Bruce

After installing the new optic box Delteq sent to me free of charge. It solve the misfire problem. The car pull awsome, 3rd gear like I was on ice.

I don;t know about any of you turbo guys out there. But I find that the engine bay are extremely hot. Hot enough that really really worry me.
I was on the way to gas station, while driving I see a lot of smoke coming out. So I pull off the road and attempt to turn the car around to go home. I am sitting at the red light waiting for a green light. Smoke coming so bad that I could not sit in the car. So I reverse the car and pull to the side of the road and open the hood and see fire is burning in the header area. Not just little fire, I means ****kking fire in there. So I quickly shut the hood and take off I gone thru the red light and rushing to get home and put the fire out by spraying water to it. The fire appear to start from the header wrap. Good thing is my house was only about 1 mile away. If I am far way from home I would have watch my car burn to death today. Because I did not have a fire extinguisher with me.

I am going to remove the turbo, I don't feel comfortable with that my heat in there. go back to NA and will go back to supercharging. Possibly a F1 blower.

Damn it I just order the MS system today to. Well I will keep it for the blower. Rick did not know about this yet. He is out of town for camping. This is a expensive experiment for me.


Bruce


Bruce

TONYDEE64

OMG Bruce I am SO sorry to hear this.... I was in a car that caught on fire once and had to sit by helplessly and watch it burn to the ground all because my buddy did not have a fire extinguisher. I went to Lowes and bought the largest Extinguisher I could find. I ALWAYS keep it in the car and would never ever leave home without it. As a matter of fact mine accidentally went off last weekend in my car and absolutely went everywhere. It looked like the police had dusted my car for fingerprints. I spent five hours taking the seats out and cleaning everything top to bottom... and yes, my first trip was back to Lowes to buy a new extinguisher. I hope things turn out well for you. I have to tell you the "Heat" was the main reason I did not do turbos and went with the blower. I know many many people have successfully gone with turbos... but man.... that heat...Sounds like you had a valve cover or oil leak somewhere...I hope it didn't do too much damage...

Bruce

Tony
I made it home speeding and go thru stop sign. No electrical main computer wiring harness damage. I just got lucky that I was not far away from home. Or I would have watch my car burn to the ground. I am going with a F1 and up blower. I can make my own bracket and all. I am checking out two Procharger on ebay now. One is a D3 blower and the other is a F1A.


ps the heat in the engine bay is insane. I have complained to Rick a few times but he does not seem to concerns about the heat. When it is under boost heat can be any where 1400-1600 degree that really worry me. Again others, C5 and mustangs guys people they don't seems to have any complain about heat.

Bruce

TONYDEE64

So even though your turbo is in the rear you still have that much heat? Wow...that is insane.....!!!! Yep, fire is absolutely my worst fear. I don't worry about wrecking or getting sqeezed by the fuzz, but fire is a whole different matter. Oh yes, I was also riding a motorcylce (street bike) when the carbs caught on fire and then the rest of the bike was toast.. Burnt my legs pretty good... Fire=Bad....

lcvette

Bruce..

man that sucks dude... I am not a fan of header wrap at all... were your pipes ceramic coated? and what level coating was on them if they were? I have heard horror stories of header wrap catching fire from having oil spilled on it.. naturally aspirated too... I would think that a ceramic coating on some thick walled tubing, at least 16 gauge would have been fine if you were able to isolate the heat using aluminum with ultra high temp heat shielding.. header wrap is a huge no no in my book. just make sure that none of the pipes are too close to anything else that may be flammable. have any picture of where it happened?

let us know man!

Chris

mn_vette

Bruce,

I'm really sorry to hear that you're giving up on your turbo project. I'm sure someone on the board would be willing to pick up the system from you for a reasonable price to help offset your costs.

I was watching a video of a dyno run on my turbo setup last night and I noticed in one spot my headers actually glowed red! These are mild steel, but coated inside and out with Jet-Hot's black 2000 degree coating. I'm working on getting them converted to I can post them up,

I'm definately going to see if I can get a fire extinguisher after your mishap. I can see the exact same thing happening to me if I'm not careful. Thanks for the heads up and good luck with your blower.

Bruce

Any of you guys still have the stock cat?? wanna sell? I need them because mine were cut up we were using a portion of it for the turbo. One guy on the perfprmance/tech section just throw his in the dumspter after he has long tube header installed. Damn I just miss it.

Brian
I am not sure I want to sell the kit to any body since it is custom and will have to remove many things to get the turbo fit there. If some one still insist he wants it. Than I will sell it cheap. Other than that I am going to sell piece by piece. I have list the turbo on the turbomustang for trade for a Procharger and cash.
Brian if you want the cross over we can trade for your cat. My cross over are 16g(.049 thick 304 ss) and a portion of it were my cut up pipe of the cat that also stainless.

Here are thing can be sell
Very nice B&M oil cooler with build in fan and thermostat
awsome 3 phase diaphram oil pump
Water to air intercooler (good for 900hp)

tjwong

Damn Bruce that SUCKS! I am not a fan of header wrap, I have found too many instances where if there is any hint of oil leakage. That stuff soaks it up like a sponge, then combine that with extreme heat and now you got a big problem.

Sometime ago I was riding my dirt bike up on Mt. Taylor in New Mexico. I came across a guy and his truck that was on fire.....I hualed azz back to my truck to get my extinguisher, it took me about 4 minutes to get to my truck and back to where he was. In that time the fire had doubled and tripled in size, my little extinguisher was like p***ing on a bonfire! I had my trusty two way motorola with me so we called the local FD down the mountain for help, the forest service also showed up as well in about 20 minutes, but in that time the truck had more or less been totally consumed. I mean it was so hot that the alumnium water pump melted. After they towed the hulk off a few days later there was still puddles of aluminum laying in the dirt, I was amazed as to how much was consumed in the fire.

Bruce

I thought my car is finished when I saw the fire in there. First I was panic and than I made a quick decision to drive the car with fire buring. I gone thru traffic lights and stop signs just to make it home to get the water hose out. I had small fire in there in the pass when I had a rag in the engine bay near the header area and it caused fire.

Bruce

STL94LT1

Bruce, I'm sorry to see you giving up on your turbo project. You were so close to making some really big numbers.


-Mike

8388

Before you give up, get rid of the header wrap. Look for a better design in heat shielding, and find a way to get the engine compartment to ventilate as you drive, this will help big time with the heat soak and under hood temps. On one of my cars, I fabricated a ram air set up utilizing (don't laugh) vacuum cleaner parts I bought at Home Depot. I get the air from the air damn via a vacuum cleaner hose routed over to the header and blower area. I had to find a way to get cooler fresh air to the blower air intake filter. The set up is similar to that used to feed ventilation to the front brakes.

Bruce

Mike
No doublt it is making nice hp there. The new otpi box Delteq sent make a big difference. In 3rd gear it will break tires loose all the way to red line, like I was on ice. With the old delteq opti box I can barely breaking loose because it having misfire problem. But I am not totally out of the forced induction yet. Just a costly experiment between Supercharging and Turbocharging. Certainly there are thing I like and dislike on the rear mount turbo. A F1 blower in the future for me and I can design a nice and more reliable 8 ribs setup with 1" thick alumimun plate rather than a normal 1/2" thick. A spring tensioner will be bolting on the plate (Like Vortech does) The spring tensioner I had before were bolt into the head and 1/2" alumimun plate. This I wil use my turbo wastegate to control max boost.

Bruce

HJV11

So let me get this strait, you have invested all this time and money in this turbo system, that IS making the HP you want, and you are giving it all up because you left a rag near the headers and it caught fire?

I am curious why you have excessive heat in the engine compartment with a rear mounted turbo, but it seems like you are throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

Bruce

No I was compared a small fire I had before caused by a rag left in the engine bay. This fire was not caused by a rag. it from the header wrap and the extreme heat the engine bay that I did not like. It supposed to be less heat because it is a rear mount. "WRONG" When yyou compressed heat air, it will beocme hotter and heat up all the piping thru out the engine bay.

As I have mentioned above. It is a very expensive experiment for me. I sold my D1SC blower setup and my complete B&B and Dr. Gas X pipe all for $2500

The turbo cost?? $4973 for Rick labor cost, that is include about $1400 worth of used parts from Rick. and on my end I spent about $3000 that I bought parts associate with turbo stuffs. And a lot of hours spent under the car.

I am go back to supercharging and that I can make and fabricate everything and install by me. Free labor.

Bruce

HJV11

I misunderstood about the rag, I thought it was what started your fire.
My opinion is there is something SERIOUSLY wrong with your setup. If you think for a second that your underhood temps , with a rear mount turbo, should be more than a S/C motor of equal HP you should re-evaluate the information you have been reading.
To address the compressed air theory do you understand how much you would have to compress air to get the pipe hot enough to start a fire? The "compressing of hot air is not your problem. My trubo sits 3-4 inches away from my hood, my pipes are T304 SS and I have nothing coated and have never had anything catch on fire. Believe me I have tried.
http://videos.streetfire.net/Player....D-AC5D391F08E3
And BTW I have since removed the headerwrap from my downpipe because I see less heat soak after I turn the car off without it.

Bruce

Beautiful day here in Rochester and I have not drive the car today. It sits in the garage. I am not going to drive it again until I am goin out get a fire extinguisher and keep it in the car. I did like the power it make though.


\Bruce

AKS Racing

There is a large difference in the install within a C4 of the F1 series and the D3 series. I have never installed a D3, but it is the next step up from a D2R. That blower does not fit without some MAJOR underhood mods. I would suggest either a F1 or D1R (though not offered in RR), as they will deliver the flow, and not require for everything to be modified.

Best of luck,
Aaron

ANTI VENOM

Rick, please come back and talk Bruce down. He has finally snapped. Bruce, get a fire extinguisher and try some deep breathing for the anxiety. Give yourself some time to think before making any rash decisions that will cost even more! You have been an inspiration to those of us that are sitting on our arsses not getting our turbo projects complete. Good luck with your decisions!!!!!

mn_vette

I think this should be a little more about lessons learned than anything else. When you get into your first car accident do you stop driving after that? No you learn from it and try to avoid the situations that cause it.

This is with the VNT turbo setup right? Maybe Rick needs to make some adjustments to lower the back pressure to prevent heating at some rpm spots. Just a thought.

lcvette

I agree... with the turbine as far back as it is, unless the tubing your using is like 18 gauge or something super thin it should not be getting that hot.. 1300-1450 degrees should be about the max of the actual EGT's the steel should not be absorbing all of that and should be a little bit lower in temperature. also normal driving should not be producing much more heat then a standard stock engine in the exhaust system only when under load... what camshaft are you using? and perhaps your cam timing needs to be tweaked or your ignition timing.. if you are completing the burn in the primaries... it will make any header hot... I had a customer whos cam timing was off a tooth and it cause his headers to glow cherry red from the combustion continueing to be lit off in the headers... having your timing to far retarded can also be a cause of this.. do you have any pictures of the system outside of the car for us to take a look at?

let me know.. i think the excessive heat could simply be a tuning issue, maybe even a bad injector stuck open dumping fuel.. or an entirely too conservative/rich condition along with not enough timing. a combination of these things would seriously have that effect on the heat in the headers. also off the top of my head I cannot remember which cam your running but one with too much overlap can also blow raw fuel out the exhaust on FI cars.. this will also give you the same symptoms!

Chris