and AH off on a few.
Yes, when it comes to driving, I'm hard on myself. If I went bowling and failed to score above 100, I would blow it off in about 30 seconds. But cars and driving are "my thing", and have been for many, many years. I don't get in a rage or lose sleep over it, I'm just very dissapointed in myself.
I'd rather run twisties as well. Just don't have the opportunities to do it affordably.
Did I enjoy it? Sort of, but I was really frustrated - so I'm not really sure how to answer that.
Thanks for all the nice replies
The car felt fine- I'm not blaming TM. The bottom line is that the driver was not able to launch well, and I do NOT think TM was an issue there. Most runs I spun too much. The TM I mentioned was only on the shifts, and oddly enough I mostly noticed it on the 3-4 shift - which would not have a big effect on the times.
TC & AH - see first post. I had TC off on all runs, and AH off on a few.
Yes, when it comes to driving, I'm hard on myself. If I went bowling and failed to score above 100, I would blow it off in about 30 seconds. But cars and driving are "my thing", and have been for many, many years. I don't get in a rage or lose sleep over it, I'm just very dissapointed in myself.
I'd rather run twisties as well. Just don't have the opportunities to do it affordably.
Did I enjoy it? Sort of, but I was really frustrated - so I'm not really sure how to answer that.
Thanks for all the nice replies