scorp508

.....well not break, but something is odd.

I just did a fluid/filter change on the OD unit last weekend. That day and the next the shifts all happened exactly when they should, all nice and crisp. Well today, she's a bit sluggish. It was "ok" this morning, but is getting worse as the day goes on.

It isn't that the shifts themselves are bad, just when they happen. The OD light will come on, then five, ten, maybe thirty seconds later she decides to shift. I remember Thrills had this issue a few days ago. Once it is on, I can turn it off with the button instantly, it is just the engagement.

I'm wondering if I didn't put enough fluid into it. I filled it with about 1.9qts of Mobile 1 ATF. It only requires 1.75qt, but I added more because I knew some would come out when I got it full on my slanted driveway before I got the plug back in (which it did). Could I of OVER filled it?

Any ideas? David-F, Stan A??

Thanks.

p.s.
The button itself works flawlessly, and I took the console apart just to doublecheck everything was tight and operating anyways.

HWoods

Time to install a Richmond Gear 6 speed Scorp!!!

scorp508

No! :hat

Don't you worry, she'll be good as new as soon as I figure out why.

L98Terror

Sorry can't help

GRX

The Richmond is great, but it does have some annoying gear hum! I'm sure the 4+3 is repairable.....maybe a bad OD solenoid? :flag


[Modified by GRX, 5:52 PM 10/9/2001]

scorp508

We'll be sure to find out. It's still "working", just not on demand like it should. I think I'll try another flush/fill of fluid this time on level ground and see if that help any.

thrills

Uh OH!! This is bad!!! :eek: I said my light DOESN'T come on until the unit engages, the whole thing does not turn on right when i hit the switch. It sometimes takes a while, but when the light comes on it engages. When I had some problems last year (which changing the fluid fixed) somone told me that if the LIGHT comes on but the unit DOESN'T engage then it might be a problem with the unit :( :( :cry I hope you figure it out!!

88L98

6 gears are better than 4 besides, who really needs an OD in 2 and 3 anyways?

IBEAM700

Im with the Richmond 6-speed peeps. Trash the 4+3 :smash:

8388

My 88 Callaway had a similar problem about a year ago, I fixed it by dropping the valve body in the O.D unit and cleaning it well, one of the valve had gottin stuck, this can very easily happen right after fluid and filter change .


[Modified by 8388, 10:25 PM 10/9/2001]

scorp508

8388,

Would you mine going into a little more detail? I have no idea what the valve body inside an auto tranny is. :D Being my daily driver, I have to be able to R&R all in one afternoon.

This morning on the way to work it worked perfect 90% of the time, but then the last stretch it acted up again.

8388

If your problem is the same as mine was, cleaning the valve body should do the trick, if your car is a convertible you have to also remove the x brace and of course this will add to R&R time, basically remove the pan as you would to change the fluid/filter, remove the filter and you'll see the small head bolts that hold up the valve body, if you've never done an auto transmission, you might want to give yourself more time, upon removal of the valve body be extra carefull as there is a gasket that can tear, you must pay close attention to the removal process since you'll want to use the reversal to put it back together also I can't remember but there might be a check ball, and you'll need to remember its location for the re- installation I use tranny grease to hold the check ball in place for the re-install, once the valve body is down ( you must find a fairly dust free enviroment to do this) you'll find pins that have to be pushed out in order to remove the piston like valve, before pulling out the valve move it back and forth, pay attension to the travel distance, its been a year but if I recall the valve in question is the middle valve, but if your like me you'll want to go thru all of them since your there, I use carb or brake cleaner spray to do the cleaning, make sure that you put everything back together coating the parts with tranny fluid, while the valves are out look to make sure there is no burr or marks showing excessive contact, if any carefully remove them. If you've never done this before, you might want to find a day in which you have plenty of time to do this, P.S. you may want to flush out the fluid lines while your at it, not a fun job, I use a combination of tranny fluid and compressed air.

Good luck.

ZylaRace

The valvebody is what you see when you drop the pan. Because it is either ON or OFF, it is rather simple.
Don't tell me you don't have a factory service manual by now!
I'd suggest looking at this soon. If the valve sticks or if the seal has torn, there is the possibility that you get a half ON/OFF condition. (Partial engaugement) This is how these units burn up.

If you leave the unit disengauged ALL the time, this will cause you no harm, and will get you to the weekend.

Basically unbolt the unit, inspect it for obvious damage (Seals, springs,..), make sure all the valve do move (be gental). If all looks good, reinstall (don't know the torque settings off the top of my head, but you have a manual right!). Fluid color should be the original bright red, (but you knew that, right). Fill her up, get the air out of the lines, test run it.

BTW Not enough fluid will cause this No/Slow engaugement. (But you knew that) :crazy:

If the problem still exists,.. It is time to tear the OD apart. :cry :cry
(I'll presume you checked the OD electrical. It is electricall operated ON/OFF)

scorp508

Thanks a million, guys! :yesnod: Yes, I have just about every version of shop manual for my car.

What is the best method for getting air out of the lines?

When I changed the fluid/filter the other day, the only method of filling it back up was using one of those little $15 pumps that you fill with it, jam a tube into the fill hole, and then push the fluid into the pan. Any better ideas? The car was not perfectly level at the time.

This really doesn't sound all that hard as long as I just go slow and take note of how it all goes back together. I'll be sure to do this when dad is around, he has lots of tranny experience.

8388

Scorp, you really need to refill the O.D unit with the car level, what I do is fill then drive the car a few miles than check and fill if needed, this should also clear any air pockets.

scorp508

Ok, 8388, I'll do my best to get it level. I couldn't use our level back driveway as it had just been repaved and I can't jack anything up on it. I had to use the front one which is slightly downhill. It should be good to use this weekend though. I'll put he front up on ramps, and the back up on jackstands. The fluid should come just to the bottom of the fill hole, correct?

I just logged onto Alldata.com and was reading about 700 R4 issues and found this one which seems that it would apply to the 4+3 also....

Symptom: No shift/Incorrect gear engagement

Hidden Residue Build Up - Valves Sticking

PROBLEM:
After rebuilding a burnt 125, 200 C, 200 4R, 700 R4, and with new fluid circulating for 10 to 100 miles of transmission use -- valve stickage occurs.

CAUSE:
Inner cavities (as pointed out) build up a residue which, if not flushed out, will gradually loosen up and float into the valve body, causing valves to stick.

CURE:
Flush, until only clean solvent emerges from the piston supply holes.


Also

From the following picture, I will be dropping #43 down from the unit in it's entirety? Te torque values are given in the diagram also. Sorry for the size...

8388

If the black top is fairly fresh you'll want to put some ply wood under the jack stands.
My O.D unit was redone by S&K, its got the red clutches in it, I was told by them, not to use synthetic fluid maybe for my application I don't know for sure, but I can tell you when I engage the O.D look out it hits hard.
Also they have recomended that O.D not be used unless the vehicle is traveling at least 50mph, they claim that this is where the pressure is adequate for engagement.

scorp508

Yup, standard practice no matter what at my house. :yesnod: Hmm.... I'll see if the guys at gearzone.net have anything to say on the fluid. As far as 50mph, that is about what I normally do also. I tend to cruise "in the 10s" I like to call it.

00-19: 1st
20-29: 2nd
30-39: 3rd
40-49: 4th
50-xx: 4th/OD

I only use OD in 2nd or 3rd typically if I'm going to race someone from a roll to take advantage of the kickdown.

ZylaRace

Getting the air out,.... just run it. The pump in the trans will circulate the fluid from the pump thru the cooler, then back into the trans.

I run Mobil1,.... never been a problem. (I have never seen these "red" clutchs, so I can't comment.)

Romeo Barrera

You can get new Viton 0-rings while you're cleaning it. Just make sure that when you take the valvebody apart that you don't lose the check ball that is spring loaded. You can also shim the one of the springs with a washer for more positive shifts. I upgraded my 84 OD to eliminate the TV cable and the kit inlcuded the Viton 0-rings as well as a washer shim for more positiive shifts. I'm thinking that installing an inline spin-on filter is worth the trouble to help eliminate smaller debris not caught by the stock filter.