C4in mesa

My engine was rebuilt last year. I paid my mechanic to remove the engine and I took it to the shop where it was rebuilt. The first phase went without a hitch. I picked it up from the shop and brought it back over to his house. The long tube headers were put on while the engine was on a stand. He forgot to put the long bolt on the passenger side for the A/C compressor support bracket. After it was in the car he discovered his mistake. Taking it out the bolt got stuck in the aluminum and broke off. The fix we chose was to run a drill through the bolt and tap it putting the correct bolt in. It held for 6000 miles and now I have an exhaust leak. I am the one holding the bag so to speak and I am the one who has to pay for the repair.(A new mechanic) Monday morning I am dropping it off. He wants $65/hr and said it is gonna be 3-4 hours minimum. If something else should go wrong the bill will be more. My question comes from the fact that if he did his job right the bolt would have been put in the header while it was on the engine stand. I would be putting my hard earned money into the interior of the car not engine repairs. 6 weeks ago I took the car to my transmission shop and had them pull the tranny to repair a leak. He said the rear main seal spring was knocked lose and leaking. His opinion was while the engine was going in the car the motor bumped the torque convertor hard enough to knock th spring lose causing me the leak. Not to mention transmission fluid ALL OVER MY garage and driveway. Kitty litter by the way did a miracle job cleaning that BS up. I let it sit for days and then used my foot to crush it into the stain and what a miracle it did cleaning it up. Maybe 10% visible. So the transmission leak fix was $200. The guy did the job at cost because he rebuilt the transmission and is very very cool. Darrell at 202 Transmissions in Chandler AZ. Now Greg is my friend. He and I have gotten to know each other fairly well over the 2 years of owning the car. I have not put my issue on the table and asked him to his face to take some responsibility for his screw ups. I am now looking at nearly $700. I paid him $1500 to pull the engine and put it back in. If it was a business I would have demanded them to make it right. But since he and I have become buddies I have not said anything. Rather I constantly talk about the situation giving him the opportunity to say even a I am sorry but nothing. Is the male ego that sensitive ? The more I think about it the more pissed off it makes me. Yes I know I should have posted this in General my mistake.

93 ragtop

When you are talking modifications from stock, most the time you assume the risk. I doubt the mechanic will be responsible. On the 2 issues you mention, 1. I have never heard of a steel bolt breaking off in an alum. head. It will strip the threads of the alum. But the alum. is much softer then the steel bolt. 2. The seal on the automatic transmission is behind the torque converter. Unless it was pulled from the transmission and then reinstalled before the motor was put in and damaged, again, good luck getting the mechanic to take responsibility for that.
In other words, When you pull a motor, get a machinist to build it, another to install it, another person to pick parts and brands, and yet another to tune it, when something goes wrong, its hard to pinpoint who is at fault, much less getting anyone to accept responsibility.
Good luck with this one.

WVZR-1

seems to answer that aspect of your question. The rest I'll pass on.

Midnight 85

If you agreed to the proposed fix then you have no right to complain.

C4in mesa

It didn't work. Had it worked I would not be listening to an exhaust leak. At this point it really is about simply saying to me Man I'm sorry I caused this major pain by forgetting to correctly put the engine back in your car the right way. He works on cars every weekend out of his garage. Its not like he was doing a friend a favor. I paid him over $1400 to do this job and it took him months to finish. So you are saying because I agreed to the easy way out rather than having him pull the engine out again. The fix didn't work so I have to eat it. Well if the majority of opinions on here feel that way I will drop it and shut up. I stand by my work. At no time will someone have to pay for a job I did wrong. I thought car repairs were held to the same standard ?

garryowen

i would consider $65 an hour a bargain in this day and age. most all shops round here a bouncing off $90 to $100

[QUOTE] It held for 6000 miles/QUOTE ????? might have needed retightened. not unheard of for headers????

cumbercr

From your post it is not clear what the problem is. Is it a gasket leak or is a bolt stripped?

Paying someone who works out of their garage on weekends has its risks. You obviously got a better price than going to a legitimate business. Did he imply a warranty for his work?

C4in mesa

[QUOTE=garryowen;1585067996]i would consider $65 an hour a bargain in this day and age. most all shops round here a bouncing off $90 to $100

The new mechanic's rate. He has no rent or insurance or employees as shop owners do. The first thing I did was put a wrench on the bolt and it spins.

C4in mesa

Greg is my friend which is where the problem really is. He always states he will stand by his work. However we are talking about a HUGE problem. Removing the engine is what half the guys out here say. A bit exaggerated in my opinion. I have not made a stink about the transmission leak he caused either. I guess I'm looking for a tactful way to address this mess or its gonnna ruin my relationship with him. Its the elephant in the room.

93 ragtop

You still didn't answer my question. Are you saying a 3/8 steel bolt broke off in an alum. head? Was this a defective bolt? Unless it was about rusted into, I cant imagine that happening. Stripping the head, yes, but breaking the bolt?

I know its not what you want to hear, but every shop I have ever dealt with, when it comes to modified cars, there is no warranty. Keep in mind, this is a 25 year old car.

WVZR-1

I went back to read your original post and I was confused then as to what you had determined to do for "the fix" - since it was in the car already did you just attempt some sort of "filler/epoxy" and stuff a bolt in it? It sounds like that's what was attempted if it wasn't I apologize but I don't see where anyone mentions heli-coil or any type of thread repair.

If that's the case then it should have been taken apart then and corrected. Your friend likely doesn't have the equipment/tools to do the heli-coil with the head on the engine and the engine in the car.

It sounds like maybe it's going to require a major effort for the fix.

Maybe if you provide a snapshot with the bolt in question marked and then explain what you actually attempted.

It doesn't change the "we decided" at all - I'm quite sure your "friend" likely feels bad but the fix is maybe way over his head and it could it seems maybe get worse. I'm going to guess that the engine install was a "friend and I" did it "together - shoulder to shoulder".

garryowen

if you had room to re-tap ect. there might be room to right angle drill and heli-coil.

may be greg would help YOU do that. might try to ask him if he would teach you how?????

call it a day???????? only you and greg know if your relationship is worth saving.

a friend might be harder to find than a new mechanic.

i realize you meant your new mechanic. you might be trading one shade tree mechanic for another.

93 ragtop

[QUOTE=WVZR-1;1585068657]I went back to read your original post and I was confused then as to what you had determined to do for "the fix" - since it was in the car already did you just attempt some sort of "filler/epoxy" and stuff a bolt in it?

QUOTE]




Dave, as you know, I have a lot of respect for your opinions and you!! What you are saying is logical and what I would have expected to happen.
However, he said the bolt broke off, which would mean, he would have to drill it out, or at least use a easy out to back it out. Again, I have ask twice to clarify the steel bolt broke off in an alum. head. But have got no reply. It don't make sense to me!!!!

Deepa

Your first problem...You dropped the engine off at a "house" where a mechanic lives. Then you became friends...not good.

Then you half assed the first repair.

The rear main seal and transmission leak (or whatever it is, cause your post is hard as **** to read)...will be a case of pointing fingers at the installer and the transmission shop so you're going to eat that one.

Heres my fix...
These motors are easy to work on. Pull your intake, etc and take the bad head off. Bring the head to your original mechanic and have him heil coil it and assist you in reinstalling whatever else you need help with. This will save you a considerable amount of money, and ask him if he will be willing to eat the cost of the heil-coil. You will be on your own for gaskets unless he has any extras, something else which you can ask, hoping he will throw them in for you.

Mike

cumbercr

There is absolutely no need to remove an engine over this. I can see removing the head in order to get access to repair. But that's the worst case scenario.

It's still not clear the extent of the problem. When the broken bolt was removed were the threads in the head damaged? If so, was a helicoil installed?

Only you know what to do about a "friend" you hired to help you.

lt4obsesses

It's not really an elephant in the room. Exhaust leaks with headers is a pretty common issue, it happens. Sometimes it's the gasket, sometimes the bolts work loose, any number of things can create this. If it worked for 6000 miles, probably not your friend's fault.

The transmission leak? Keep in mind that it is the 'opinion' of your new mechanic, not backed up by actual fact. It's an old car and these things happen as well. Sure it could have happened during the engine install, but how would he have known? Again, after 6000 miles, I would say your case is pretty weak.

But it's up to you and what's more important. A 20 +/- year old car or a long time friendship? I would just chalk it up to stuff happens and let it go. Enjoy your car and enjoy your friendship.

GKK

Sometimes, it's just better to cut your losses and move on.

Lesson, learned!...








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desertmike1

This is a no Brainer; You had some guy work on your car "Off the Grid" and without a business license, and now you worry about retribution. Let it go.. ask your buddy what he feels you need to do, and let the chips fall were they may.

Now when it comes to removing a broken bolt from aluminum, this can be tricky at best, you really need a drilling jig/bushing in order to stay on center and straight.. and in order to install a thread saver [Heli coil] the header will need to be removed. It is possible to use the header it-self as a drilling fixture if; the pipe is not in the way,, and the Attachment hole is on center..

These types of repairs require somebody with at least a little bit of experience, such as a machinest!!

Good Luck

383vett

My stance on this is simple. If you are going to hotrod your car, learn to turn your own wrenches. You'll be assured things are done correctly. If you have to pay someone to do the work; 1) it'll cost a lot, 2) they will iusually screw the job up. Working on cars is not rocket science. If you have a set of tools, and an fsm, you can do 98% of everything related to your car.

C4in mesa

I paid Greg to pull it. Paid an engine shop to rebuild it. Paid Greg to put it back in. He FORGOT to put the correct bolts in the header before putting it back in. As far as the transmission leak goes the shop owner said he had never seen a spring simply come off the seal. His opinion was the engine slammed into the torque convertor and caused it to weaken and lose its grip. If I was a mechanic I could pick a side but I'm not all I can do is try to analyze the info given and make a decision based on popular opinion. Which is what I'm trying to do here. I ate it as I've done at every turn with this car.