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Old 03-30-2011, 10:45 AM   #1
leviathan125
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Default Clutch won't disengage after install

I have an 02 Z06. I just installed an LS7 clutch and flywheel, new slave cylinder, and a ram adjustable master cylinder. The car moves if you have it in gear with the clutch in when you start it. The clutch isn't fully disengaging, if it all. I know I installed the clutch facing the right way, as it was marked "flywheel side", unless I had a total brain fart, looked at it, and then put it on wrong? Less assume for now though that it's facing the right way.

I have bled and bled the hydraulic system and nothing changed. I have also adjusted the master cylinder different ways and it's still the same. I have taken the inspection cover off and you can see the throw out bearing moving back and forth.

Any recommendations? Am I going to have to drop the rear end, transmission, and torque tube again?
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Old 03-30-2011, 09:53 PM   #2
AWSOME 04
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Unfortunately, you will probably have to install a spacer behind the slave cylinder.
I had a clutch installed in mine and the mechanic left two bolts loose and damaged the freeze plug that is in the rear of the crankshaft and trashed the whole assembly. I had to replace everything a second time. I was not happy!
I hope someone more knowlegable than me will chime in about the clutch spacer. I think Ram makes some but there are other companies that make them. Good Luck.
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Old 03-30-2011, 10:28 PM   #3
81c3
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Really sounds like the disc is in backwards to me
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Old 03-31-2011, 12:32 PM   #4
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From all the reading I have done, it seems that most are in agreement that a shim is Not needed with an LS7 kit. Surely I didn't put the clutch in backwards after looking at what side goes to the flywheel right before I put it in, but who knows.

If a shim is necessary, where would I get one at? Any other recommendations? I miss my Vette.
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Old 03-31-2011, 12:46 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leviathan125 View Post
From all the reading I have done, it seems that most are in agreement that a shim is Not needed with an LS7 kit. Surely I didn't put the clutch in backwards after looking at what side goes to the flywheel right before I put it in, but who knows.

If a shim is necessary, where would I get one at? Any other recommendations? I miss my Vette.
What choices do you have here? Like you, I've never heard of shimming the slave, with an LS7 setup. Unfortunately, it's coming back apart, if nothing obvious is wrong. Why type of flywheel bolts did you use?
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Old 03-31-2011, 12:51 PM   #6
Paul 75 L82
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I remember reading something about the flywheel bolts being a problem. I would research that.
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Old 03-31-2011, 01:09 PM   #7
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I found this:

All flywheels have a tendency to cone outward from pressure plate applied forces. Here we are checking to see how bad the cone is with a feeler gauge. Hydraulic clutches have limited travel. Excessive flywheel machining can cause clutch disengagement problems. We use .020 as our maximum allowed machining of the flywheel friction face.
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Old 03-31-2011, 01:23 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul 75 L82 View Post
I found this:

All flywheels have a tendency to cone outward from pressure plate applied forces. Here we are checking to see how bad the cone is with a feeler gauge. Hydraulic clutches have limited travel. Excessive flywheel machining can cause clutch disengagement problems. We use .020 as our maximum allowed machining of the flywheel friction face.
So you are assuming the OP did not install a new clutch and flywheel?
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Old 03-31-2011, 02:59 PM   #9
81c3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leviathan125 View Post
From all the reading I have done, it seems that most are in agreement that a shim is Not needed with an LS7 kit. Surely I didn't put the clutch in backwards after looking at what side goes to the flywheel right before I put it in, but who knows.

If a shim is necessary, where would I get one at? Any other recommendations? I miss my Vette.
If you miss your Vette, better get wrenchin' and yank it out again My bet is you installed the disc backwards. The symptoms you describe are exactly what happens when you do that. No ones perfect bro....
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Old 03-31-2011, 03:53 PM   #10
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Before you rip that thing apart again, I would make damn sure that there is no air in the hydraulics. I haven't had the pleasure to change the clutch on my 2000 yet but years ago I had to bleed the clutch on an old Toyota Corolla. I asked my wife to help me out by pressing on the pedal while I open & close the bleeder screw. Told her it would take 10 minutes. 2 hours later, I still could not get all the air out. Bought 1 of those 1 man bleeder kits, which consisted of a check valve on the end of a hose. Was finally able to bleed it myself, without her help. Try to pressure bleed the system if you can.
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Old 04-01-2011, 03:55 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul 75 L82 View Post
I remember reading something about the flywheel bolts being a problem. I would research that.
I used the stock flywheel bolts with locktite. I also used the stock pressure plate bolts. I installed a brand new LS7 flywheel, brand new LS7 pressure plate, and a brand new LS7 clutch, as well as brand new ram adjustable master cylinder, a brand new slave cylinder with new throw out bearing, and a new pilot bearing.

I'm not to concerned with having to take it all apart, honestly, as it was a much easier job that I thought it would have been (was on a frame lift). It took 7 and a half hours from start to finish, including spending close to 2 hours trying to get the pilot bearing out. It would of been nice to of had a nice pilot bearing puller from the beginning, instead of two hours later.

My main concern is once I take it all apart, and if the clutch is installed facing the right way, what am I going to do to figure out the problem? I will be doing this on a lift at my friends work on the weekend (next weekend actually), so it has to be finished before they open Monday. So, taking it apart, and leaving it apart until I get a shim etc. is not an option.

I don't see how it's possible that the flywheel bolts are causing my problems, but I'm open to any suggestions or first hand experience so that I will be best prepared when it comes back apart.

I really appreciate all the replies so far!
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Old 04-01-2011, 09:02 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leviathan125 View Post
I used the stock flywheel bolts with locktite. I also used the stock pressure plate bolts. I installed a brand new LS7 flywheel, brand new LS7 pressure plate, and a brand new LS7 clutch, as well as brand new ram adjustable master cylinder, a brand new slave cylinder with new throw out bearing, and a new pilot bearing.

I'm not to concerned with having to take it all apart, honestly, as it was a much easier job that I thought it would have been (was on a frame lift). It took 7 and a half hours from start to finish, including spending close to 2 hours trying to get the pilot bearing out. It would of been nice to of had a nice pilot bearing puller from the beginning, instead of two hours later.

My main concern is once I take it all apart, and if the clutch is installed facing the right way, what am I going to do to figure out the problem? I will be doing this on a lift at my friends work on the weekend (next weekend actually), so it has to be finished before they open Monday. So, taking it apart, and leaving it apart until I get a shim etc. is not an option.

I don't see how it's possible that the flywheel bolts are causing my problems, but I'm open to any suggestions or first hand experience so that I will be best prepared when it comes back apart.

I really appreciate all the replies so far!
If you have the skills required to re and re your driveline I'm certain you could figure out how to fab a couple of shims should the need arise.
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Old 04-01-2011, 09:29 PM   #13
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I wouldn't pull it all apart again, I would install a Tick master cylinder, those push a lot more fluid than the stock m/c.



.
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Old 04-01-2011, 09:39 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bearcatt View Post
I wouldn't pull it all apart again, I would install a Tick master cylinder, those push a lot more fluid than the stock m/c.



.

Read his posts.
He stated he installed a new Ram adj clutch M/C.
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Old 04-01-2011, 09:43 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bumble-z View Post
Read his posts.
He stated he installed a new Ram adj clutch M/C.
.


The Ram is just a modified stocker that doesn't compare to a Tick.
The Tick is a Tilton that pushes way more fluid.


.
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Old 04-01-2011, 10:41 PM   #16
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I'm wondering if you have the adjustable master adjusted correctly.
I have mine up in the air right now and noticed that they failed to put a window of any sort in the bell-housing. I think that I will cut one myself and make a bolt on door. I always like to see how things are aligned inside. Measuring your disc clearance can be a real handy thing at times like this.
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Old 04-01-2011, 10:52 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bumble-z View Post
Read his posts.
He stated he installed a new Ram adj clutch M/C.
Oh, I thought that the Ram Adj was a true adjustable aftermarket &
a competitor of the Tick unit.
I too, recently install a Tick adj, & I love it.
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Old 04-02-2011, 12:23 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bearcatt View Post
I wouldn't pull it all apart again, I would install a Tick master cylinder, those push a lot more fluid than the stock m/c. .
Am I right in thinking that the throw out bearing can only travel so far, not matter how much fluid is pushing, and may even cause damage to it if it does travel to far?

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Mountain Kat View Post
I'm wondering if you have the adjustable master adjusted correctly.
I have mine up in the air right now and noticed that they failed to put a window of any sort in the bell-housing. I think that I will cut one myself and make a bolt on door. I always like to see how things are aligned inside. Measuring your disc clearance can be a real handy thing at times like this.
There is an inspection plate on the bottom of the bell housing, actually, it's just the bottom half of the bell housing, it can be unbolted (6 bolts I believe, 4 of them pointing up and the other two bolts pointing towards the front of the car in the bell housing) and taken right off to allow you to visualize the slave cylinder and throwout bearing and clutch and pressure plate.
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Old 04-02-2011, 12:34 AM   #19
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How close to the floor is your disengage? If it is really low, start giving the master more push. If not, retry your stock master and see if the RAM is just not puttin out........
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Old 04-02-2011, 12:51 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jnape View Post
How close to the floor is your disengage? If it is really low, start giving the master more push. If not, retry your stock master and see if the RAM is just not puttin out........
I can't get the car into gear while it's running, with the clutch pushed all the way down. I have to start it in gear and with the clutch still all the way down the car moves, it actually starts moving with the clutch down and the engine cranking.

I don't have my old master cylinder anymore, I already threw it away. I have adjusted the new ram master cylinder so far out that the clutch pedal would stop (master cylinder bottoming out) before the clutch pedal would even hit the neutral safety switch.
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Old 04-02-2011, 12:51 AM
 
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