IRON MAIDEN

So they were dialed in on a C6Z? Did I read that right?

JrRifleCoach

It is my understanding that C6 Z06 shocks are direct replacements for the C5.
A wise choice above the factory 01-03 Z06 Bilsteins.
The DRM's are said to be heads above all others as reported by C5&6 drivers.

So I gotta ask a question of you.

Would you put any old shock into this suspension?



I didn't think so......

mkiv808

I'm curious about this too.

0Randy@DRM

I'm not a fan of Sachs shocks. Never have been and never will be.

Also with being a very bias sales guy, I'm not the one to ask for a side by side view point on the 04 shocks. They are the "best" valving that GM only used for a year. Which doesn't make much sense to me.

What I do know is we have a 99.9 happy customer reviews on our shocks. We did a ton of testing and development with the C6z on these shocks. But they are extremely similar in suspension that we have sold them with success for the c5 guys. Look at the reviews from guys bolting on c6z shocks, our are better (IMHO) then what they came out with.

Randy
PS I haven't smoked a cig in 8 years but suddenly would like one!

racebum

absolute garbage response from what i consider a really good vendor

you posted

1. no shock dynos
2. no description even in words of what was changed, did you increase the low/high compression valving? the low/high rebound?

please don't go the way of so many of these other vendors who just sell hype and marketing to make the sale

Socko

I agree! I really want to buy drm bilsteins but I really need to see a force/velocity dyno as i do NOT want regular bilsteins.

0Randy@DRM

I'm leaving tomorrow AM to the Mountains, but it should be raining one of the days and I will grab my folder before we take off. So I can type up a better post. Personally I have never had a 04z shock on a dyno in front of me. But I know there is some graphs out on the web. Comparing the numbers will not be exact because shock dynos are like engine dynos, and chassis dynos. Did they just slide the graph around because the bottom shock bushing deflection? But I will be able to make a good comparison between sports and ours, same dyno+same day. It's all in newton and meter/seconds but will be able to explain it better.

Will I post a shock graph to make a couple sales, no. I don't do it for horsepower and will not do it for shocks either.

Would a format like this satisfy you guys???

(For example)
Low speed rebound (3 inches per second)
DRM more than sports
High speed rebound (7 inches per second)
Sports more than DRM

Randy

0Randy@DRM

I made a couple good points in that post. "I'm not the one to ask for a side by side view point on the 04 shocks" I do in fact hate Sachs production shocks, we played with them in the early C5 days and found them to be less then to be desired. You most likely haven't seen our Sachs coilover set from 97???

Sorry to disappoint you and I have a feeling it's going to be very hard for me to get your off the 04z shocks.

My auto correct screwed me many times, I was in the waiting room at that doctors office on my phone.

Randy

racebum

the thing i like about the 04 shocks is their compliance on the street. really wouldn't at all be my first choice for a smooth track car or something on R comps

also true i haven't seen the 97 coilovers, i didn't start using your parts until 2000, back when people still modded c4's

i also remember some revalved bilsteins either you guys did or VBP did, think it was you guys, anyway, they were stiff, great high speed shocks but they put your head in the targa top on speed bumps, like they were stiffer than off the shelf koni sports cranked to full

just curious what you guys did with these. favor compliance, or high speed valving that's less compliant on the street but better on an open track

Socko

First off front sports are fine. Close enough imo.

The rears are the issue pretty much, the 04 z06 and all the c6z06 are simmilar. So clearly gm figured out something they really liked when they set the shock to peak at about 300lbs peak rebound, but with a fairly steep ramp rate relative to that peak up to 3"/s being at about 200lbs force.

I have to think those(peak and 3"/s) are the magic numbers that you could let out without giving away any of your valving secrets, and they are close enough dyno to dyno. The low speed tuning has some real functionality on track as well I assume and I would love to hear exactly what the goal of that tuning was. I found a post someplace that said something about your revalve removing rear end uncertanty, or something along those lines.

I have been assured by numerous people that the 04z rears help with grip in transition which is my primary goal. Possibly you could speak to that point.

Socko

rears or both?

It isn't that there isn't info out there on the concept of the shocks. It is that its all segmented like this. Possibly I should just stfu and be more patient for your big post haha.

But this is pretty much the info i am after. More specifics would help, but if this is the rear design at least I know you are heading in a direction that suits my needs.

Thanks!

I would still like to know the rebound peak in the rear. I know I read they were tuned on a c6z06, i have a c5z06 which means slightly over dampened, which i am fine with. Was any street tuning done or 100% track or what. As much as i like to pretend 4-6 days a year my car is a racecar its still a street car so compromise has value.

dhowdy

Why are you not a fan? You say you hate them but give no reason why.

Of course you're trying to sell product, fine, but that's a bit upsetting if you feel that you can't give an honest evaluation of the two. If you're product is the best, give me reasons why it is better. If it may not be the best for our application (C5s) given that they were tuned on C6s, then I hope you would be willing to explain that as well rather than give evasive answers to boost sales.

Here is the graph I found floating around.



Based on your description, it sounds like you shifted the sports in the same direction as the 04 z06 shocks.

As an aside, if I intend to lower the car from stock height, what different expectations or requirements do I have for my shocks?

Price is very similar so it's not unreasonable that people want enough information to make an informed decision. I doubt anyone here is just going to buy both sets to compare.

racebum

they totally do on anything besides a perfectly even glass smooth track. the difference between the 02 and 04 rear shocks is pretty noticeable. sections of pavement that use to upset the car now no longer do. grip under braking as well as transition were improved substantially

Socko

Just to get it all in 1 spot this is the c6z06 shock dyno i have seen that was on pfadts page. The green is one of pfadts shocks, so no longer available.

I have a dream, all options can have all data in 1 place.

0Randy@DRM

Based off your graph here is the differences.

Front low speed compression More then all of them (More stable under braking, less dive, more responsive.)

Front mid speed compression (It works)
About the same as the sports

Front high speed compression (more is not better ie ride comfort)
About the same as 04 shocks and sports

Front rebound, Our shocks have more at every point, 50 pounds at some points.
(We did this to help with high speed stability, and slow down the loading and unloading of the front end.)

Rear compression low speed
In between the sports and 04
(Good balance between the two different options)

Rear compression mid speed
tick less then the 04s


Rear compression high speed
in between sports and 04s
(Ride comfort plays a important role in high speed compression dampening.)

Rear rebound
In between sports and 04 shocks, almost exactly across the board.
(We felt the stock C6z shocks needed more, didn't really look at the 04s which appear soft also (In our eyes))

That should give y'all technical guys enough information to make up your minds. Our goal was to make affordable, street friendly, well dampened car that people could take to the track-favorite road and have some fun. This isn't what I would call a extreme, harsh, racing valving.

Lowering the car 1/2 inch is suggested in almost every application. I don't feel the shock valving shouldn't be any different. The car's chassis is good, the shocks are good. Some claim lowering will kill the handling of the car, I disagree. Slamming a car isn't going to give you optimal handling, but will give the car a look. Pick your poison yourselfs

Part of being a good vendor, I will not make a list of complaints against a shock company. I shouldn't have used the word Hate, dislike would be a better term. Or as I put it before, I'm not a fan.

At the end of the day, 04 shocks will sell, I will sell our revalved, and the Sports-HD will sell also.

Randy

0Randy@DRM

We had about 50 different valvings that I knew about for the C4s. We were making them special for different tracks, spring rates, and etc. Some of them were kidney killers, some were very soft.

We really tried to combine a street valving with a track valving. Increase dampening on the low shock speed without getting a crazy amount of high shock speed. This adds to control without being harsh. Increased rebound, "Tied down" is the term my customer's feed back.

Randy

JrRifleCoach

ETA?

rochoa21

Any update?

0Randy@DRM

Guys and Gals of DRM Bilstein group buy v6.0

I have received notice that the earliest we will see the rear shocks is late this month or early September. After hours on the phone with their sales team, I have heard all the ins and outs of building shocks on a large scale. They are working 4 shifts, 24 hours a day and 7 days a week trying to keep up with demand at the plant. But still behind on production dates. The news saddens me, but they (we) will not be hanging out to dry, as all of us are working hard to make it happen. If there was more that I could do to speed this up, I would in a heartbeat. But at this point my hands are tied.

Randy Rippie
Also I have been getting a ton of calls and emails about getting more shocks. We have 100 more sets coming down the pipeline, at this point no ETA.

0Randy@DRM

Shocks are here

We will be sending out final payment emails over the weekend.

Randy